The independence of Cataluña from Spain: What do you think about?

I think Carolina will remain two states of the USA personally

 

Autocorrect and can't edit one someone replies.

 

OK I would expect an independent Catalonia to be a republic. Though I think should Carolina be an independent state then it should be a Duchy

 

[video=youtube;HRDFXOS6r7U]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRDFXOS6r7U[/video]

 

I fully support Catalan independence as I think any objective person does. Also love FC Barcelona.

 

The problem is only a minority in spanish People support the independence and a minority can not be imposed throughta coup d ´Etat a majority

 

That's not a problem at all, its completely irrelevant how many in Spain support it, only how many in Catalonia.

 

Not only it is relevant.. but decisive.

 

If the Cata;unyan people demand independence and a majority vote for it then the rest of the country is pretty irrelevant. When scotland Voted for independence the rest of the UK had no vote.

why would you want to stay in union with them if they dont want to be in union with you?

 

Scotland and Catalonia are not matched. I don´t know how is Scotland exactly... but I think it is a sovereign kingdom (the Kingdom of Scotland) voluntarily united to England to consist the United Kingdom.
Catalonia is not a kingdom, it not a sovereign state (and it never was). It is a constitutive land of Spain, as Lincolshire for England... Catalonia was part of Spain from the Ancient time, when the roman stablished the province of Hispania and Tarraco (today Tarragona) was the Capital of Hispania... and it was Spain when the Visigoths stablished the kingdom of Spain (Spanaan, Ispanian, Espanna etc etc). During Middle Age... the Spanish Mark (Hispana Mark) was stablished by franks... and the county of Barcelona united to the Crown of Aragon in XII Century and united together the Crown of Castile in 1479....
By other side, I don´t know how much intense has been the demographic marriage between Scotland and England... but Catalonian population is the Spanish population...Everybody in Catalonia (as mostly out of catalonia) have roots from other places in Spain as in other places in Spain have origins in Catalonia...
So Catalonia is a part of Spain from the origin of the Spain... I don´t know if Scotland is the same.
From XII Century, from 14 kings of Aragon... 8 get married Castilian wifes...another 11 aragonese princes married Castilian wifes... and the last 4 kings of Aragon were Castilians! Aragon wanted the union to Castile from many centuries... to come bak to the Old Gothic Kingdom of Spain. .and the union was stablished in 1479 (each kingdom, province etc with their own insittution as in the rest of Europe.).

The only way to split Spain.. it is the Spanish People in referendum decided Catalonia would be an independent country.

"them" "you"... it is the same people.. not different people... It is not Ireland and England.

 

I'm afraid not, you simply misunderstand international law. All that matters is if a majority in Catalonia support it. What the majority in Spain think is completely irrelevant.

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That's a good question actually, wonder if you feel the same about Scotland and England. Scotland clearly doesn't want to be in union with England, even after two years of the most disgusting scare stories daily a majority of Scots voted yes and only English residents and pensioners who had been lied to about threats to their pension swung it to no, why do you want to remain in a union with Scotland then? Is it cause we have all the oil?

 

Yeah, I think you are projecting your own scotish situation to this to much.
What you are saying is a defence for the integration of Danzig to Germany from Poland in the 30's, whose inhabitants wanted to be a part of Germany rather than Poland.
Are the allies on the wrong side of history here?

 

The allies were on the wrong side of history in a lot of respects, allying with Stalin for example, the bombing of Dresden. Winston Churchill was a massive racist who called Indian people 'beasts' and said they deserved the famine the UK deliberately caused which killed 29 million of them.

Its a simple matter of fact that all nations have a legally protected right to self-determination, so if Catalonia wants independence Catalonia is entitled to independence, regardless of what Spain wants. And Catalonia does want independence, so its only a matter of time till they get it.

 

No, you know perfectly sel-determination is not applicable (have you read my other post). No Catalonia (land don´t have opinion... not even a rock in Scotland... have you ever talk with "Scotland"? No.. And Catalonian are Spaniards... and Spaniards don´t want their country will be split.

And Remember... South Carolina also wanted the Independence in 1860... Today, 2015, South Carolina is a State in the UNION.

Do you remember? The people of the State of South Carolina, in Convention assembled, on the 26th day of April, A.D., 1852, declared that the frequent violations of the Constitution of the United States, by the Federal Government, and its encroachments upon the reserved rights of the States, fully justified this State in then withdrawing from the Federal Union; but in deference to the opinions and wishes of the other slaveholding States, she forbore at that time to exercise this right. Since that time, these encroachments have continued to increase, and further forbearance ceases to be a virtue.

And now the State of South Carolina having resumed her separate and equal place among nations, deems it due to herself, to the remaining United States of America, and to the nations of the world, that she should declare the immediate causes which have led to this act.

S.. not only a "matter of time"... You can go to South Carolina to ascertain if South Carolina is a "Separate and Equal nation"....

 

gizmo perhaps you have some actual evidence that it was English settlers and pensioners who caused the independence vote to fail? These are hard;y enough people to match all your scots nationalists. Personally I couldn't care less whether you stay or go but if you do go then you take you portionj of national debt and you don't get a say on the pound

 

29 Million..yes of course actually its 3 million but don;t let facts get in the way

The 1943 bengal famine was not caused by Britain deliberately or otherwise.

The Bengal famine was caused by massive flooding and tidal waves in the bihar area in late 1942 which devastated the rice crop. Bengal had never been self sufficient and was dependent on rice from Burma. Burma was occupied by the Japanese who tool all the rice crop to feed the Japanese army

Now what anti british (*)(*)(*)(*)(*)(*)(*)s seem to avoid discussing is that the provinces such as Punjab had democratically elected regional governments (actually they are generally ignorant of this, will tell you its not true then when you provide evidence run away like the little cowards they are) Punjab's native elected assembly actually voted do ban exports of food from Punjab which could have gone to Bengal

SO the causes of the famine were the Japanese and bad weather but the failure to releve the famibne was from the government of Punjab which was Indian elected

 

Let Catalunya be FREE!

 

No Catalonia should remain part of Spain. I see no reason for their Independence.

 

its up to the people of catalonia, nobody else in the end.

 

Obviously they do and ultimately its them that have the choice.

 

I agree. As a general principle, I am in favor of allowing one group of people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to establish their own system of governance.

 

Spain's attitude seems to be like a a Husband who won;t let is wife divorce she wants to leave and he says 'I dont agree' she leaves anyway

 

I see no reason why Madrid should rule over the people of Catalunya, especially when its king was hand picked by Franco who was Hitler's lap dog.

 

The turnout figures range from late 30's to early 40's % on the 2014 referendum, so you can't say "obviously they do" as Obviously there is no evidence that they do...

 

people who don;vote's opinion doesn't count.