A thread to discuss HOW AMERICA WON THE WAR.

Like maybe areas of desert land around Bunkerville Nevada and the Bundy ranch? Area which has a high quantity of valuable mineral like magnesium? An element used in Tomahawk missile fuel.

Or maybe because of an intersection in the middle of nowhere, built for some reason no one yet has been able to explain. Could be a new underground facility like area 51.

Or it could be new site for NSA, since we all know that the NSA facility shown to the public is just a front. They would never reveal NSA hard target locations

Or it could just be a secret real estate deal with secret society members. To be exposed at a future Congressional investigation into Harry Reid when the impeachment process begins against Obama for authorization of drones to shoot at American citizens deemed to be "Domestic Terrorists".

 

I really like the bolded idea. There was this white building close to where I live that had NO sign on it. No idea whatsoever being given of what was being done there. They finally put one up though. Said they were making some gum nobody I know has ever heard of. Uh-huh, sure, somebody must have realized it looked suspicious.

As for the NSA, of course that really huge building off away from everything is the actual headquarters of the most secret organization in the world, that makes SOO much sense. I just wonder what they really do with all that space

 

This whole thing about the NSA and Germany's ANGIE...really is curious.

EVERYONE knew including all European Leaders that the NSA has been recording all electronic transmission and communication occurring anywhere on or in or above Earth since the NSA started running software created by IBM called ECHELON.

LINK...http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECHELON

Now Germany KNEW this was happening yet for some reason Angie started acting like this was news and acting like she didn't know.

OF COURSE SHE KNEW!!!

AboveAlpha

 

With regard to the intersection: Now that it is has been discovered by the public viewing the Bundy standoff, the Federals will certainly install an electronic traffic light w/camera so a ticket can be sent by e-mail to whomever wanders out that far.

 

It was designed to keep certain lovers of HOW AMERICA WON THE WAR contained within a sandpit which diverted them from derailing every other thread they ventured upon with tales of how AMERICA WON THE WAR. As the OP clearly says.

I don't think it worked.

 

(My bold)

No to the first - look up the % of men/military relative to the total population the USSR, Germany, UK, Italy, US, Japan, etc. provided. You'll find that the US - while the % of men translated to a good-sized force - never provided anything near the total mobilization of men that Germany & USSR called up. Casualties are similar - our forces did better relatively than others because our men were better fed going in. Look @ the differential of UK soldiers in Japanese captivity v. US soldiers. Our people were not typically malnourished - for several years - going in. Thus, if they could keep up their morale, discipline & learn to eat pretty much anything - our people survived - if barely. Lots of the Allied military & civilians were already suffering from bad or scanty diet - they were easy prey to endemic disease, malnutrition, bad/protein-poor or nonexistent rations, the lack of medical care, the lack of sulfa drugs (this latter was true of UK even after the war - George Orwell died from lack of antibiotics - he could have been cured relatively easily in the US.)

Yes, the US economy was saved by the late entry of the US into WWII - we sold everything to everybody. Food, finished goods, raw goods, motors, cars, trucks, agricultural, meat, dairy. From Sept. 1939 - & really from 1936 - the Spanish Civil War - Europe convulsed & built up military stocks, troops, etc. This stripped the farms & manufacturing of labor & capital.

The US grew rich from exports & internal improvements to facilitate shipping - roads, harbors, railroads. Ultimately, I think it was a bad model for US industry - we got used to selling everything everywhere, without thinking sufficiently about maintaining marketing leads by improving the product, or making it cheaper/faster/better. But that's the story of the 1960s - 1980s.

 

And yet, without Russia's involvement the allies would have been just as (*)(*)(*)(*)ed. It's quite correct to point out that the US provided resources and armies that were crucial to victory, but so did other nations.

In any case, I don't see why you should take pride in it anyway. You should have never got involved. The Progressives pulled a quick one over the American people with WWI, then did the same with WWII.

 

For the sake of some future historian, should they find this sample of text buried in the rubble some 1000 years from now on some fragment of computer hard drive, I, an American citizen, would like to say at the present time of this post, in the year 2014, that WW3 has been averted so far. We do not know how much longer we have, but for the present time, no nuclear war has happened.

If you, the historican reading this, have found remains without any traces of radiation, then our civilization may have been destroyed by the Bird Flu virus, which some of our scientists in the USA decided to experiment with and created a mutated version of that virus which is 10 times stronger, and for which there is no known cure at this time in our history.

There is also some possibility that human life was destroyed on earth by some asteroid that was projected by our scientists to just miss earth in the year 2025. There is also a global climate change occurring which is melting our northern ice pole. We also are still increasing our population by 2 billion people about every 20 years, so we may have died from consuming all the resources.

Should there be any form of time travel technology developed in your time of 3014, please do attempt to send anyone back to help us.. We are still a very primitive and violent culture, and you probably will get killed, or worse, contract a virus that will kill off your people. Some of our people still think the earth was created in 6 days, and some of our scientists have an alternative suggestion that the Universe was created from nothing. So you can see, we are a very confused civilization at this time in earth history.

 

It's a matter of how they're used and not the number.

I'd like to know your reason for that.

Neither were British soldiers but all soldiers were underfed whilst in Japanese captivity.

No that's not true although to be fair it did affect peoples growth. But when people had used up their ration cards they simply went down to the local chip shop because we did produce an awful lot of potatoes.

No. After the war the NHS was founded and healthcare actually improved.
And Orwell died from tuberculosis which even today can still kill you irrespective of where you're treated.

No most countries didn't invest in the military prior to the war.
And Britain as being the only player left was the only one that actually rearmed and you couldn't actually join the services if you were a farmer. This is something that was applied even in WWI.

 

(My bold)

I'll pull up the quotes, I think they were from NEMESIS: THE BATTLE FOR JAPAN 1944-45 by Max Hastings, published by HarperPress. See - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/columnis...nant-treatment-Allied-PoWs.html#ixzz2zLKbVGmq

& as I recall, everyone was underfed by the IJA, including the Japanese frontline troops themselves. Given Japanese attitudes towards POWs & captive civilians, these groups were last in line for everything - food, medicine, medical treatment.

 

OK. I'm not actually refuting that and the IJA was known to be hard on it's own soldiers so that doesn't surprise me.

What I was saying was is that you said that British troops were underfed even before going in battle and in this instance; captivity and I don't believe that this was the case

 

These people send little probes out to distant planets, dwarf planets and even smaller bodies regularly these days. I wouldn't be too worried about their predictions.

 

And btw, which war are you talking about us winning? The war of 1812 where our vanquished foes burned down our Capital? or the Vietnam War, where the ignominiously defeated enemy chased us and our allies off of rooftops and then renamed Saigon as Ho Chi Minh City?

 

If you knew your history then you would know it was the UNITED STATES who sent envoys to the various European WWI Victorious Nations and told them that if they did not quickly reduce the WWI Reparations that Germany had to pay out as penalty for starting the war....that as a result....GERMANY WOULD AGAIN FIND ITSELF SWEPT UP IN A NEW WAVE OF NATIONALISM AND ONCE AGAIN EUROPE WOULD BE AT WAR!!!!

We saw that average German's were starving in the streets of Berlin. German's could not find jobs and unemployment and inflation ran very high and unchecked.

Basically the European's had placed so high a level of war reparations upon Germany...the average German Family had NO HOPE.

The United States and it's envoys DESPERATELY attempted to call this reality to the attention to Britain and France and other victorious WWI Nations and we were responded to in a manner such as both British and French Government officials telling us that we were too young a nation to fully understand the dynamics of the politics involved in Germany.

Well...we ALL know what happened.

The FACTS as that without the United States as well as without U.S. Resources and U.S. Daytime and Nighttime Bombing runs....Britain would not have been able to hold out without such U.S. resources and one of the tells of this fact is the number of built U.S. Cargo LIBERTY SHIPS.

Here is a report written by the OXFORD COMPANION

U.S. Merchant Marine in World War II

One way to understand the Second World War is to appreciate the critical role of merchant shipping... the availability or non-availability of merchant shipping determined what the Allies could or could not do militarily.... when sinkings of Allied merchant vessels exceeded production, when slow turnarounds, convoy delays, roundabout routing, and long voyages taxed transport severely, or when the cross-Channel invasion planned for 1942 had to be postponed for many months for reasons which included insufficient shipping....

Had these ships not been produced, the war would have been in all likelihood prolonged many months, if not years. Some argue the Allies would have lost as there would not have existed the means to carry the personnel, supplies, and equipment needed by the combined Allies to defeat the Axis powers. [It took 7 to 15 tons of supplies to support one soldier for one year.] The U.S. wartime merchant fleet. . . constituted one of the most significant contributions made by any nation to the eventual winning of the Second World War....

In the final assessment, the huge US merchant fleet... provided critical logistical support to the war effort... The Oxford Companion to WORLD WAR II.

Oxford Companion to WWII is a book series published by Oxford University Press which has made an assessment that without the United Stated entering WWII Nazi Germany and the AXIS POWERS would most likely WON WWII

This following statement was written by the Oxford University Press.
The U.S. wartime merchant fleet. . . constituted one of the most significant contributions made by any nation to the eventual winning of the Second World War.

Over 2700 U.S. Liberty Cargo Merchant Ships were built during WWII which moved MILLIONS UPON MILLIONS of Tons of cargo and supplies to Europe and the Soviet Union and without these resources the Nazi's well may have won.

AboveAlpha

 

I explicitly said that the allies would not have won the war without the US. But neither would they have without Russia.

 

OK...sorry.

Without Russia not winning the war?

Let's see.....Germany certainly would have had a lot more man power and weapons systems to counter any Western Front Attacks.

D-Day Normandy Invasion would have had to be planned in a different fashion as the Allies would be going up against a much larger force.

But if anything a greater number of American KIA's would have sped up the development of the Atomic Bomb.

If anything such a war would result in the worse case scenario of the U.K. being invaded by Germany resulting in a virtual stalemate.

But eventually Berlin would end up being a smoldering Nuclear Wasteland.

AboveAlpha

 

The Nazis were smart chaps. Chances are they would have figured out how to build a bomb themselves soon enough. Also, you pretty much bluffed Japan. At the time of the bombings they weren't easy to make and you didn't have a good enough supply for them to be much more than a tool for terror. it wouldn't have been possible for some time to bomb both Germany and Japan into submission.

Makes me glad all the allies jumped in through - to think of a prolonged nuclear war.

 

I dont think D Day would have happened at all - If the Allies had been really determined they might have bought Churchill's Italy plan. But definitely nothing through France

- - - Updated - - -

No the Germans would never have achieved the bomb

 

Seems like an easy statement to make given the course history took.

 

Well it has been shown that Germany was not even CLOSE to making a Nuke and if anything a war where Russia was not in to take on Germany from the East would if anything vastly increase the budget of the Manhattan Project.

This would of course shorten the time to development of the Nukes as well more than 2 Nukes would most likely been planned at first.

One thing is for certain...History show us that by 1945 with history the way it was the United States had 25 Million Man Military...a huge number of Tanks and Artillery....a Navy with over 20 Carriers and hundreds upon hundreds of Ships....Bomber and Fighter aircraft to escort them all the way the distance to Berlin as it is said that Herman Goering was in Berlin and looked up to see a daytime U.S. Army Air Corps. Bomber raid with B-29 bombers being escorted by many P-51 Mustangs....the head of the German Air Force said..."We have just lost the war."

People have to remember that U.S. Bombers were responsible for destroying huge numbers of Nazi Factories building weapons and replacement parts and especially ball bearings something the German Army could not do without.

If such Bombings had not taken place their is a good chance that Hitler might have made it to Moscow.

AboveAlpha

 

Germans were not allowed to use or study Jewish physics.

Aside from that it is doubtful Germany even had the economic resources

 

I actually prefer stories from natural born Americans on how America is a loser and they are Swedish. Oh and popcorn.