Gun Presence

Discussion in 'Gun Control' started by 6Gunner, Apr 30, 2019.

  1. Montegriffo

    Montegriffo Well-Known Member

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    Not true. As I have previously stated, 40,000 refers to the amount of knife crimes not stabbings. Possession of a knife in public is a knife crime and 90% of knife crimes do not involve a stabbing.
    You have been exposed now stop distorting the truth.
     
  2. Montegriffo

    Montegriffo Well-Known Member

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  3. Well Bonded

    Well Bonded Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    According to the Office for National Statistics, from the period of April 2016 to March 2017, there were a total of 34,700 police recorded offences involving a knife or sharp instrument.

    Shockingly, this figure increased by nearly 6,000 incidents, from the same period the previous year, which was a total of 28,877. This suggests, if current trends continue, nearly 40,000 people will be stabbed in the UK this year.

    Note the word stabbing.

    A stabbing is penetration with a sharp or pointed object at close range.

    https://www.unilad.co.uk/featured/the-dark-reason-40000-people-will-be-stabbed-in-the-uk-this-year/

    Now you have been provided with the truth not the falsehoods you are proffering.
     
  4. Well Bonded

    Well Bonded Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  5. Montegriffo

    Montegriffo Well-Known Member

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    We don't know that the number of people carrying knives is increasing. What we know is that the number of people caught in possession is increasing.
    This is likely to be a result of police forces increasing their efforts to get knives off the streets.
     
  6. Xenamnes

    Xenamnes Banned

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    So if there is no significant increase in knife-related injuries and/or murders occurring in the united kingdom, and no signs of a significant increase in the number of individuals illegally carrying knives in public, why exactly is law enforcement increasing their efforts at removing knives from the public? If the rates of knife-related crimes are not actually going up by any concerning degree, why is the increased effort necessary?
     
  7. Tim15856

    Tim15856 Well-Known Member

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    That may be true but is not related to the violent crime rate.
     
  8. Montegriffo

    Montegriffo Well-Known Member

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    Again, 40,000 is the figure for knife crimes not stabbings.
    The fact that your article confused this with stabbings is either appalling journalism or an attempt to distort the truth.

    In the year to march 2018 there were 285 deaths from stabbing in England and Wales.
    If there were 40,000 stabbings this figure would be much higher.
     
  9. Well Bonded

    Well Bonded Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That's not my article, I sent you the link to the source.
     
  10. Well Bonded

    Well Bonded Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Actually they are not, fact is police stop and search's have dropped from 1,400,000 in 2009 to 300,000 in 2018.
     
  11. Montegriffo

    Montegriffo Well-Known Member

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    Yes and I read it. Nowhere does the govt site say there where 40,000 stabbings.
     
  12. Montegriffo

    Montegriffo Well-Known Member

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    I have not said there are no increases in knife crimes.
    What I have said is there are not 40k stabbings a year.
    That is a massive distortion of the stats.
     
  13. Well Bonded

    Well Bonded Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I already posted the information as detailed in the article.
     
  14. Montegriffo

    Montegriffo Well-Known Member

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    The article is misleading, there were not 40k stabbings and the govt source does not say there were. The actual figure of injuries caused by stabbings is fewer than 4000.
     
  15. Well Bonded

    Well Bonded Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    There were 39,818 knife crime offences in the 12 months ending September 2018.

    This is a two-thirds increase from the low-point in the year ending March 2014, when there were 23,945 offences, and is the highest number since comparable data was compiled.

    These statistics do not include those from Greater Manchester Police because of data recording issues.

    Out of the 44 police forces, 42 recorded a rise in knife crime since 2011.

    Hospital admissions due to stabbing also have gone up from admissions 4,000 in 2015/2016 to 4,700 admissions to 2017/2018.

    That's a significant increase for a country with such a small population.
     
  16. Xenamnes

    Xenamnes Banned

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    Two seemingly contradictory statements have been presented on the part of yourself in this discussion. The first is pointing out the knife-related incidents in the united kingdom pertain primarily to the illegal carrying and possession of a knife, rather than the misuse of a knife against individuals. This would indicate more individuals are carrying knives, as the number of recorded knife-related incidents has increased significantly.

    The second is claiming there is nothing to suggest the number of individuals illegally carrying knives is increasing, despite the recorded number of knife-related crimes increasing.

    If such is the case, if there is truly no significant upswing in the number of knife-related incidents that constitute murder or assault but rather pertain simply to mere possession, why exactly would law enforcement officers be engaging in such proactive measures to identify individuals illegally carrying knives in public? Such a costly endeavor would not be engaged in unless there was an actual need to address an ongoing matter. Unless there was a significant increase in the number of knife-related assaults and/or murder in the united kingdom, which would demonstrate violence has not been affected by firearm-related restrictions in place, there would be no justification for expending greater resources in trying to tackle what would be a non-problem.
     
  17. Montegriffo

    Montegriffo Well-Known Member

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    Could just as easily show that increased perception of knife crime due to sensational reporting has led to a police crackdown on possession.
    Homicides are still a rarity compared to the US. Per capita rates are around a quarter.
    A large part of the increased numbers is gang related. Thankfully firearms are still difficult to get hold of or the numbers of killings would be higher.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2019
  18. Well Bonded

    Well Bonded Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Which increases the chances of a defenseless, innocent, law abiding person becoming the victim of a crime.

    Never forget when seconds count the police are always minutes away, which is way in the U.S., many of law enforcement leaders encourage their law abiding citizens to be armed and ready to stop a crime in progress and in addition many of those same leaders provide at no or a rather low cost, law enforcement based training to those same law abiding citizens.

    To them those law abiding citizens are seen as a force multiplier.
     
  19. Xenamnes

    Xenamnes Banned

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    There is no sense in continuing to report such a claim, as there was never a point in the history of both countries where such has not always been the case. Realistically, saying the united kingdom has fewer homicides than the united states, is no different than stating the universal constant that water is wet.

    If the united kingdom resembled the city of Chicago in terms of firearm-related violence prior to the firearm-related restrictions coming into play, such could be more readily believed. But when the numbers were already so low, it is extremely difficult to demonstrate any actual or significant change due to any one particular factor. And if violent acts have not demonstrating a corresponding reduction, it is even more difficult.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2019
  20. Dispondent

    Dispondent Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    So basically you are whining because one of your favorite oppressor state doesn't look so good? Why aren't you so discerning when it comes to how US school shootings are counted? Oh right, that sort of intellectual honesty goes against your gun grabbing agenda...
     
  21. Galileo

    Galileo Well-Known Member

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    So what? If you're not going to distinguish between different kinds of violent crime you can't really measure the effectiveness of gun control.
     
  22. Galileo

    Galileo Well-Known Member

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    Is crime rising in the UK? The police are recording more crimes but in surveys people are not more likely to say that they've been victims of crime.

    "According to the most recent survey, which is conducted face-to-face and asks individuals about their personal experiences, levels of crime in the year to September 2018 remained pretty stable compared with the year before."
    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-41149778
     
  23. Galileo

    Galileo Well-Known Member

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    Can you show that gun control is causing the UK to not look so good or are you just here to shamelessly muddy the waters? Put up or shut up.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2019
  24. Dispondent

    Dispondent Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Nah, that's your MO. By pretending you are too dense to understand 'shall not be infringed' you muddy the waters every time you argue for more gun grabbing infringements...
     
  25. Galileo

    Galileo Well-Known Member

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    You are obviously clueless about what constitutes an infringement.
     

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