PBS Official: Repeal The Natural Born Citizen Clause To Avoid Birther Controversy

You are welcome to your opinion.

 

Not so quick... you have left out most of what the good Senator Trumbull actually said. Here's the rest of the story.

In other words... if you think that the children of foreigners born on American soil are not citizens, then Lyman Trumbull believed that your birther interpretation of "subject to the jurisdiction" is bull sh*t.

Thank you Senator.

Nope. Agreeing with Senator Trumbull that the children of foreigners born on US soil are natural born citizens, the US Supreme Court is explicit on that.

They wrote:

US v. Wong Kim Ark

It continues to suck to be a Birther.

 

So we're done arguing Obama rejects Americanism and intends to replace it with his own?

I love this.

I really do.

 

Hey look at that. It's not Obama saying anything at all. It looks like one web site quoting another website... neither of them quoting the President or even paraphrasing anything the President ever said.

What better source can you get than that?

One that actually quotes Obama.

 

See why the birther argument bores me? It leads to much bigger and better things. You just have to cultivate it, and, voila, out she comes.

You end up with, "Obama's an American, and who cares if he's not, or if he wants America to be something other than what it really is?"

 

Reagan set out to, and he did.

Bush Sr. did as well, and he did a little bit.

Clinton set out to and he did as well.

Bush Jr. set out on personal agendas and has never had any tangible interest in America past using it to gain and keep power.

Obama set out to transform America and he has to some degree.

Most people who are involved in politics set out to transform America, either INTO something better or BACK to what they believe was a better way before now, and they do whatever they can to achieve their goal.

Now, what were you saying?

 

First of all, I have to ask: where did you get that Jon Meacham is a "PBS official?" This isn't true.

I think it's unfortunate that this is part of the constitution because if it weren't I would be fine with such a rule being removed. Otherwise, that it is part of the constitution gives me pause.

When Schwarzenegger became governor of CA it occurred to me that if he turned out to be a great leader it would be America's loss that he would not be allowed to be elected to Presidency. That's a simple notion, nothing sinister there.

Given how government is constructed and how power is spread and shared and with the office of POTUS being really just a piece in a greater machine, I don't see the danger of letting someone born in another country be elected President. We also always retain the power to remove that person, which exists as a safeguard.

Also, given that America was and continues to be built by people who come from other countries, and given that the most American story you can write is to come from a far away land with nothing and do whatever you want and create however much wealth you are determined to build, there is a distinctly UNAmerican ring to the idea that someone born in a far away land cannot be President.

The OP and most of the comments in this thread wind up being fear-based hyperbole, the worst side effect of which has been a completely ruinous demonstration of people's understanding of a) what the law defines as natural born citizen, b) what Obama's citizenship status is, and c) that Congress already determined that he fits the requirements to gain office, doing so by examining the votes and his certificates (this was done in January following the election).

Furthermore, some have referred to the new law in AZ as being a potential problem for Obama. Point in fact, the Secretary of State for Arizona has indicated that the COLB that Obama holds along with the accompanying certification from the State of Hawaii is adequate to meet the new AZ law. Also, the law just passed in AZ will actually - as written - allow any group of Arizona citizens to potentially case extreme problems with the ballot. Most importantly, AZ is not capable of enforcing the new law outside of what the U.S. constitution indicates, and said document indicates that all states must accept each other's official documents. Guess what? Obama's COLB is an official document of Hawaii because their Department of Health certifies it.

This issue is only for people who are ignorant, bored and don't have a real issue to talk about.

 

Define "Americanism".

This oughta be good.

Trench

 

On the contrary, you seem quite taken with the birther agenda. I'll bet you even know the secret handshake.

Trench

 

the question has always been 'why is this being withheld?' It goes back to obama either being afraid of the verified contents or he is pulling a Saddam hussein in holding back information to taunt and gain public sympathy. Just in time for the election he'll suddenly release this doc and teary-eyed in clintonesque form will say 'I've always been honest and true and the right wingers are just mean.'

 

How could you possibly owe an allegiance to another nation for simply being born on their dirt? Expecting allegiance from a newborn baby is unreasonable. Therefore I submit that there are no natural born citizens.

 

Very good point and in fact I don't think even the British Royal family have a "natural born" clause - except you have to be one of them - otherwise you can be born anywhere you want to be. Mind you I sometimes think the Royal family WISH there was such a clause so they could disown each other but still................

 

It's my understanding that even Obama cannot get the original birth document. Evidently it is a record for the hospital, not for him. I may be wrong and am too tired to search on that.

I think he has been smartly advised by WH cabinet and lawyers that if he responds to this kind of demeaning idiocy then he will set a dangerous precedence for the office of POTUS. It will open the door for anyone to make wild accusations and demand proof to the contrary; such a condition would range from inappropriate to financially expensive for the government to even dangerous, and would open said office to having to respond to increasing baseless attacks. In short, it's not about Obama but about the office. I for one agree with this.

Otherwise, if I were Obama, I would find it politically efficient to not respond since not responding drives conspiracy theorists nuts and makes them more and more vocal. This pitches them on a path of increasing paranoia and eventually results in political suicide. Our latest example is Trump. Why would Obama respond and put to rest a subject that does so much work for him?

It's all folly. He's an American and was confirmed by Congress who examined the electoral votes and his certificate.

 

Teddy Roosevelt?

 

Fail #1: It would be far simpler to settle the debate by producing his long form birth certificate than it would be to hold a Constitutional convention.
Fail #2:

How does "President Schwarzenegger" sound to him?
/John Meacham snacked on way too many paint chips as a toddler.

 

You are, in fact, wrong. He could very easily obtain it if he had any wish to do so. For whatever reason, he has decided (or been informed) that it is more politically advantageous to keep it buried.

 

I'd suggest it's those xenophobic nativists who have no use for Americanism. There is no tangible shred of evidence that Obama was not born here. The manufactured Birther conspiracy shows how much these loons hate what America is all about. Real Americans see right though the Birthers, and understand that it's their hatred of anything that doesn't meet their white European ethos.

At Obama's birth, his mother was an American citizen, by birth, and his father was a legal resident, here on a student visa. Contemporaneous news clippings of his birth announcements show he was born in Hawaii. State certification of live birth show he was born in Hawaii. Those are solid documents. It was enough to satisfy the government enough to issue a passport. The fact that Chief Justice Roberts swore him in, affirms that he was convinced Obama met the Constitutional criteria.

What is it the Birthers have aside from unanswered questions and demands for extraordinary documentation that's none of your business. If Obama were white, had some English traditional name, and all other circumstances were similar, this would never have come up.

But keep it up. You've got friends in the GOP who are willing to pander to your insanity. That's good news for real Americans.

 

Metaphorically speaking, it's the rope with which he's allowing you birthers to hang yourselves.

I think he made that pretty clear this week.

He'll go on focusing on his job as President, the economy, jobs, foreign policy, budget issues, etc. Meanwhile, as they continue to beat the birther drum, the Mike Huckabees, Michele Bachmanns and Donald Trumps of the Republican Party will continue to look like buffoons to liberals, progressives and moderates.

Trench

 

Thank you for confirming the falsehood presented by the OP

 

*looks over shoulder*
"You birthers"? Are you talking to me?

"Birthers" claim that Obama *doesn't have* a long-form Hawaiian birth certificate, remember? That's why they call them "birthers". You must be getting your well poisons mixed up again.

 

Actually, no. That has never been true. It was not true in the very first Birther case filed by Phil Berg, and is not true now.

Birthers claim a motley assortment of often mutually contradictory theories all of which attempt to declare Obama ineligible for the presidency on the basis that he is not a natural born citizen. There are at least half dozen different theories, only one of which actually has anything to do with his birth certificate.

 

Speaking of being "mixed up", "Birthers" claim that Obama is not a natural born citizen (whatever that means [shrug]).

Whatever birth certificate he produces would be irrelevant; even if he produced one signed by God Himself, they would still cling to their claim.
.

 

They would say God's sig is a forgery. The Birthers keep on building the biggest strawman in the history of mankind.

 

None of which has anything to do with me, as I have never made any claims like that. Seems to me the anti-birthers like to cast their nets (and aspersions) a bit wide.
All *I* said is that he could acquire and release a copy if he chose to do so, but has chosen not to; a statement that you have never disputed yourself if memory serves.

 

That would just prove to them that God is in on the conspiracy.