The bulk of these rioters were young people. They were not protesting against the shooting of one man, or even interested in what had happened,they were simply opportunistic thugs and criminals who took advantage of a peaceful protest to loot for their own ends. They did not care whose property the destroyed or whose lives they put in danger. Cameron says they will face the full force of the law, well lets see if he means that or if it will just be the usual slap on the wrists. Nor do I buy the 'Deprived Kids' theory. If this country was not so determined on political correctness and making excuses for criminal behaviour, and if the punishments for this were an actual deterrent,these situations might not occur.
There an excellent gif of some scally in Birmingham getting absolutely cleaned up whilst trying to break some windows
UK is teetering on the brink of new wars. Suffice it to pop up some ideologist to add some political issue to the rioters and the British Government ill find it very difficult to calm down the streets. BTW something like that is going on in Sweden!
I can't believe Highlander quoted a David Icke link. Riots continue and over night they spread to other cities in England. Manchester of course, Bristol, Birmingham, Liverpool, Nottingham. It hasn't spread to the other UK countries yet, though a 16 yr old was arrested here for posting incitement on Facebook. Econ, it is common in countries where the poor and unemployed and people generally lacking in economic opportunity (temporarily for all you know) have rights - the right to be economically represented and to have society work for them as well as for the filthy rich. Where they are aware of their ability to stand up to the controlling class. Where they are not about to be dumped on by capitalist rats, as they are expected to do in other countries. I don't agree with their methods regarding violence here, but if they are being dumped on they have the right to speak up about it and peacefully tell politicians to do something for them. Of course in this case that may not be what they're purposely doing ...they just look like stupid kids rioting and looting because they can. It remains to be seen if there is any political motivation or if it develops into such. From what the boy in this link says... http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/14465188 ...it looks like just neds version of entertainment. Of course it's not a laugh, nobody else is laughing. But people are now organising groups to defend their area and this is going on: http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/14471824 Btw Austrian what lifestyle do you think they had before, that they don't have now? They had nothing. They still have nothing. Yes, they've withdrawn things like EMA support for academic students and closed some schemes, but EMA only existed for the past 5 years and schemes always change when Government changes. Other benefits are being restructured, but those people who really do want to live off the State have always found a way around the system and they will find one now and continue as before. Trying to defeat that is an almost pointless exercise unless opportunity is available for them to do something more productive. And the majority of cuts are a pointless exercise. I read a document recently which showed a particular restructuring cut will cost £97000. This is 5 years after they last restructured the same thing at a higher cost. Meanwhile, because they are relocating and the people who need access to the service will be forced to travel for it, the costs for unavoidable transport will go through the roof and costs passed to other business areas will far exceed the original cost. But although it had already been restructured, someone globally declared cuts must be made. To tick the boxes, the managers moved things about a bit to shut them up and in the end everything will remain the same because the service was necessary and is still necessary and will have to be rebuilt as soon as the global cutters' focus is redirected. Just as the Police are necessary and numbers can't be axed. All it takes is one incident like this and the Police are top of the pile again. As to the rioting, it's not like we haven't seen it before. The Conservatives are back in power with their usual politics of "people don't matter unless they have a billion in the bank" so unrest was bound to restart and we better get used to it, because it's only the start of the predicted season of discontent.
Initial findings from the IPCC Other reports say that Mark Duggan drew his weapon during the attempt to arrest him. That just isn't the modern Conservative way if it ever was! Are we just supposed to pay through the nose forever to keep criminals at bay? Not that the Conservatives have any intention of cutting the burden on the taxpayer if their policies are anything to go by. I want the Conservative Party of this anecdote back again:- I was talking to a friend's little girl, and she said she wanted to be Prime Minister some day. Both of her parents, Labour, were standing there, so I asked her, 'If you were to be the PM, what is the first thing you would do?' She replied, 'I'd give food to all the homeless people.' 'Wow - what a worthy goal.' I told her, 'You don't have to wait until you're Prime Minister to do that. You can come over to my house and mow, pull weeds, and sweep my driveway, and I'll pay you £50. Then I'll take you over to the supermarket where the homeless guy hangs out, and you can give him the £50 to use toward food.' She thought that over for a few seconds 'cause she's only 6. And while her Mother glared at me, the little girl looked me straight in the eye and asked, "Why doesn't the homeless guy come over and do the work, and you can just pay him the £50?" And I said, "Welcome to the Conservative Party, sweetheart."
Was that in question? I thought the question was if his gun was fired. I am assuming the Police saw a weapon and that is the reason they fired on him. I don't think they can be criticised for that, a Bruni can be converted and they can't wait to be shot at in those circumstances. Oh I know, Conservatives are the New Labour now We could imprison criminals and represent non-criminals who are making a legitimate political protest. Bingo. At least not the lower paid taxpayer (after this initial nod to keeping the voters on side). The old ones are usually the best, but not in this case. I don't want the Conservative Party back ever, under any circumstances. Nobody in Scotland wants them. Can you please dissolve the UK union so we can be governed by a Party the majority of us voted for? And not one none of us voted for? How is that for representation?
That remark wasn't directed at you, or anyone else in particular, but to hear some people talk he was an entirely innocent victim. Well they're certainly not a party that supports a small state ethos with the freedoms that go with it. Politicians are too soft. I'm all for supporting legitimate political protest, but the people who represent the protestors need to persuade the rest of us that they can represent what's best for the majority. Not the middle classes or most of the working classes either. Scotland can have its separation from England anytime it wants it. You know that and we in England don't have the power to dissolve the union. The English want a real Conservative party back, not the fakes in office now.
Of course. People were also angry at the lack of information from the Police. I think they still have not mentioned whether the man presented the gun. I think that would be key for me. How are they not? Have you missed the rioting public servants, whose jobs are being decimated? Or did you miss the Big Society? Has freedom been tested yet? The rioting yoofs seem to have been free enough... The minority has a right to representation too. And the number of people who are unemployed is growing, so even more so at this time. The majority always takes care of itself. I don't know if you've noticed, these people are dripping down into the non-working "class" and not through choice or any fault of theirs. That political lobby is a growth area. Some people are never happy
I'm going to dig it out and watch it at the weekend. It was on the other night, Mrs Doyle cracks me up...
First off.. their rights do not extend to destroying property of business. Business that could in the future provide them a job. To excuse that shows the stupidity of the youth and even those on the left that defend this, sorta like you are now. Secondly.. who's the youth standing up to? The guy who owns the corner market. They are placing their "rage" towards the hardworking self employed person. Not the "Capitalist Rats". Thirdly.. this kind of hostile attitude towards companies and employers make them want to leave. First thing you do if you want business to come back is be friendly towards them, not justify violence against them. There is a reason why places in Europe and the US aren't recovering and that's cause it's a hostile business environment. It's the main reason why I sold my business in the first place and it's the same reason I won't start up another company. Don't be surprised if a couple of companies mention laying off people to reduce workforce in the UK in the next couple of weeks. If I was the CEO of Sony, I'd tell you lot to bugger off and force you to export from Ireland after you excuse them burning down a distribution center. Cause you lot excuse a kid openly stating he'd be selling (*)(*)(*)(*) on the black market to make money. No taxes would be paid and he'd could still claim the dole. Think about that.. It's double dipper. From the TV they are clothed and not starving cause they would have been dead.. so I am pretty sure they are better off then most kids in the 3rd world despite your socialist woe is me. 5 years is long enough to get accustom to it. So they still do have something. Blah, Blah.. your welfare state is failing just like everyone else get over it. You are so predictable. Guess you missed the riots in 2001 in which one race went after another race cause they saw them as freeloaders taking their money. You also forget history.. the riot during Thatcher era and Cameron era followed recession caused by Labour Party leadership as the economy in the UK collapsed on Labour Party watch not Conservative. These looters and rioters are greedy as Capitalist.. period end of discussion.
Now .... now.....I was of the same opinion until I look at David Icke site...Look again before you leap to any conclusions! An open mind and all that! As for the riots...why is it happening at all? Something isn't right...UK, Spain, Italy, France, etc! Mmm.....The torys are back in power......doing what Thatcher only dreamed of doing! Yes very frightening! Regards Highlander
That's true, but I haven't forgotten history. The UK has collapsed because both the Labour and Conservative Parties both drove it to collapse. The Conservatives barely opposed anything the Labour Party did, even committing themselves to matching Labour's ruinous spending plans for most of the time they were in opposition and can offer only weasel, mealy mouthed excuses in their own defence. They couldn't get a working majority because not enough people believed in what they say. There's a popular conception that "they're all the same" for good reason. Even now, for all their talk of "robust policing" and "cuts" I don't know anyone who really expects things to change for the better. Mrs Doyle was priceless. She had all the best lines. I miss Father Ted.
And I don't disagree but what voters look at is what comes after the name.. Conservative party wasn't in power and could throw whatever against the wall and not be held responsible.
I hold the Conservative Party partly responsible. They were the official opposition party, for which we paid them several hundred thousand pounds each year, (as we now pay the equally vacuous Labour Party for the same role now) and they simply did not fulfil their role with anything like enough effectiveness. Since they could not perform that relatively easy function, it was reason enough to see them as being unfit for government. Mainstream parties no longer operate on an oppositional basis, except in a pantomime, playing to the gallery fashion. We now have disguised consensus politics amongst them. The Conservatives cannot run away and pretend they don't share the responsiblity for the mess this country's in, nor was everything perfect when Labour took over. Major was worse than Thatcher (who was herself not with major faults in judgement), Blair was worse than Major, Brown was worse than Blair, and Cameron isn't looking any better than Brown so far. I wish I could say that I lived in hope, but I don't.
On the one hand Europe has ceased to be a society of equal opportunitis. Opportunities are equal in name but acces is selective. Very. On the other hand new generation keeps living in a consumation society that hypes up consumation. You guys are entitled to do everything to rattle a profrit. So it's imminent to have guys asking questions why all these nice, beatifil things pass beside us? Free market system doesn't work any more, parlamentary tricks are a complete biased hypocrisy! No wonder new Hunns come to surface!
Aye Highlander, something isn't right, and that something is that the youth of this country, for the main part, are completely lacking in discipline, and I am sick of hearing about the deprivation among teenagers. God knows, when I grew up during and after WW! we were all short on the things we would have liked, we were all deprived of many things, but one thing we were not deprived of was discipline and that began in the home. It was continued at school and we were taught to respect the law. Many of us came from poor homes and suffered deprivations of some kind, but we grew up and worked hard for all the things we wanted. There was few state handouts in these times, in fact I think the only one was 'Dole money' which was paid to the husband.
I wonder what is going to happen in the future with kids who are not raised by their parents. I mean families, where the parents work and kids are raised by childcare. What is that disconnect going to produce? Anyway, waiting to hear what the social and employment demographics really are for the rioters. We were assuming they are unemployed youths but your man there disproved that at least once, as he is a Teaching Assistant.
Highlander you can't open your mind to that kind, we're still waiting for Arran to fall to the deluge he predicted... Of course something isn't right. The global economic "system" is only working for one small, greedy sector of society and not everyone has failed to notice this. Some people are even acting on it. The plans they are carrying out have been pending for years. The economy has just given them opportunity to deploy.
I'm not sure anyone has a right to be angry, except perhaps Mark Duggan's family, and if he was a drug dealing gang member, maybe, just maybe, he wouldn't have been in a position to be killed if they'd been more angry at him. The key for me is whether the police officers felt their or bystanders lives were being threatened. Either way, they (his family) have made it clear that they don't support the rioters and I'm grateful for that. Also, maybe if the rioters had been as angry at gang members killing rival gang members and dealing in drugs, the police wouldn't need to use the tactics they do. Did you miss the high taxes, the CCTV cameras, the European Arrest Warrant, the lack of free speech, the officious state officicials in the form of council officers spying on whoever they choose, the social workers taking away people's kids on the flimsiest of pretexts? The rioters should have been free only until they caused criminal damage, but it seems the justice system will (*)(*)(*)(*)(*)foot around them. And which rioting public servants do you mean? And the Big Society was and is nothing more than a cheap empty gimmick that never had a policy attached to it. The minority has representation. It has the right to choose MPs just like the rest of us. If you know how the lot of the minority can be bettered, please do tell. We discovered that throwing money at the problem only widened the gap between rich and poor under the last government and made everybody else poorer, and if the majority was taking care of itself, it wouldn't be in the mess it's in now. Have you noticed that people dripping down into the non-working "class" are not doing so because of any fault of the working class or middle class, but it's them who end up picking up the bill. I'm suprised the government doesn't just take our pay packets and give us pocket money instead. Oh, I'd be happy with a government which didn't stab the people in the back. I see the swearing filter's going into overdrive. When I said "(*)(*)(*)(*)(*)foot" the censored bit was just a word for a young cat.
