Army officer sues Virginia police over violent traffic stop

its not a pay day for a law abiding white man to debate the police

they will become multi millionaires

 

You may not have noticed, but we aren’t discussing “thousands upon thousands” of others....we are discussing the particulars of THIS incident. Explain how he was supposed to obey two conflicting instructions...!

And yes, it would take a genius to do that...or a Houdini manoeuvre...

 

granted black men have a tough time with police, they do not like orders because of culture?

mind you everyone else does not have this luxury of getting paid millions like floyd.

its not fair and they should not set bad examples to other Americans.

 

There is nothing different in this stop. If he would have exited the vehicle when first ordered out of the car, you would have never heard about the story.
Is this really that confusing?

 

Perhaps people in those cases weren't recording the stop, trying to antagonize the officers so they could run home and post a Youtube video that took six months before he got the result he wanted.

 

yep.

 

This Article presents findings from the largest and most comprehensive study to date on violence against the police during traffic stops . Every year, police officers conduct tens of millions of traffic stops . Many of these stops are entirely unremarkable—so much so that they may be fairly described as routine . Nonetheless, the narrative that routine traffic stops are fraught with grave and unpredictable danger to the police permeates police training and animates Fourth Amendment doctrine . This Article challenges this dominant danger narrative and its centrality within key institutions that regulate the police . The presented study is the first to offer an estimate for the danger rates of routine traffic stops to law enforcement officers . I reviewed a comprehensive dataset of thousands of traffic stops that resulted in violence against officers across more than 200 law enforcement agencies in Florida over a 10-year period . The findings reveal that violence against officers was rare and that incidents that do involve violence are typically low risk and do not involve weapons . Under a conservative estimate, the rate for a felonious killing of an officer during a routine traffic stop was only 1 in every 6 .5 million stops, the rate for an assault resulting in serious injury to an officer was only 1 in every 361,111 stops, and the rate for an assault against officers (whether it results in injury or not) was only 1 in every 6,959 stops

https://michiganlawreview.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/117MichLRev635_Woods.pdf

Not to mention that the Supreme Court has held that an officer who stops a vehicle as part of a routine traffic stop has the authority to order the driver to exit the vehicle, as well as to order any passengers to exit the vehicle.

 

I am sure it would be very confusing for you. Best of luck out there.

 

And this guy should have too but what we are creating is a system where if you don't want to be arrested or even written a ticket well you just to have to be, tell the officers to take a hike YOU don't think YOU did anything wrong therefore you can't arrest me and I don't have to fully your lawful orders.

Well pretty soon the police won't bother to enforce those laws and take those chances and just let people go.

 

Yep, just continue to ignore the question. How predictable.....

 

Tell you what, I will send you a grand worth of bitcoin if you can show a video of you taking off your seatbelt and opening your car door while at the exact same time holding both hands outside the window of your car.

 

He was first told to put his hands out of the window first. At 1:10 of the video he was ordered to open the door and step out of the vehicle. For the next 4 minutes he was told to get out of the car 42 times. When he said he had to unbuckle his seat belt they said fine, unbuckle your belt and get out of the car.

So after 42 commands to get out of the car, he unbuckled his seat belt and got out of the car. Had he simply complied the first time and got out of the car, he wouldn't have been pepper sprayed or thrown to the ground.

Now does that explain it for you or do you think he (or you) couldn't follow any other command after being told to put his hands out of the window. Even after 42 commands to get out of the car.

 

He was first told to put his hands out of the window first. At 1:10 of the video he was ordered to open the door and step out of the vehicle. For the next 4 minutes he was told to get out of the car 42 times. When he said he had to unbuckle his seat belt they said fine, unbuckle your belt and get out of the car.

So after 42 commands to get out of the car, he unbuckled his seat belt and got out of the car. Had he simply complied the first time and got out of the car, he wouldn't have been pepper sprayed or thrown to the ground.

If he was able to follow the command to get out of the car by unbuckling his seat belt after 42 request to do so, do you think just maybe he could have done it with the first command?

Now does that explain it for you or do you think he (or you) couldn't follow any other command after being told to put his hands out of the window. Even after 42 additional commands to get out of the car.

 

So now you’re going to resort to lying......again, how predictable. From 00:17 through to 1:30, he has both of the officers yelling at him, one telling him to leave his hands out of the car, while the other is yelling for him to get out of the car. Those two commands are contradictory and are made repeatedly.

I would invite anyone here to watch the video again and to judge for yourself the honesty being used in Condor’s argument....

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...lack-army-lieutenant-during-virginia-n1263731

Edit: please note I have edited the start time.

 

I saw what you saw. The conflicting commands probably become even more stressful when having loaded guns in your face held by individuals who appear to be mentally unstable.

 

And from 1"30 to 5 minutes he is told 42 times to get out of the car. Which he finally unbuckled his seat belt and got out.
If he was able to follow the command to get out of the car by unbuckling his seat belt after 42 commands to do so, do you think just maybe he could have done it with the first command?

Is that what it would have taken for you? 42 more commands over 4 minutes before you could figure out how to unbuckle your seatbelt and exit the car.

 

No, because he had also been ordered, MULTIPLE TIMES, to leave his hands out of the vehicle...! Why do you persist in just ignoring or lying about that simply demonstrated fact....!?

He didn’t have to “figure out” how to unbuckle his belt....as he attempted to explain to the officer, he was fearful of reaching back into the car. And how was this met...? “Yeah, you should be [scared]…!”

Try dropping your biases for just a second and place yourself in his position:

He is pulled over, knowing that he has done nothing wrong. He is immediately confronted by two screaming policemen who are aiming their weapons at him. He is alternately told to “put your hands out the window” and “get out of the car”, two commands which are impossible for him to obey together. He receives threats such as “you’ll ride the lightning” and “you better be [scared]”. All this with not ONE word of explanation as to why he has been pulled over. Can you not see why he would be frightened and confused...?

No, of course you couldn’t......

 

Another far right libo who claims to not be one.

 

Earlier in the thread someone posted a video of a white man shooting the cop dead. The cop had been polite the entire time as he requested the various documents they request at all traffic stops. The cop was shot dead.

In this case we have a cop stopping a soldier because he didn't spot the temp plates, at gunpoint and threatening him with death. This is reality, you go back 50 years and you have black comedians talking about this. Here's a good list of blacks talking about it https://www.essence.com/celebrity/comedians-on-race-police-brutality/

At no point did the officer inform the Lt of why he was being stopped at all let alone why he was being held at gunpoint but the officer did make multiple death threats. When your very first words with a person holding a gun on you, when you have committed no crime, are he is going to kill you, you have every right to be concerned, even frightened of this unstable person with a gun pointed at you.

The real irony? More cops are killed by white people than blacks every year.

 

Right, he was so scared he was able to fiddle with his camera to record it. He was so scared he told the officers there was no reason for him to get out of the car. He was so scared that when the officer unlocked the door and started to open the door he used his elbow to close it again.

But when that pepper gas hit him in the face, all of a sudden he understood and got out of the car. Didn't he.

 

You seem confused. Nobody is talking about Michael Brown. I correctly pointed out that nobody has any legal obligation to follow an unlawful command by a police officer.

 

this is a strawman. I never claimed you can assault anyone. I correctly pointed out you can defend yourself from unlawful detentions and assault from a police officer.

the law supports it. I'm sorry you are pining for a communist authoritarian police state, but americans won't let you.

 

irrelevant. it is there to be seen, and the officer saw it.

of course I have. We can clearly see how well lit the area is. The tag is perfectly visible under the legal amount of tint on that window. Its why the lieutenant did not receive a citation and has not been charged with anything, and why the officer is unemployed.

 

I'm sorry you were incorrect, and had to be corrected.

 

no they didn't.