How can anyone be against deporting criminal aliens

I have seen no one do that. If illegals are committing felonies they need to be deported.

Next?

 

I appreciate your appeal to emotion over facts.

However your argument if extended would have us deport ANY nationality (citizen or not) as a whole if one member of that group commits a crime.

 

It's easy, we just look at what it means to be a "criminal alien", see that it does not entail violating the rights of any human and conclude that no action against them is justifiable.

What's illogical is trying to argue that action against "criminal aliens" is justified because of other law violations they may or may not commit which don't entail being a "criminal alien".

 

What do you suggest? That the united states refrains from enforcing various laws that it has on the books, if the violation does not have an immediately identifiable victim who has been harmed? A criminal offense is only punished when it can be demonstrated that someone has actually been harmed?

 

In what way is it bogus? It is 100% legitimate. What a load of utter nonsense!! I made a very clear and coherent point, you pointed out something completely irrelevant (that is called a red herring), and you are now trying to pretend that only one thing at a time can be immoral. So I have to choose? Because some illegal immigrants are criminals, I have to treat all of them as criminals? Because some illegal immigrants are criminals, it gives me the right to dehumanize all other illegal immigrants? What horse (*)(*)(*)(*)!! Like I said before, all the things I mentioned are immoral. So is murder. Glad we could clear that up.

 

That of course depends on how old those children are, what the circumstances they will go into are, where they will be sent to, and how they will be sent there. Mass population transfers are always a terrible idea, and have led to humanitarian crises every time they have been tried. That is exactly what would happen again, if we decided to round up and deport 11 million people with no plan on how to reintegrate those people into their old countries (or in the example of an American citizen, who should just go back with their mother according to you, a country that isn't even their country), that would be a humanitarian disaster. You need to be a sociopath to not find that unacceptable.

 

Sure we can deport the CRIMINAL illegal alien but how do we KEEP their ass out is the million dollar question?

 

All illegals (note the name!) are technically criminals because they knowingly broke the laws when they entered US illegally.

 

The best way to deal with immigration is to repeal the 13th amendment and issue work visas to anyone who wants to come here. That way the immigrant can come here and work since so many Democrats feel they're too good to do so, but neither they or their crotch fruit can receive government money.

 

Yes and it all in how you define criminal such as the middle age woman that made up a SS number so she could work and then found herself being deported for that crime decades in the past leaving two teenage American sons without a mother.

 

You mean like letting 11 million people come into our country with no plan to integrate into our society. One slso forgets that these children are also citizens of the country that their parents come from and most likely speak that language also. We have ELS children in our school that were born in the US that do not speak English at all. These parents are raising these kids as if they where still in the old country. It could be said they would have an easier time in schools in their country of origin.

 

It's nothing to do with real Americans and all to do with maladjusted Americans.

 

Then you must be climbing the walls loosing 1.1 billion a day and getting absolutely nothing in return! And at the end of the year you realized our Nation has spent 432 Billion on nothing, just think how much could have been done with that X EIGHT!

 

Except of course conservatives are more likely to have received government benefits than liberals.

http://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2012/12/18/a-bipartisan-nation-of-beneficiaries/

So save your nonsense, welfare is a bipartisan endeavor. The only time people actually oppose entitlement programs is in the abstract, never in the specific.

 

We don't have an influx of 11 million people over a short period of time. You are purposely ignoring reality here.

 

Human decency aside, the cost of identifying, locating, apprehending, incarcerating, prosecuting, and deporting an estimated 11 million folks, a process that would take years, necessitates the taxpayer housing and feeding all those families during the process, not to mention the adverse impact inflicted on their employers and communities (even if Big Government does not infringe upon State's Rights by commandeering, via coercion, local law enforcement authorities and diverting them from their assigned responsibilities to do the Feds' job for them) necessitates a dispassionate cost/benefit analysis.

Besides which, most patriotic Americans oppose the draconian, final solution:

Of course, there is also the moral component that compels Christians to courageously resist rabid Trumpery.

Christian Churches Declare War on Trumpery

The People are speaking truth to power, and Power and its grovelers do not like it.


.

 

Did this make sense in your head? It doesn't written out.

 

That would be nice.

A good start would be for the US to stop enforcing illegal laws that congress never had the authority to write, such as all legislation pertaining to immigration. I mean, if one believes in the rule of law, one should believe that law makers should be ruled by any law applying to them, and that enforcement of illegal law is not law ruling but a result of totalitarianism.

 

What frustrates me is how simply and easily the whole question could be settled.

Look ... We know that we should deport illegals or legal aliens who commit crimes. That's a given.

What about the ones who have been here for years, have never committed a crime, and who have American kids? What about a child who was born in Mexico and brought over the border when she was 1 year old, and now she's a 17 year old high school senior - totally Americanized? The answer is so simple, and it just baffles me why we can't just get it done.

Start by securing the border. Fences, walls, monitoring - the whole deal. Then ....

Simply induce people to self-report, get documented and background checked, and get their green card and valid tax ID number. Then they can just go on with life as before. The inducement is:

1) E-verify for work or education, so they can do neither without first self-reporting

2) No threat of deportation if they pass a background check

3) No need to ever hide or lie - live openly without fear

4) The stick - Failure to self-report can result in deportation.

So ... We would be deporting those who don't self-report and criminals (which would most likely be one in the same), while avoiding the specter of "round-ups" and broken families.

The President, the Congress, the SCOTUS, and all the states should just leave this to me. With all their combined intellect and college degrees and credentials, they are too stupid to just figure this out and do it. They should just admit it and turn it all over to me. I'll have this completely settled in no time, and we'll just move on.

 

Well said.

 

"Therefore I think it is immoral to deport people who have been in this country for decades, into a country where they have nothing and no one. "

While I can understand the emotional motivation, it is also true that most such people are here because they knowingly violated the law. They are here because political pressure often asked for government to tread lightly, to be "understanding". That failure blossomed into the 12 million that should never have been ignored in the first place. The solution is not to continue to ignore. Then we have the anchor babies- pregnant women traveling to the US in time to go into labor, giving their child a gift of stolen US citizenship. There are travel agencies in other countries that specialize in this as a service, literally selling IS citizenship as part of a travel package. We have allowed this to occur- they are just taking advantage of our generosity, without permission. We are to blame for the number of illegals here, only through lack of strong enforcement and penalty. But that does not make those illegals legal or entitled. If you steal from the bank regularly and don't get caught- you still go to jail when you are. Not identical to that, but close. Immigrants export US dollars to Mexico to the tune of $25 billion a year- money that does not return to our economy. The money stolen from the bank at least stays in US circulation. No matter what we do about those here, we damn sure need to stop making it worse.

 

Everything you say here is reasonable and unfortunately, reasonable doesn't get traction in modern American political discourse. Especially on issues as controversial as this. What you are describing is essentially amnesty, it is what leaders on both sides of the aisle have supported in some manner or another for decades, but today it is a political death sentence for most Republicans in congress. Which means it is politically poisonous to even consider for them, especially since reasonable people are rarely the most motivated (especially in bi-elections). Any Republicans who supported anything like this would get slaughtered back home, assuming they come from conservative districts.

 

Democracy does not equal 'self rule'.

Self rule does not equal 'happiness'.

the goal is freedom, & securing our natural rights to property, life, & liberty. No other system of governance has done that for as long or as well, as the American Experiment in self rule. It is only the anti-American revisionist history from the progressive left that tries to paint the American Experiment as a failed social system. We are only failing now because of the strategies of Open Borders, & other progressive social policies.

 

So what?

You dismiss the moral case as an appeal to emotion while it's really not, but is an appeal to your moral sense(should you have any), and offer up a bunch of political talking points that have you concluding that bank robbery is better than working for a living.

If the law were really important to you, you would be railing against congress for violating it by writing immigration laws in the first place.