Burger flippers demanding $15/hr

absolutely.... I remember the wendy's way of cooking a burger..... here's our training video from back in 1992, if you want a serious laugh. FWD to 3:40 mark....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbVDQKcxg00

with that said, yes, I do believe there is a skill set involved... however, that skill set is minimal. You may not possess the skill set right now, on how to cook a Wendy's patty... but with a 1 hour training, you would have it. just like a 16 yo could have it. it's not a difficult skill set to master. You are easily replaceable as a burger flipper.

now, if it took a 6 month training course to teach you how to press a patty.... it would be a little more important to keep trained burger flippers there. I would then have to increase your incentive to stay. I was a beeast at the grill back in the day..... I was the best of the best in my area.... however, I eventually left Wendys to pursue my current career after graduation. The only way I would have stayed is if Wendy's was able to match my pay at my new job that paid a lot more. So why didn't they fork over the cash to entice me to stay? because my skill set was nothing they couldn't replace, at minimum wage by a 16 yo.

burger flipping skill set is very easy to replace. There is no monetary incentive to pay an experienced burger flipper more because the difference between an "expert" burger flipper and a trainee.... is worth only about a nickel an hour.

I remember another Wendy's story as I type this out.

It was when I first started at Wendy's at 16. They put me on "backup grill" working with a grill guy that was training me. I was young and eager to do well (my work ethic has always been there, I think) but I was nervous and very shy too. of course I was doing little things wrong, and the grill guy that was training me got upset and had passive aggressive comments the entire time. One that stands out

Grill expert - "is this your first job"
me - "yes"
Grill expert - "yeah, I can tell"


he then went on at how he's been doing this for xx years and if you want to make it, you have to blah blah blah..... Looking back, it's hilarious because I was getting a career lecture from a 25 yo burger flipper that made .25 more than I did at the time. At this point in time, he's ~47 yo burger flipper probably still trying to lecture 16 yo's on what it takes to be a success while at the same time, demanding that his skillset is paid 15/hour

 

The cost of a double cheeseburger (similiar to a Big Mac) with fries and a soda costs $5.86 at Dick's Drive-in in Seattle and Dick's employee compensation package already exceeds $15/hr.

http://www.ddir.com/menu

Seattle has already passed a $15/hr minimum wage law that becomes fully effective in 2021. Employers are revising their business plans to accomodate the higher wages but the one thing that they haven't addressed is having to raise the price of their products to accommodate the higher minimum wage and, in fact, it isn't necessary for them to raise prices.

Instead of raising prices the best way for the enterprise to accommodate the increase in employee compensation is to increase revenue and every "smart" enterprise is going to focus on that in revising their business plan. The changes in the business plan need to focus on getting more first time buyers and increasing the number and frequency of return buyers. It's not like this is rocket science.

 

Is the difference between a real libertarian and a progressive libertarian is that people like me oppose the government telling businesses what they have to pay people?

 

Well, I for one, do think minimum wage needs to be raised. People need to be able to live and eat, even if they aren't rocket scientists or brain surgeons.

 

live under your means. Food before iphones.

you can absolutely live on min wage.... it's just not as fun as middle-class. If you want a middle class lifestyle, offer a skill set more valuable

 

No, that is absolutely wrong. There are many people who work full time, but they still have to collect some type of assistance from the government, whether that be medical assistance, food stamps or what not.


As I explained to another poster on another thread, what you are actually advocating here is to give business owners the option to not pay their workers enough to make ends meet, and then those workers have to collect assistance, which is taking from ALL of us taxpayers. IOW, because these business owners do not pay their employees a living wage (because minimum wage is NOT enough to pay the bills in most instances), it falls upon the rest of us to take care of these people's medical expenses, food bills, etc.

 

Here is a link for you if you want to see how some people, working full-time at minimum wage jobs, are not making enough money to live, and no, it doesn't include smart phones or other such luxuries either.

http://livingwage.mit.edu/places/2500502690

 

want to turn a 16,000/year job into a 32,000/year job? work 80 hours/week at min wage.


I'm sorry you feel entitled to a 40 hour a week only job. I have a degree and haven't worked 40 hours a week in over 20 years. Must be nice to expect to have a lot of free time and money.

 

work at McDonalds from 7-3 and Burger King from 4-11

I understand that sucks.... but those are the choices you make by not having a good job skill, training or education.

Job a - $8x40 = 320/week
Job b - $8x40 = 320week

640 a week x 52 weeks = 33,280

That most certainly is a "liveable wage"

 

Let's get one thing straight here. We are not talking about me. I think you should apologize to me for your insinuations. You are wrong. People should not be expected to work 80 hours a week just to survive. Stop being ridiculous.

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Another ridiculous assertion. That is outrageous. The fact of the matter is, if you work 40 hours a week, and you don't make enough to pay the bills, then you are ELIGIBLE for social services. Do you get that? IOW, in order to give the employer a few more dollars, you are putting it on the rest of us to take up the slack.

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What you are suggesting is absolutely ludicrous and should be considered slavery. Working 80 hours a week with no time for anything else, no enjoyment out of your life or anything. How about stop being greedy and give employees enough money to survive instead of buying private jets and other such things for corporate?

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I can also turn this around on you quite easily. If you aren't willing to pay your employees a living wage for their hard work and contribution to your business, then you have no "business" getting into your own business.

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You also didn't factor in taxes. Duh.

Also, since you seem to be so out of touch, perhaps you should look at the prices of some 2-bedroom apartments . . .

http://showmetherent.rentlinx.com/listings/MA/beds:2

 

what entitles you to a 40 hour week? I haven't worked a 40 hour week my professional life and routinely work 70 hours. and I Have a degree. I do it because I have to. My ex wife had this same mentality. She was a dropout and there were jobs "beneath her" Meanwhile, I taught, did summerschool and a min wage job at Pepboys working upwards of 80 hours between all jobs. Meanwhile, she was working 25 hours, complaining that she shouldn't have to work because she couldn't find a job she liked..... I have pulled 100 hours before. with afamily. it sucked, and I improved my position in life so I never have to do that again..... but it is possible.

boo hoo.... noone said was life was easy. If you want more money... . either improve your economic value, or produce more of the skill you do provide. ECO 101.

why are you entitled to just a 40 hour week? Find me one McDonald's owner that works just 40 hours a week. Find me one CEO that works just 40 hours a week.


Noone WANTS to work more than 40.... but to keep my well paying job.... I work til I get the job done.

if 80 hours is too much, work 2, 32 hour a week jobs for 64 hours. 64 hours is NOT unreasonable... and that's still 26000. You aren't rich.... but you can live off it.

beginning teachers around my town make 35k and work 65 ish hours. It's not unreasonable to expect a burgerflipper to earn 10k less than a teacher for the same time "working"


I laugh at the least skilled, the most economically least of society somehow thinking they are entitled to work less hours and earn more for it than anyone else.

if you want more luxuries... earn them

 

I happen to make good money as a medical transcriptionist. I make much more than minimum wage, and I have a difficult time sometimes paying my bills. Rents around my local area for a 2-bedroom apartment run around $2000 a month. If you work a minimum wage paying job and work 40 hours a week, you only take home $1908 dollars per month (and that is not figuring in taxes). These people are eligible for public assistance for housing. That means, we taxpayers are flipping the bill instead of their employers paying them enough to make ends meet.

I don't really care what you have done. I have a feeling that you are an older person who has lived in the same home and had the same job for years and you are most likely completely out of touch. No one person should HAVE to work 80 hours a week to pay the bills and live. People need time off and relaxation and to spend time with their families and friends and to be there for their children.

 

you seem overly concerned I think you make min wage.... i don't give a crap what you make... this doesn't change my position.




65 hours a week at min wage is 26k in my area..... that's plenty to live on. I couldn't live in Orlando on 26k a year.... but maybe I shouldn't be trying to live in Orlando if I only make 8/hour. 3 hours up the road away from the themeparks, 26k is good money.


I'm middleaged.... wife, 2 kids... 2 professionals working. We both started waiting tables and worked our way up and out of that minimum wage lifestyle. Paid for our college and now live comfortably. But if you aren't even willing to work 65 hours a week, like both my wife and I do, then screw you. Live in a 1 br shack of an apartment with 3 people like my ex-wife does. We all have choices in life that led us to the jobs we have and the rate we agreed to get paid.


Either increase your skillset, or produce more product.....

 

No, people should not have to move to find a job that pays a living wage. Employers should provide a living wage for their respective communities to their employees, or they shouldn't go into business at all.

 

um... yes they should.... it's how America was born, why the west was settled.

There are good paying jobs out there for highschool dropouts if you are willing to work and go where they are. You aren't entitled to live in Beverly Hills if you flip burgers

 

How old are you? How long was it since you last looked for a job? You couldn't BE more wrong.

No one said anything about a huge wage, just a "living wage." That means, you can pay your bills for your necessities without relying on government assistance which is NOT the case nowadays. Why should taxpayers have to pick up the slack for employers/business owners who are too cheap to provide their employees with a living wage? We shouldn't have to pick up the slack. These employers need to start paying their employees better, so their employees can LIVE without taxpayer assistance.

In a LOT of states, minimum wage is at or BELOW poverty guidelines.

 

I'm 40.... I look for a job every year because I teach and there is no tenure in my state.


In my county.... there is 2 elementaries, 2 middleschools, and 2 highschools...... jobs are scarce in my hometown.... but if I am released and not asked back (thankfully this year, they asked for me to return next year), I have limited options. There are teaching jobs everywhere in the country.... but unless I'm willing to expand my commute.... or move.... I may not have a job in my town.


I would have to move if I still wanted to teach....


and I have a degree and training. so prey tell, why does an unskilled, untrained, uneducated burgerflipper somehow entitled to less hours of work for roughly the same pay, and not entitled to have to move if jobs aren't available?

 

That's tough. And a tough subject too. I understand those against tenure, because SOME teachers with tenure are protected no matter how bad they are. But by the same token, I'm sure job security would be nice. Especially since you've likely made sacrifices over the years.

I guess you're like the rest of us in the real world......gotta constantly prove yourself, and it's always "what have you done for me lately".

 

I'm not worried about that, that's not why I was bringing it up in this thread. He asked, I explained. I only mentioned the tenure part to make sure you understood it wasn't a state that had tenure where I don't have to job hunt.


I have 10 month contracts. after that, they can choose to have me comeback, or no. No reason given.

My wife and I, every May 1, will be given a letter with a yes or no...... Long term planning is pretty sketchy at best.

 

For one thing, poor people cannot usually afford to move. Do you know what it's like to be poor? I don't think you do.

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Do you assume I'm a man because I'm intelligent or because I'm posting on a political message board? What is it? Perhaps you're trying to subtly insult me by calling me a "he?" Explain please.

 

SHE is apparently out of touch and has no idea what it's like to be poor and struggle through life. SHE has no empathy or sympathy for the poor.

 

I have EMPATHY (because I've lived it... as recently as 2011), I don't have SYMPATHY because there is always choice somewhere in your life's equation.

you either choose to not plan, or not have a backup plan. I didn't have a solid backup plan in the event I wasn't asked back in June of 2011.... my skillset within education was a dime a dozen and I hadn't accounted for that because I was one of a gazillion social studies teachers on a saturated market. That was noone's fault but my own.

So I fixed that problem during that year I didn't teach and worked a 10$/hour job. I added certifications, endorsements, etc, and got a job that not that many are qualified for, or are able to do within my field.

The ones I have SYMPATHY for, are the ones that have some unforseen illness like cancer, befall them, or their loved ones (so long as it's not self-inflicted cancer like melenoma from laying in tanning beds, or lung cancer from smoking)

because I don't go around piously announcing how much I donate.... it's not good enough for you because you think I should do more.... so you try and compel my charity through bleeding heart social programs.

but if min wage doesn't allow you the location you want to live... that's not up to me to subsidize your desired lifestyle. Live within your means. sink water is unlimited when the waterbill is paid.... if you quit buying Energy sodas, you could afford your water bill.

Choices and consequences. Life is full of them.

 

moving is never easy.... but yes, they can. Greyhound bus tickets anywhere in the country for less than 100$. Sometimes, to make up for past poor decisions, one must sacrifice even harder.

I had to fork out 1000$ for certifications on a teaching license I wasn't even using because I was working for Lowes for 10$/hour. It was a risk because I wasn't sure if I'd ever teach again and I wouldn't get that money back, whether I used it or not. I know I could have bought a very nice iphone and outfit, or ate at McDonalds a lot, on that money.... but instead, I used my limited money to make myself more marketable.

And since I'm not throwing 50# bags of manure in the back of pickups in 110* heat in outside garden currently.... I'm confident I made the right decisions with my resources.

If a burger flipper can move 5 hours away for better opportunities that don't exist in their town.... choices and sacrifices must be made..... or don't..... stay flipping burgers. That's your choice.

again, I don't care where you work, what your gender is. You seem very worried and want to make sure that I know you aren't a burger flipper, and now want to make sure I know you're not a boy. I saw your not so subtle (SHE) when referring to me in the previous quote. I didn't cry. I'd suggest you stop crying about it, too. It's just a way for you to derail this thread because someone dares to think differently than you.

at this point, it sounds like you are a very pretty female who is used to others caving their opinion because you're pretty. Guys reduce the chances of banging you if they make you made over political issues, so instead of challenging you, they passify you. But on a Political board.... your prettiness does you no good.

 

Looks have nothing to do with this discussion. My problem is your rudeness.

This discussion is about greedy right wingers who claim they are religious. Why can't you just admit that you couldn't care less about the poor? It costs money to move, duh, a lot more than a bus ticket. You people are SO old and out of touch with the way life works. You just don't get it.

 

no, you came on upset that someone dared to think you were a guy, like it mattered to this discussion, and then implied I was sexist because I thought you were a guy "because you were intelligent" (like I wouldn't ever think a woman is intelligent)

I simply corrected you.

no, I'm not greedy, I'm self-reliant... that's the difference. Everytime I donate my time or wages at a church led community event like habitat..... I prove I care.


I didn't sit back in the 90's, and demand min wage be bumped up to 8$/hour (it was 5.15 at the time) because I couldn't get a better job.... I earned the $8 I got paid, and used it to invest in my future with my education.

Other's that earned what I did.... lived life "big" and blew the money they made. Then they popped out 3 kids, and realized, they couldn't live off of it. Who's fault was it they popped out kids?