It has begun. New Republican totalitarian Congress to ban abortion after 20 weeks

Despite you totally misrepresentation most people are fully aware of what pro-choice stands for .. but there again I expect nothing more from you.

By your logic pro-lifers who support wars and executions are also pro-death and as such can be referred to as pro-death .. do you fit the cap?

 

Again, you try to equate the guiltless with the guilty. Babies are guiltless and have done nothing to threaten society. If you try to make the argument that they do, then you would also have to support war and execution.

 

No, brain activity is picked up by EEG by day 40, and by week 12 they are moving around and sleeping and awakening and reacting to stimuli. Since there is no hard deadline on when a fetus becomes "conscious" then it is better to play it safe. Using the "mature brain" criteria is nonsense because the brain is still developing long after birth, unless people are advocating being able to abort newborns.

Pregnancy complications is a non sequitor and I get sick of it being trodden out. Very few people are opposed to abortions if the mother's life is at risk and that goes without saying. The fact is the science is in and the days of being able to defend late term abortions is long gone. In the this day and age if you defend late term abortions then you are a monster.

http://www.pregnancy.org/article/overview-fetal-development

 

The government has been busy passing all sorts of new regulations.
The "pro-choice" crowd is just getting a little dose of their own medicine.

 

Really? Hospitals, doctors, nurses, administrative staff, medical device manufacturers all volunteer their time and equipment at no charge?

 

What! No more blow jobs! Arghhh!

 

I don't know how you could possibly get ""girls/women are somehow inferior and need the help from Liberal Democrats to get through life"""

It's Anti-Choice Repub/conservatives who want to regulate what women do with their bodies....as if women aren't able to decide for themselves.

Pro-Choicers simply want to protect our rights to our own bodies.

 

Meh, a lot of hyperbole... "totalitarian"... "authoritarian"... "assaults on common sense". I could easily label those for abortion in the same way if I were more biased. Is it not authoritarian to tell all that there is nothing wrong with abortion and it should be allowed even if one disagrees with it? How about common sense... now that is a misnomer if I have ever seen one, and subjective as hell.

As a liberal I am against abortion... not because some God says that it is wrong, nor out of any desire to control women, but because the killing of a fetus just does not sit well with me. I know the pros and cons of both sides but this does not trump the life of the fetus by my measure of morality. So I would be happy to see abortion abolished. If that in your view makes me an authoritative totalitarian who assaults common sense... then so be it.

In a free society, no matter what the law is, there will always be those who disagree with it and screaming of some social injustice... its the American way.

 

I would hope that even right-wing-nut-jobs aren't that twisted.

 

If babies are guiltless why are they killed in war?

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You would like to see abortion abolished? How?

 

More killed by abortion than anything else so I guess the pro-death crowd must think they are guilty of something.

 

I'd have to know which State you think are restricting access, but public health regulations have spiked since Obama came to office. States are responding the only way they can and safety of the patients. The only major new law in Texas, I'm aware of is being near a facility to handle an abortion gone wrong case, which includes accidental live births. I don't see where educating kids on sex, would help, but then I'm not a young kid.

Chi'fil-A, the Catholic Organizations and other I assume your upset with aren't the least bit concerned with access to rubbers, they just don't want to forced to pay for abortions, by any means, just as all those dirty "Republican's".

Oh, so now you want to teach boy's how to have sex, I did hear one State wanted to start that in kindergarten, that sure makes sense!!! Try explaining abortion to kids, letting them know how lucky they were, while 50 MILLION other American's failed.

 

Those countries, as all industrialized countries do, have national health insurance.

 

What does that have to do with the price of tea in China? Please post where I made any claims of babies are guiltless.

Made illegal. This will not abolish it but drastically reduce the instances of abortion.

 

Perhaps you can explain the "guilt" of the estimated 174,000 civilians killed in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan to date or even better the 50,154 children killed in Iraq and the 15,750 children killed in Afghanistan .. please do tell me me how those children were a threat to society, what were they "guilty" of?

BTW do you actually know how your law system works, if you did you would know that even the "guiltless" cannot injure another person without consent or don't you believe in consent?

 

You continue to mention "Women" not having a choice, you feel a specific group is denying them. NOBODY is denying anybody the right to prevent pregnancy, including most Catholics who philosophically disapprove and up to maybe 20 weeks, some do want to deny abortion. I frankly don't care, as history has taught me from RvW and State Law's, any woman can claim mental hardship now or in the future and get an abortion, even free.

I also agree all people have rights over their body, but to specific limits. One limit must concern the fetus. In many States a person can be convicted of a crime, if the fetus is injured or killed in the process of a crime. With that in mind, the limit should established under law, not in the political arena...

 

Now that you accept guilt for killing as your argument, it should be an easy step for you to see my viewpoint now and accept that killing is bad.

 

No they don't even if you says so a hundred more times. I don't give two flying ^&*%s what birth control you use as long as you pay for it. What kind of man cant afford birth control for his woman? If you cant afford birth control you shouldn't be having sex. If you cant afford birth control what business do you have partaking in an act that could potentially lead to a child that you obviously cannot afford?

 

The so called "brain waves" detected at day 40 are nothing more than standard electrical impulses that ALL cells have, do you know about the experiment done by two college students where they measured the "brain waves" of a bowl of Jello, the results were almost exactly the same as found in a 40 day old embryo.

As to this mature brain thing, I haven't seen anyone use that as an argument, I can only assume that you are referring to constant brain wave activity which occurs around week 25. The rationale for this starting point is based on our definition of death. The definition of death is not disputed, and is considered the time when electroencephalography (EEG) activity ceases. EEG measures brain activity and must demonstrate regular wave patterns to be considered valid. Therefore, by this rule the onset of life would be the time when fetal brain activity begins to exhibit regular wave patterns, which occurs fairly consistently around week 25. Previous to that time, the EEG only shows small bursts of activity without sustained firing of neurons.

As to the movements at 12 weeks, they are purely reaction movements there is no conscious ability to move. Just as any living cell, such as a virus, will withdraw from a stimulus or are you suggesting that a virus is conscious?

Rubbish, pregnancy complications are the only reasons abortion occurs after 24 weeks so you can get as sick as you like about it, that is the fact of the matter, and I can assure you if pro-lifers get their person at conception ideology passed into law then the argument for abortion at anytime, for any reason AND the state paying for it becomes far more compelling.

So in your opinion then anyone who defends the right to consent and self-defence is a monster?

 

Abortion doesn't kill babies, war does......

 

That was a total misread of what the poster above said.....I know an Anti-Choicer in here once said that Anti-Choicers have to be dishonest but maybe you could break the habit.....

 

Yet again you see what you want to see and twist it to suit, nothing in my comment even comes close to accepting guilt for killing, and it is noted that as usual you fail to answer any questions directed at you, so let us try this again;

You stated that war and executions are done to protect society, so the question still remains;

Perhaps you can explain the "guilt" of the estimated 174,000 civilians killed in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan to date or even better the 50,154 children killed in Iraq and the 15,750 children killed in Afghanistan .. please do tell me me how those children were a threat to society, what were they "guilty" of?

also noted is that you ignored my final question of "BTW do you actually know how your law system works, if you did you would know that even the "guiltless" cannot injure another person without consent or don't you believe in consent?"

 

I of course didn't get past your first sentence as (Im going to say this one last time) I don't care WHAT birth control you use, just pay for it yourself. Problem solved. If you cant pay for your own birth control then dont have sex, if you do, enjoy your new monthly bills yourself.

 

Oh, I see you picked out your own arbitrary point of personhood, and you are sticking with it. Would you believe Carl Sagan?

Other animals have advantages over us--in speed, strength, endurance, climbing or burrowing skills, camouflage, sight or smell or hearing, mastery of the air or water. Our one great advantage, the secret of our success, is thought--characteristically human thought. We are able to think things through, imagine events yet to occur, figure things out. That's how we invented agriculture and civilization. Thought is our blessing and our curse, and it makes us who we are.

Thinking occurs, of course, in the brain--principally in the top layers of the convoluted "gray matter" called the cerebral cortex. The roughly 100 billion neurons in the brain constitute the material basis of thought. The neurons are connected to each other, and their linkups play a major role in what we experience as thinking. But large-scale linking up of neurons doesn't begin until the 24th to 27th week of pregnancy--the sixth month.
If we are forced to choose a developmental criterion, then this is where we draw the line: when the beginning of characteristically human thinking becomes barely possible.

It is, in fact, a very conservative definition: Regular brain waves are rarely found in fetuses.

http://www.2think.org/science_abortion.shtml

No, the monsters are those who would disregard pregnancy complications. Like Georgia Republicans, and particularly Representative Terry England who said women must be forced to carry a dead fetus until she "naturally goes into labor" just as cows and pigs do.

Maybe you think Peru had it right to force women to birth fetuses with anencephaly, a defect that causes fetuses to be born lacking parts of their brain with no chance of survival.

There are endless examples of pregnancy complications that are sometimes not detected until after the 20th week. There are no legal late term elective abortions, and restrictions only further devastate women whose wanted pregnancies go awry.