If "Our Creator" endowed us with rights...

Regardless of what your argument stresses, if you ask any Bible Believing Christian whether God designed us with free will, the right to choose our thoughts speech and behavior....they will say yes.

To Christians its absolutely impossible to have a personal relationship with God through forced conversion. You aren't saved by going to church, being baptized or doing all the right "Christian " actions or "duties". You are only saved when you choose of your own free will to accept Jesus as your Savior.

The right to free speech links closely to the concept of free will which helps shape values that uphold freedoms within our society.

The further people distance from God, the more acceptance of government laws meant to control speech.

 

Why would anyone believe you, if you can not prove anything you are saying?

Of course it is gov'ts. The can give you liberty or take your liberty.

I said that in my 1st post in this thread.
Might makes right.
Unless there's an enforcement mechanism that grants rights in a civil society. Typically that enforcement mechanism is a gov't.

But you claimed the bible states our rights. And then when asked, said you can't prove it.

And if god gave humans rights. Why don't all humans have those rights? god given isn't god guaranteed? What good are they if god doesn't grant and enforce them for all humans?

 

Ok, start.
Demonstrate your claim.
Cite the passage

 

Its not a passage, its the whole thing. And all the amendments.

People wrote it to form a gov't and wanted the gov't to follow those things written.

 

Here is your 1st post to me.

It is a document written for the gov't to follow.
As I said in my 1st post. Without an enforcement mechanism, typically a gov't, there are no rights.
The constitution is a guiding document for a gov't to grant/allow/enforce rights to it's people/citizens.

If not for a document that all agree on, then might makes right.

 

That's my post?

 

So people created the government and granted it specific powers,.........go on

 

I am a Canadian, but think the U.S. cannot possibly do worse than Trump.

You do not have any socialists in your democratic party. You have democrats with social programs for the people that almost all other free nations have.

The right wing uses words like socialist to scare the right wing into their polarized position and do not care of their dishonesty.

The U.S. is mostly Christian and Christianity is a fascist regime and your right wing does not seem to mind that at all.

Hypocrisy comes to mind. Oh well. What can you expect from sheeple that believe in real talking serpents and donkeys.

Regards
DL

 

We became independent for reasons of government as it clearly states in our Declaration of Independence.

And, you can't just claim all that is good as belonging to Christianity.

Our founders created a SECULAR ONLY government. And, the law we have subsequently created address secular issues - the SEC, FBI, DoA, DoD, HHS, CDC, and all the rest.

We don't make law on the basis of sin. Read the 10C. Consider the 7 deadly sins. We don't argue issues of government by quoting scripture.

You have not found any case of the Bible addressing the rights of humans.

The Bible teaches our duty to turn the other cheek. It does not teach the right to shoot people.

This is just plain nonsense.

Free will is a characteristic of human beings. Whether a human has any rights is a political issue. - as can be seen by the myriad governments now and through history that deny those rights.

In fact, those living in US colonies often did NOT have a right to their own decisions on religion.

Government does NOT seek to limit liberty. As we have become more dense, we grow more dependent (or subject) to those around us. More of what we depend on is provided by a system that serves all. That means we will have group decision making on the quality and availability of those systems - government.

And, there will be significant differences in requirements, making federal law difficult. For example, the rules on guns in Wyoming recognize that the prey is food species. But, in Manhattan, the prey is human - not food. So, there is a very serious reason for the regulation to be different. So, any one law is likely to seem very wrong to some. This is just one example, obviously.

In the end, rights are principles of government. Read Leviticus to see how Mosaic law impinged on what we would consider to be rights.

 

Our colonies did not tolerate freedom of speech or assembly related to religion. Plus, the religion could include the government - so, speech on just about anything was an issue of religious speech. Mosaic law did not recognize rights of speech and religious choice. The religious government in England had harsh laws on speech - including deat. And, there was the issue of people deciding to worship and idol instead of God.

So, that last sentence doesn't even meet "wishful thinking".

As for free will, there is debate on that issue within the Chriistian religion. By being omniscient, God made mankind knowing what your decisions would be.

Romans 8 (23 or so) includes:

That's predestination - not free will. It's probably not surprising, as Christianity sprang from Judaism, and they believed in predestination, too.

There has been a lot of thought on this issue since then, obviously, but let's be a little careful with "free will" as reconciling the requirement for a freely taken decision on God and God's omniscience is not that easy.

What we choose as rights are certainly made with a knowledge of how humans are put together. But, that's a secular issue of today, not something taught in the Bible. Our constitution was writen with the knowledge that it had to include all thoughts about religion of those here an those who would come here. Government could not be the promoter or excluder of any religious thought.

 

No need to. You finally got it. The people created.

 

LOL. Yep. That's why you are quoted. SHeesh.

 

The RW in America is all about division.

 

The constitution does not 'grant' anything what so ever to the people.

 

He/she has not found biblical scriptures giving humans rights.
And has already admitted so.

 

It grants to a gov't, what the people say it can and can't do.
And the PEOPLE, will change it if they got it wrong or times change.

That's why slaves are now not allowed.
Along with the 33 Amendments the PEOPLE have made.

 

Im talking about about the document, not reality.

In reality its 95% bullshit.

Neither me nor has any citizen not in congress or the HoR, ever had any opportunity to vote on 'any' amendment.

Its our document, they hijacked it right along with its intended core meaning and have convoluted it to the point the only thing its good for is toilet paper.

Pull the commie part out and russian constitution pales ours, and because its considerably larger the russians have more toilet paper than we do.

 

Yes.
She is the one you should be telling this to

 

Quote it

 

The government granted nothing

Edit:
Never mind. You already did

 

If God gave rights, many might be able to say their trials is not rightful. If God gave rights many could say their rest in Him is a gift. If God gave rights many could say, 'why have anxiety and worry'. If rights meant sureness in what is declared and or written as being allowed to partake of those rights with the agreed upon conditions; a consent and agreenent, not a forced imprisonment.

Have you had a young one gone missing? Fearful? What might the young one feel if you would be dreading such an idea?

Those strapped down with a straight jacket to unnecessarily receive torture upon torture for some false reality the 'need to knows' feel as they are not receiving. What of that person's unagreed upon testing to his or her reproductive system for volunteering for a remedy they truly need?

Rights? What would these persons say about rights?


I have a right to drink alcohol. I dont like ideas of ending up being taken away to a distant place as a 'trunk passenger'.

 

You won't be able to logically justify a creator endowing people with rights

Distraff said: ↑

--------

Logically, when during the judge of Samuel those that were brought out of Egypt asked for a king like the other nearby 'communities', they pretty much received what they were asking for. God extended them their request.

 

My rights end where yours begin.
You have the same right to control over your body as I do. I have no right to take that control from you

 

Good points.

Besides not giving us rights, the Bible does not give us capitalism, separation of powers, democracy (or any other kind of representation), etc.

Our government is secular - thank God.

 

If I'm breathing your coall fired power factory, where do your rights stop and mine begin?