Gun Control In Australia...FAIL!

So, your horrific memories should cost everybody their freedoms?

 

I konw a young kid who was paralised for life when he suffered serious spinal injuries in a push bike accident. This type of accident is common. What do we do? Ban push bikes?

 

Show me a step by step plan that demonstrates how one loses freedom without a gun

 

No we make sure there are as many safety features as possible

We have not "banned" guns just put a LOT of safety considerations around them - including reducing the overall number available

 

Realistic safety and security regulations aren`t the issue here, as I`ve stated on numerous occasions, firearm safety is an absolute essential, in fact, as I age, if I ever even look like breeching any one of my own safety rules, which are more strict than the regulations, I will never again touch another firearm. You are obviously not familiar with the new regulations. As to reducing the overall number of firearms, we have only reduced the number of LEGAL firearms.

 

One does not lose freedom without a gun. One loses freedom without the right to a gun.

 

That is not a rational but a rationalisation. You have not told me HOW this is supposed to happen

 

Since we never had the "right to a gun" and... we still don't have the "right to a gun", we never lost any freedom.

You can still own guns in Australia, it's just more difficult than in the USA.

 

In the U.S., we would lose our freedoms to defend ourselves with a gun, carry a gun, etc, if our Second Amendment disappeared. Any priviledge to a gun would be at the hands of the current government.

 

Then your guns are but one legislative session from being gone.

 

Honestly, you yanks are so screwed up. You rave on and on about how great your country is, and in the same breath go on and on about how you need a personal weapon to prove you have freedom. I have family in the US, I have spent many months there on visits, many times. First onalandine, tell us how many times you have visited Australia, how many Australians you know personally.

From both personal experience, from anecdotes from relatives and from the news and research, I would say we have as much, if not more freedom then you do in the USA. For a start, Australians in general have a lot more freedom of mind, we don't live in a personal terror, fearful of every shadow.

We do have some restrictions that are based on general consensus as to what a civilised society expects as suitable behavior, but these restrictions are not seen by the general populous as restrictions to freedom. Instead the freedoms we enjoy are because of the laws.

Two people that are in love, can walk down the street holding hands, they can cuddle and kiss and as long as their behaviour is within a reasonable standard, their right to do that is enforced by the laws that have restricted the freedom of people without the ability to come to grips with their feelings from interfering, verbally or physically.

The freedom to own an object that will propel you along a public road without that object being of a suitable type, being operated at a suitable speed, operated according to specific rules. That the operator should be both competent and licensed is a restriction of the individuals freedom to ensure that others have their freedom to SAFELY travel.

Becoming more civilised is what shows the advanced countries from the less advanced ones. Personal liberty is one of these signs of civilisation, we talk about how "uncivilised" the natives were, why, because they didn't dress as we do, didn't act as we do, didn't have the spiritual beliefs that we do. That to me is not "uncivilised", it is different. Being uncivilised is when you need to sort things out with a gun, so the USA must be very uncivilised.

 

That is circular reasoning

How would the second amendment "disappear" and why is it so important to have a gun to defend yourself? Are you in a state of civil war?

 

LOL, I have to laugh. You think you are free because you conform to government standards. To ignore reality and human nature to conform to what you think is an idealized impression of what "civilized' society is and give up rights that you have naturally. You seem to think you are immune to crime because of it.

The right to defend oneself you describe as "personal terror, fearful of every shadow" which is a characterization based on your skewed view of giving up personal responsibility.

Who is the first and best defense against crime? Is it the police that may come later and take notes and clean up or is it you faced with it first hand? I think you know the answer to this but I doubt you can admit it.

 

Actually the best defence against crime is not to continue believeing that society is divided into "good guys" and EVIL PEOPLE but to realise that society in the main is made up of people. Some of the most notorious mass shooters on the planet were unassuming people until they snapped. I would love you to demonstrate where an armed civilian gunman, who was not an off-duty cop, took down a mass shooter

Meanwhile consider these statistics - look at the link provided - it only mentions school shootings and then look at how many are American and how many are in the rest of the world

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0777958.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_massacres

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/20/dark-knight-shooting_n_1689505.html

Dear Gods and Little Fishes!!

That statistic HAS to be wrong!!

 

I am a trained soldier and I am professionally trained as a biochemist. I am not a police officer, I don't expect police officers to defend my country or do my pathology. Those are for me and people like me. The police police.

I am a civil man and fortunately I live in a civilized country.

 

Well, by law, the police are not here to defend you but to clean up after. If you think that you have no duty to defend yourself or your own family, then so be it.

 

Mass murderers are an anomaly. You are more likely to succumb to normal crime than a mass murder. In case you are the target of a mass murder, would you like to be able to defend yourself or place your trust in your misplaced assumption of some kind of superior "civilized" fantasy you live it?

Since 91 almost all states except one have passed carry or conceal carry laws allowing citizens the right to defend themselves. The one State that hasn't is Illinois, dominated by Chicago, one of the most dangerous places to live because the criminals do not care about the law.

 

The police are there to protect. I am not only prepared to defend myself and my family, I am also prepared to defend my country. The first line of defense is living in a country that protects them.

 

I have never been there, but would like to visit some day. I do know several people from there. One of them sent me the article that started this thread. He thinks Australian government is screwed up.

I do not live in fear or paranoia as you suggest. I just like guns and like to exercise my right to own and carry weapons as I choose.

 

It could disappear with one SCOTUS decision.

THere is no civil war. I just like guns and owning them.

 

You are poorly deluded unless you are sleeping with a police officer. Remember, when crime is imminent, the police are just minutes away. While someone attacks you or your family, you can just wait until the police arrive to protect you, long after it is too late, that is if you even had a chance to call them.

 

No, you are talking about you, living in the USA. In Australia, no one, well nearly no one, there are people with phobias, lives in fear in Australia. For example, where I live is within a stones throw of Australia's busiest CBD, within a stones throw of Australia's biggest red light district, the centre of the drug trade and the centre of the highest crime rate in the country.

During the last demonstration by Muslim radical extremists we could hear the shouting etc from our bedroom. Now this area is filled with arty folk, students, young urban professionals etc. I asked around if anyone is concerned for their safety. Every person answered NO, most chipped in that this was caused by a small group that are looking for trouble and that no matter what the reason was, it is unimportant. Everyone also had full confidence that the police would take care of it.

This for you Americans is called civilization (I even spelt it in Americana). It is where people have a country in which they have confidence. A country they know will try to do the right thing by it's citizens. This is Australia.

 

Saying that the "police won't get there in time" is like saying "the ambulance won't get there in time to stop a traffic accident"

The police are not there to be a magic fairy to wave a wand and stop the bad men hurting you. The biggest protection against that is the interaction between the criminal and the victim - and is not always helped by a gun.



Plus in Australia self defence is more complicated and is weighed in relation to the threat perceived by you. So if you shot a 12 year old kid climbing out your bedroom window with your TV you had better be ready to prove you were in immanent danger t dying yourself unless you want to be convicted of murder.

http://www.findlaw.com.au/articles/4542/australian-self-defence-laws-in-criminal-matters.aspx

 

Your graphic demonstrates my point exactly, the US is up with the less civilized countries, while Australia is among the most civilized. England, France, Wales and Japan. The attitude of the people dictate the attitude of their government which in turn dictates the attitude of their country.

 

Everybody knows that guns are dangerous and should be handled carefully. If you get sloshed and start playing with your gun and shoot yourself, don't blame the gun. If had got into a car and drove over a bank, would you blame the car?

And there have been no gun accidents since the gun ban? The truth is BB, if you look on the ABS web site you will find gun accidents have actually gone up.

Gun laws have nothing to do with the safe handling of guns and certainly do not protect anybody from guns. And anyway, I reckon we should bring back cracker night, the Kiwi's aren't such wooses, they've still got cracker night.

Why pick on gun accidents? just how many horrific gun accidents have you nursed and how many other horrific accidents have you nursed. I reckon you could count the gun accidents on one hand.