The US Supreme court and every single legal dictionary disagrees with you. That is not analogous to a normal pregnancy. Give something analogous to a normal pregnancy and I will happily answer your question. Yes, especially since NO human being has the constitutional right to kill another human being that is not threatening their life. I do not think a fetus is a person, I KNOW it is one. Further you and I are not capable is living on the inside of another human being so your "point" is both moot and invalid. - - - Updated - - - Oh really? Show me explicitly where the SCOTUS declared that an unborn is not a human being? This should be good...
The best way to STOP abortion is to make it illegal to do. You are not really truly interested in seeing abortion stopped, you are just too afraid to state your position openly which is that you favor allowing ONE human being to kill ANOTHER human being for no better reason than convenience.
Such a silly statement. Once again, pregnancy is not analogous to slavery... BUT Abortion certainly is in much more ways than just ONE. - - - Updated - - - Legally, you are not allowed to just kill your neighbor just because you feel like doing it and it is convenient. Try doing that and see where you end up. I believe they allow you ONE phone call from your prison cell.
One does not need to communicate in order to have rights. One also doesn't need to exercise rights in order to still possess them. The ability to think, or talk, or walk are not what makes you a human being. Issues don't have genders. How do you respond to a woman who makes the same argument that I do? - - - Updated - - - Why should anyone have the right to decide to kill another human being that isn't threatening their life?
No, I haven't adopted...but then, we haven't killed any of our children either. Whether or not I adopt is irrelavent to the fact that unborns are human beings and have a basic right to live in exactly the same way as slaves were still human beings who deserved to be free whether I ever owned one or not. My human rights aren't being violated but that doesn't relieve me of the responsibility of doing what I can to assure that other human being's rights aren't being violated. - - - Updated - - - Your suggestion that pro lifers must adopt all unwanted children is a logical fallacy known as a false dilemma. Whether or not pro lifers adopt children does not change the fact that unborns are human beings at any stage of their development and human beings have a right to live.
Ah yes, the third grade trick of moving the goalposts - changing "person" to "human being". Try again, Sparky.
IF the fetus was legally a person then the woman has even more right to kill it in the name of self defense. NO ONE has to allow another person to harm them without their consent. YOU want to take away women's right to defend themselves from injury. Why do you hate women so much ? . Yes, it is even if YOU can't gasp it. IF a woman can be forced to use her body to sustain the life of another than YOU can be forced to use YOUR body to sustain the life of another. That's a ludicrous, illogical answer to ""Does one human's opinion really outweigh another person's rights?"" YOUR opinion means nothing to women's rights. As much as you hate women having rights your opinion doesn't count Oh, gee, wait till the Supreme Court bows at your feet and changes their minds.... If you think it's a person why do you insist it has more rights than anyone else??? You just can't understand it ...it isn't a simple thought, it takes thinking.
Good GAWD! DUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH Forcing women to give birth AS SLAVE OWNERS did is slavery ... That poster was talking about war, you know , how Anti-Choicers don't mind slaughtering inconvenient women and children if they are brown and in another country...WAR....TRY at least to follow what is actually posted.....
As usual you are having loads of trouble with following written English.....the poster I was addressing is a great advocate for adoption. Quote Originally Posted by FoxHastings View Post It would be good to know how many of these posters who are blubbering on about adoption actually have adopted any kids. They think having a kid and adopting it out is so easy peasy....so why haven't they adopted any? It's got to be easier than having one....don't they know what their responsibilities are?? Let's sit back and wait for the excuses, excuses, excuses........and there they were , right on time A fetus is human , it is not legally a person
Criminalizing wife beating doesn't solve the problem of spousal abuse either, and it does't heal the bruises and broken bones of women who are battered. Show me a utopia where criminalizing spousal abuse, murder, armed robbery, child abuse, arson, theft, etc. actually stops the activity.(*) If you are going to argue that a thing need not be criminalized unless the law is going to prevent a thing from ever happening again, then you are arguing to strike all laws from the books. Criminalizing a behavior isn't about stopping it. It is about providing a means by which to punish those who disregard the rights of others and do it anyway.
EVERY pregnancy carries the risk of death. EVERY pregnancy causes physical damage to the woman's body. YES, a person can kill a person who is harming them without their consent especially if they FEEL their life is threatened.
Care to provide a statistic that supports your argument that abortions are performed in self defense? Last time I checked, the vast bulk of abortions were being performed because the woman didn't want to have a child because a child would interfere with her job, or her life style, or she didn't feel that she could afford to raise a child at the time. Those are matters of convenience, not self defense. If you are going to make the argument that abortions are performed out of self defense, then I am going to have to ask for some credible evidence to support that argument. If you can't provide it, then I am going to have to insist that you not use an insupportable argument.
Of course not.. which is why the pro abortionists must 'redefine' the unborn as inhuman.. or subhuman, or anything BUT human. It is irrational. it is unscientific, but that is the argument of the pro abortion camp. the reality is that the unborn baby has his own dna, that is distinct from the parents (actually an even combination of them), & has traits that were carried from both family lines. For most of human history, mankind has protected the weakest of the human race.. babies & helpless children. Only in times of moral depravity does a culture turn from this societal instinct, & begin to turn on themselves.. it is cultural suicide, to kill our own offspring, & justify it with some twisted notion of 'convenience' or some other euphemism of self centeredness & willingness to kill our babies. it is a tragic commentary on this nation, the time, & the ideology, that encourages & indoctrinates our youth to believe that killing babies before they are born is something good & noble, when it is the most base & depraved of human culture.
So all women who are pregnant are slaves? Really? Is this what your argument has now amounted to? - - - Updated - - - So all women who are pregnant are slaves? Really? Is this what your argument has now amounted to?... - - - Updated - - - Can you point to which law that declares that a fetus is not legally a person?
I am always amazed at the zeal & dedication of the pro abortionists here.. there are only a few, but they are the self appointed promoters & defenders of abortion as a benign action. Of course, their reasoning is flawed, their arguments hollow & petty, & their ad hominem flows like water. Rational debate over this topic is nigh unto impossible, in this forum, because of the constant barrage of the hecklers & devoted ideologues that promote abortion.
I'm sure you won't understand this but the crimes you noted are crimes because they disrupt society, cause chaos and so need to be curtailed. Abortion doesn't harm society at all. I see you come right out and admit it's all about punishing women for having sex. YOU disregard the rights of women... Now maybe you could explain HOW women are caught, investigated, and charged with abortion. NO anti-choicer has ever been able to do that. Remember when Trump got in so much hot water even from women-hating Republicans for daring to say women should be punished for having an abortion? Even Repugnants don't want that issue brought out publically, how they want to execute or give life sentences to people's mothers, wives, sisters, friends, aunts, cousins and other loved ones..
You are quite wrong here Fox. glaringly so. Can you provide some credible evidence which states that every woman who becomes pregnant has the risk of dying? Try using that argument in court and see how far you get OR where you end up. "Oh judge, I felt he was going to harm me so I shot him prematurely to protect my life" Your arguments have grown pathetic. - - - Updated - - - Can you rationally intelligently defend your position or is musings from the sidelines the best you got? - - - Updated - - - Of course abortion harms society. Over a million human lives are lost precisely BECAUSE of the act which directly harms society.
This is why you will never comprehend. I NEVER SAID that all women who are pregnant are slaves. I guess you HAVE to lie in order to have any argument or rebuttal??? I said """"Forcing women to give birth AS SLAVE OWNERS did is slavery "" Now , can you point out in that sentence where I said ALL pregnant women? No, you can't. DUHHHHHHHHHH Have to be born to have rights.....can you show me the law that says a fetus is a person? - - - Updated - - - You know nothing of what pregnancy entails and cannot show how people who were never born affected society !!
I'll leave you to it. I have spent too much time wrangling with the pro abortion fools, & their inane 'arguments'. IMO, 'rational' discussion is impossible, as they sabotage reason, deflect, distract, & demean with abandon, & will not allow a topical, serious discussion. but you go ahead.. have fun.
The right to live outweighs the right to not be inconvenienced. it is as simple as that. Oh really? Try injuring a pregnant woman, cause her child to die, and watch what happens.... You will find yourself charged with MURDER because you have in fact KILLED a person. - - - Updated - - - Again, clearly you are not capable of comprehending anything. You stated that abortions have no affect on society. I correctly told you that abortion does affect society because a million + innocent human beings per year are killed because of it. OF COURSE a millions human beings dying per year affects society. - - - Updated - - - As you can tell Fox is not capable of rationally defending his position.
That's not my position at all. My position is simple: you can make abortion illegal, but all that will do is push the procedure into the back alleys, where they will be performed by unqualified people. It will not stop abortions from taking place. That is my openly stated position, in case you're interested. The problem is that if pro-life and pro-choice people could agree that it would be a good idea to reduce the number of abortions that take place, maybe we could actually get somewhere. Instead, it's either "make it illegal" or "allow it to be a method of birth control". Neither of these is a particularly good idea from my perspective...
