Israeli President; Peres: Recognition of Jewish state 'unnecessary'

That depends on deal, the important point in "recognition" is no more claims against the state of Israel - ending the fued, saying there wont is not the same as commiting yourself to a legal definition that will take the air out of any formal resistance.

 

I don't think that palestinians can do it without all arabs (Arab league) agreement.

 

I can say only that some american jews do deserve 30 pieces of silver from haters of Israel.

 

I dont know about that but even if so I dont need to take their intrests over mine.

 

[MENTION=63649]Yetzerhara[/MENTION]

how do you feel about the fact that Neo-Zionists in this forum are now saying that since the Arabs are not bound by the protections written in the Palestine Mandate, the Mandate is junk?

 

Neo-Zionists......just can't stop yourself from indulging in simple minded rhetoric. The overuse of rhetorical nonsense usually results from having no actual argument to begin with.

 

"Neo-Zionist" is an actual term used by right-wing Zionists.

I didn't make it up.

 

Uh-huh....and what do you imagine that has to do with your constant usage of terms like that? Just easier for you?

 

I use the term rather than "right-wing Zionist".

you got a problem with that?

 

I have never questioned your right to criticize Israeli state policies.

What I am challenging is your presuming to know what is good for Israelis and your denial of public facts such as the fact the PA will not recognize Israel as a Jewish state because to do that would mean giving up on this continuing notion the PA and Hamas and the 300 other terror cells hold dearly to and that is the return of millions of Palestinians to pre 1967 Israel as an express condition of recognizing Israel, i.e., only recognizing it if it becomes a Palestinian majority population state.

Its interesting as well how you pose your above response to me as if you are now the US as a whole and not Rons and the opinions of the US and Rons are identical.

I am not sure when that shift occurred in your identity but it appears to have happened close to the time you also took on the role of Nuremberg Judge casting moral judgement on the Nazis, South Africans and Israelis all rolled into one.

It is also interesting you appear to be suggesting Israelis no longer have free will because you bought and paid for them.

 

This is an interview with the American reporter that interviewed Abu Mazen, from her off line question to Abu Mazen "why not recognize Jewish state as in 181" he laughted he will take 181 right now since he would get alot more land = he wont recognize it since he gets less then what he thinks he should = they plan to continue the fued by legal/armed means, most probebly both.

Important input IMO....

http://www.ynet.co.il/articles/0,7340,L-4484572,00.html

 

No? For a second I thought you did. Can you then please quote the right wing Zionist(s) who use that term and who coined it? I was never aware it was originated or used by right wing Zionists. In fact I thought the word neo-Zionist and the practice of putting neo and a hyphen before words was in fact created by the Soviet Marxist party and became a staple world in Maoist terminology as well and is most often used today by the Republic of North Korea and people who claim to be Marxists.

Also I believe Keannu Reeves uses it to express his disdain with wannabe surfers.

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I never stated such a thing and by the way I am one person. If you must make veiled references to my opinion understand I am but one person. By the way I am not neo Zionist. I am just a Zionist.

 

Just read your post. I would agree. I think you will find in the on-going talks an integral part of the settlement draft in an arrangement where not just Palestine but all 57 countries of the Arab League recognize Israel as part of that agreement.

That could be a huge task and it would indicate you are right and that it is an integral part of the discussions. I know the state of Israel says it is. I am not sure what Mr.Abbas thinks about that. He stated at one point he had confidence he could arrange a peace settlement that would bring in all factions of Palestinians as well as the Arab League but the rhetoric of the other Palestinian factions, Syria, and Hezbollah which impacts directly on Lebanese foreign policy would seem to dictate against that. Also I doubt Yemen,Iraq, Sudan would be able to get their countries to agree to recognize Israel as a Jewish state.

 

http://www.kumah.org/neozionism.html

http://fpif.org/neo-zionism_religion_and_citizenship/

http://www.promisedlandblog.com/?tag=neo-zionism

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo-Zionism

 

Right wing Zionist? Could you imagine any other kind? I suppose that's fair.....roughly equivalent to the way I regard some people on this forum as amoral anti-Semites and Nazis.

 

yeah, there are left-wing Zionists like myself.

 

Not at all, just as I couldn't imagine a non-Jewish Zionist (sarcasm).

 

Helen Thomas would undoubtedly agree.

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More completely meaningless definitions.

 

Why are you bringing Helen Thomas into this?

 

Because Helen Thomas also has a very selective view of history. I guess she doesn't remember what happened to the hundreds of thousands of Jews who used to live in Arab nations....much like some of the people on this thread.

[video=youtube;LL9AxmaQdIU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LL9AxmaQdIU[/video]

 

Dates and sources please.

 

he's trying to say that everyone who rejects right-wing Zionist Fascism, is a fan of Helen Thomas.

 

The above response was appreciated. I was not trying to be deliberately obtuse with you. When you provide the sources I can see who is using them and in what context. Words like neo Zionist, post Zionist, just Zionist have become meaningless. People use them in all kinds of ways even Zionists.

No one is using these terms consistently and so the have become meaningless.

Neo as an expression and I am being serious, first was coined by the Marxists and in particular Russian and German Maxists as it is used today by those who identify themselves as leftists to define the right. Its a catch phrase like fascist. Its used to depict anyone who disagrees as a reactionary on the other side.

Its intellectually lazy. It shuts down listening and debating and stereotypes a person's beliefs without having to go further and that is what I think you have done with me for example depicting my positions as neo Zionist. Nonsense. I am no neo Zionist. The closest thing that can be said to my ideology is that it is the same as Tzip Levni's or Kadima. That does not make me a member of some fascist brigade.

Your claiming to be a leftist Zionist as interesting as calling me a neo right wing Zionist. The names are meaningless.

Let's stick to what we actually state on this forum and not label them as something they are not and that is what Capt Panties was arguing and I strongly agree with. The names, the labels are meaningless. They make a presumption that the person using the label does not have to listen and can just shut down and assume he already knows what the other side's position is.

Kumah in my humble opinion are wack jobs. They are fringe. To depict them as being mainstream or legitimate is pointless.

That tactic, picking out extremist wack jobs and state they use the word neo is valid. I asked who used it, your rightfully showed me and now I can say, uh yah a bunch of wackos precisely the kind of extremists who use labels to shut down having to listen to both sides of an argument.

I do thank you though for the references it was done honestly and by answering it I now understand your reference.

In regards to you calling yourself a left wing Zionist I have no idea what that means. I can only go by what you state and argue at times as to what you state. I don't label what you say as left or right. I also do not label Capt. Panties as left or right. Yes I probably agree with him 99% of the time but its not because he's right or left. In fact without meaning to insult him, he seems to be to be smack in the middle challenging biases on either side equally,

 

Yes and I can't imagine an non Jewish anti Zionist (hee hee chuckles).

Your point?

 

No he did not. Now me on the other hand, I tend to think many who reject right wing Zionist fascism favour Hamas's view on how to deal with Israel.

I also tend to think when people start throwing out labels like right wing Zionist fascist they simply reflect their own closed minds and need to stereotype others .

It enables them to be intellectually lazy and use those labels to presume they know what the other side believes to avoid responding because they are either too lazy to respond or do not know how to respond.

Labels such as those I find are used by people no different then plugging their ears with their fingers when another speaks. Its just a device to justify being deaf and blind.

Neo fascist right wing Zionist is no different than saying poo head Zionist.

In the future just call me a poo head..