Insured 20 year old man stuck with $11,000 hospital bill

Private + non profit is almost an oxymoron.

That would most likely be government.

 

And that is EXACTLY what they do when taxes on the wealthy are lowered. The wealth DOES NOT trickle down.

Exactly, you are paying for someone else's health care.

 

That is complete BS. There are countless banks that have failed due to the fact they mismanaged money, There are countless of small businesses who have failed because they have mismanaged money. There are several great examples of fortune 500 companies that have shut their doors because they have mismanaged money. Then of course, uyou have several hundred thousand of people who mismanage money each and every year and file bankruptcy to relieve them of those mismanaged mistakes.

Mismanagement of money is not based on a singular entity, political ideology, or family heritage.

 

Nope, already proven false.

Single-payer is cheaper in every scenario, projection, and EVERY COUNTRY that uses it.

Conservatives, come up with a better argument other than generic "the government is inefficient"

 

At that time, there were two regiments of regular army. But whether it was regular army or militia, it was still an army that was led by George Washington.

It is easy to create, it is much harder for that creation to continue. The Articles of Confederation did not live up to the task or to history's judgment because it failed miserably.

 

Typical. How did it fail exactly?

 

It didn't give enough centralized power to the Federal government. Ironically, that is what conservatives prefer.. little to no central government. It didn't give the Fed the power to TAX or ENFORCE laws.

 

By every measure you suggest above our federal government would be a failed bank, small business, fortune 500 company.

Cheers
Labour

 

In other words, it didn't give the Federalists enough power over the States. Not quite what I would call a disaster but at least that is an argument.

 

The Constitution fixed all the problems of the Articles of Confederation where it was very simple to divide and conquer on the simplest of tasks. With no central form of government to bind the individual states into something more, the articles failed on its own weight where to defend the former colonies was challenged by a simple whiskey rebellion.

 

No try again.

Private enterprise and individuals are just as capable as being a failure at managing money as the government. However for the government, that failure is laid upon the feed of Congress and the President. It is the individuals within the government at are at fault, not the entity itself.

 

This is so warped on so many levels it's hard to know where to begin. You've got all your allies rolling in the aisles with gut-splitting laughter, so obviously they were not your actual intended audience... which means, really, you're saying this for other Americans to opiate themselves on.

Anyway...

So, you're letting your own people die from lack of medical treatment so your allies can use all the medicine?

Or are you trying to say that you've spent so much on arms, that you can't afford to buy yourself bandaids?

You mean like if Canada had not shown you insulin, or if the UK had not shared penecilin, or if Mexico had never shown you the birth-control pill, or if France had not let Pastuer tell everyone about microbes or if they had never shown you blood-transfusion or modern-dentistry or cataract-surgery or the stethoscope or the hypodermic-needle or neonatal-incubators, or if South Africa had never shown you a heart-transplant, or if Germany had never shown you aspirin or adhesive-bandages or x-rays?

Other than trauma surgery, the only thing you're really good at is finding ways to keep making it more expensive over time, instead of improvements making things cheeper with time (which is how free-enterprise is supposed to work), in order to boost shareholder profits in medical-device industries.

Actually, what you lead in is trauma treatment, because of all your violence. Other nations are doing stuff like palative care etc. better.

No... I'm comparing you to your own d*mn allies. Americans can't take care of themselves as well as their allies can, such that the allies all have longer life expectacies. Criminy, even marginal "allies" like Costa Rica have lower infant mortality rates than the US.

In the first place you've leaving out India, and Brazil, and Indonesia, and Japan, etc., and in the second place, what does population size have to do with quality and/or cost of care? If you've got a large population, you should be able to get volume discounts on medicines. Are you saying any nation is required by international law to build, say, a maximum of 100 hospitals, such that countries with small populations have an advantage because their 100 hospitals only have to take care of tens of millions, whereas your 100 hospitals have to take care of 100s of million?

Read above.

Really... then how come you send med students to Grenada?

Then don't. The cold war is over, and the only people stressed about keeping American fingers in every pie are American multinational sharholders and financiers.

Perspective... okay... so, you're spending so much money taking care of illegal aliens that you can't afford to take care of people actually born in the USA.

Check out the cost of premiums in the other first world nations. Some of them pipe it all through the government, but some of them make it pay for itself, with the only proviso being that everyone has to enroll. It's having everyone on it that brings the average cost down.

Haha. In the first place, the cold war is over, so what does Canada have to defend? Invaders colonizing the arctic? If a bunch of Mexicans or east Indians wanted to set up shop in the far north and build self-sufficient communities, Canada would be glad to see them try... it would boost their northern claim.

Anyway, here's what you're saying:

- You think you've spent all the money doing all the medical research, and then you gave (not sold for a profit) that medical technology to your allies, such that it didn't leave you enough money to afford to use your own technology, so you have to let Americans die from lack of care because you gave all the medical technology away.

- You spent all your money on the army, so you can't afford to pay doctors.

- There's a rule saying countries can only build so many hospitals, such that past a certain population, that limited number of hospitals has to take care of more-and-more people per hospital, so you're penalized by having a larger population than England et al.

- You've spent all your money giving medical care to illegal aliens, so there's none left to treat your own people.

Keep it up... this stuff is priceless on foriegn commedy networks.

 

About research the UK, Swiss, French and other nations do medical research so your issue is it will end that is unlikely. In fact most baseline research is paid for by the US government in our country the same in most other nations.

 

I don't think getting doused with Sarin nerve gas is considered "free medical care" but I could be wrong.

 

Requiring banks to make stupid loans to people who the banks knew wouldn't pay them back... that is a Clinton thing. It is called the Community Reinvestment Act. Of course it was done to promote "racial equality" which in the liberal mind means holding minorities to a lower standard.

I'll ask again madison... why do you and other liberals hold minorities to a lower standard?

 

False premise. Single payer is an administrative fix. It does ABSOLUTELY nothing to lower the cost of healthcare. It's also not proven to be more cost effective than private insurance administration once the actual cost of collecting the "premiums" is figured in. Lefties tend to forget it costs money to collect taxes......

With Medicare alone bleeding out 60 billion annually in fraud, I have little to no faith in the state administering well... anything.

It really comes down to whether you want the government to give away your money in fraud or an insurance corporation making a profit.

I can invest in an insurance corporation and actually make money off it.....

 

Really? Even if the modest increase is still less than your insurance premium? Got to admire a guy for sticking to his principles...

- - - Updated - - -

Of course you have the option of not paying your taxes-being the principled man that you are. After all, what's a few years in jail when lofty principles are involved, eh?

 

The government does the base funding because no company will do raw research, they will only do say gene therapy when its at a point they can make money on research leading to a treatment.

One issue is some drugs are not trendy or makes money easily antibiotics are vital and we need new approaches and not one US company is doing it now since Bristol-Myers Squib shut down their program the best in the nation. If the government won't fund this who will?

 

This sort of thing is very common in the United States, and never happens in any other developed nation.

 

What the hell?

What does the Community Reinvestment Act got to do with any of this? Although the act was originally signed into law in 1977, there have been changes in 1989, 1991, 1992, 1999, 2002, 2005, 2007, 2008, and 2009. For a majority of those changes. the GOP either controlled the house, the senate or the presiedency. In 1999, , the GOP controlled both chambers, but not the presidency. In 2002, 2005, and 2006, the GOP controlled both houses AND the Presidency. In other words the Community Reinvestment Act was not the primary culprit when banks failed.

So, you want to try this again?

 

Yes. 60 hour a week study/in class time. 16 credit hours a week and 3 hours a week per credit hour. I got all my gen eds out of the way in community college and did not take a single blow off class. All of my classes were advanced computer science courses. I spent roughly 3 hours per credit hours studying or doing homework. I worked MUCH harder in college than I have all of last year working full time in my field.

 

Family of four deductible under Obamacare $12,000 at double the premium as many are finding.

 

Who told you that? Glen Beck? Lush Limpballs? Or did you just make it up on your own?

That's so totally ridiculous that I'm laughing as I type this!

 

I went to my state exchange and the premiums were 4 times what I'm paying, the out of pocket and deductibles are double.

The only winners appear to be the expanded Medicaid recipients and JUST WHAT WE NEEDED...... Another 4 million Americans we have to provide healthcare for because they're incapable of paying for it like EVERYONE else.