JULIAN ASSANGE: Sweden still unclear

Discussion in 'Western Europe' started by Thingamabob, Jun 10, 2019.

  1. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    I think this is a better explanation, perhaps the best available, of the story of Assange in Sweden and England.

    https://www.abc.net.au/4corners/sex-lies-and-julian-assange/4156420

    All rendered moot, as the criminals in the British government have now rendered Julian to Washington.
     
  2. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Donor

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    So the UK has finally signed the papers for Assange to be extradited to the US.

    Why am I not surprised?
     
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  3. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Donor

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    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019
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  4. MrFirst

    MrFirst Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I'm sure your opinion about independence of UK judicial system is seriously exeggerated.
    Assange will be extradited very soon.
     
  5. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well the way that people have been saying from the beginning they should fight it is on it being political. Sometimes our courts do go against the Government. For instance the Government has tried to bring in laws making it illegal for English and Welsh councils to engage in BDS. English courts have said we are a Democracy and as such have the right to our own political views so it is up to people to go by their conscience. We also had a man taking his College Union to court because they criticised Israel and that hurt his feelings. He said he felt Israel was part of him so he claimed that meant to criticise Israel was antisemitic. The court disagreed and suggested he stay away from these meetings if they hurt his feelings so much. To them free political discussion was part of a Democracy. They have given up trying to get English courts to do this work (the Justice system is different in Scotland and England)

    I know people say the courts will answer to the Government and I know the first Judge really showed he was not non biased on this. However I believe it can be won on law and if it can be won on law it can. In particular we have laws against talking about cases which are coming before the courts. People have been talking about Assange for the past 7 years. I have a suspicion that even under that they might be able to say it is wrong to bring him to court - that they cannot be expected to be able to make an unbiased decision on whether it is right to extradite him. I think it probably depends on who the judge(s) are and how good his team are. I don't see it as a closed case though I know some people do. There are so many things which could make a difference and given that I think he has the right to appeal - that could make it go on for years. Also how much of a check and balance the English court system is - well I guess that is as much what is on trial here as Assange. I know several years ago when there was work going on to try and get the UK genuinely democratic, the English Justice system was one area which was worked on before Blair gave up on trying to secure democracy for the UK and chose instead neo liberalism.
     
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  6. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I'll tell you one thing though, journalists need to get behind Assange or admit and accept that they are just tools for the Regime to use.

    British Veterans for Peace support Assange



    http://vfpuk.org/articles/costs-of-war/julian-assange-vfp-uk-statement/
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019
  7. zer0lis

    zer0lis Active Member

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    Not trying to be rude and I certainly don't know much about the judicial system of the UK, but you are hoping too much. Way too much hope.

    There are also American posters who said something along the line that 'assange should be in no trouble at the trial if he is innocent because we have a independent justice system'(someone did post it with a tone like judicial system works with no gov interference because they are 'the US' not some banana republic).

    It is amazing for me how much trust for the state you people have. Maybe I'm just an outsider and I have no first hand xp, but let me tell you I am amazed but also feel pity. I think it's desilutional at a climax. They can't possibly comprehend that the system was or can be hijacked. Not in a million years, because 'murica. I imagine sometimes If I was their ruler, some of the most docile and trustful citizens I can wish for are the people like them. A perfect birthplace for tiranny to spawn.

    I really hope with all my heart I am wrong. I hope like you do. Time will tell.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019
  8. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I think both you and Mr First are overestimating my belief that this will go well for Assange. I simply do not hold with your belief that it is a certainty that he will not get a fair trial. Oh and by the way I do not live in England. It is not my courts which he will be tried in.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2019
  9. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    This article while believing he will not get a fair trial also advocates journalists and others making their voice heard. I also mentioned that in an earlier post. I simply do not believe as some of you do that Assange is already on death row in the States or starting 175 years in jail.

    https://www.theglobeandmail.com/wor...ion-case-begins-in-london-but-supporters-say/

    (someone once took the time and was thanked for letting me know he would not actually spend all the 175 years in jail!!)
     
  10. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    This is the current situation

    https://www.business-standard.com/a...ion-to-come-before-courts-119061300680_1.html

    Javid, possibly more than anyone else would be the person to approve as quickly as possible but there is a long way to go yet. Passing this on to the court does not create a certainty that Assange will find himself extradited.
     
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  11. Poohbear

    Poohbear Well-Known Member

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    To the Left "rape" can be an unwanted kiss, a sexist remark or any other male-interest activity
    your typical campus liberal woman deems to be so.

    In Assang's case it's not rape. It's uh... what would we call it?
    SHE said Assange forced her legs apart
    SHE said Assange forced his you-know-what into her you-know-what
    SHE said she called upon Assange to stop, and he didn't.

    But... somehow to confused Lefties, it isn't rape because Assange was against American Imperialists
    (not Chinese or Russian land-grabbing Imperialism, mind you.)
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2019
  12. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well you have an alternative news source which is telling you porkies. Can't do anything about that. The truth has now been well reported.
     
  13. Poohbear

    Poohbear Well-Known Member

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    What I loved about that rape case leak was that Assange didn't deny it, he
    TOOK OFFENSE AT ITS PUBLICATION.
    Assange's privacy is one thing, the death of people identified in his leaked
    documents is another.
     
  14. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Donor

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    Do we have to start a separate thread specifically on the topic as it relates to the "sexual violation" allegations and the peculiar elements of Swedish law?

    It seems like it, because people keep bringing up this issue.

    First of all, there are multiple pieces of evidence, including things in the account from the woman's own story, that indicate this was not a "real" rape.
    Second of all, she was sleeping in the same bed as Assange, and they were in a short-term sexual relationship, had already recently had consensual sex, etc.
    Third, even on top of all that, there is some fairly good reason to suspect that the woman's testimony about what did happen may not be entirely true.
    (Even if it were all true, it would never be prosecuted as a rape in a country like the US due to the particular circumstances surrounding the alleged act)

    When people think about the type of situation the word "rape" typically refers to, this is the farthest thing from that.

    Not going to waste any more time arguing with the mentally obstinate in this thread, if you want to further argue about it, let's start a new thread completely devoted to that discussion.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2019
  15. Poohbear

    Poohbear Well-Known Member

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    ps "'Protesting peacefully" ? Gaza fired over 600 rockets into Israel recently;
    plus the incendiary kites to set fire to the country and snipers shot several
    Israeli soldiers.
    Gazans can't use tunnels to kill or kidnap Israelis anymore, but they still
    possess rocket-propelled grenades and anti-tank missiles.
    The kids perform the usual function of appealing to the Western Media,
    and Western fools.
     
  16. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Ok Craig Murray is providing a little more information. Now he was saying since the beginning that if people believe that the English courts will look at this in an unbiased way they are wrong.

    Here is what he had to say

    https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2019/06/the-broader-view-reveals-the-ugliest-of-prospects/

    Though I would have thought that if someone had such obvious bias and people knew they would have contested her right to prescribe this case. Perhaps that may come out later if appropriate.

    I also noticed that Assange's team were claiming the right to free speech. From what I have gathered though this would be a good position for US courts, in order to stop him being extradited from the UK, they would be better arguing for his right for Political freedom.
     
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  17. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Ok Craig Murray is providing a little more information. Now he was saying since the beginning that if people believe that the English courts will look at this in an unbiased way they are wrong.

    Here is what he had to say

    https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2019/06/the-broader-view-reveals-the-ugliest-of-prospects/

    Though I would have thought that if someone had such obvious bias and people knew they would have contested her right to prescribe this case. Perhaps that may come out later if appropriate.

    I also noticed that Assange's team were claiming the right to free speech. From what I have gathered though this would be a good position for US courts, in order to stop him being extradited from the UK, they would be better arguing for his right for Political freedom.
     
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  18. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  19. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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  20. Poohbear

    Poohbear Well-Known Member

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    It's a pity Pilger doesn't go visit other prisoners and call attention to their plight -
    prisoners who didn't rape or steal. He might like to go visit the protestors in Hong
    Kong, or the suffering in Venezuela, or political prisoners in Vietnam, or dissidents
    in North Korean gulags, or Muslims in China or .... oh wait, these people aren't
    on Pilger's side.

    John-Pilger-Vietnam.jpg
     
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2019
  21. Poohbear

    Poohbear Well-Known Member

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    This protestor with no limbs:
    Was he in a school bus that was boarded by someone with a nail bomb?
    Was he peacefully sipping coffee in a restaurant torn apart by a suicide bomber?
    Maybe he was in his school playground when a rocket hit?
    Maybe he was badly burnt when incendiary kites set fire to his parent's farm?
    Could he have been caught trying to stab a civilian?
    Maybe he was driving a car that tried to crash into crowds of women and children?
    Was he in the crowd threatening to slit the throats of all the Jews?

    .. or maybe he was one of many Gazan kids who were crushed or suffocated when they were sent
    to dig tunnels into Israel?
     
  22. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Eleuthera likes this.
  23. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Quit bringing your anti muslim propaganda into this thread.
     
  24. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    your talking gibberish nonsense again nothing to do with this thread.
     
  25. Poohbear

    Poohbear Well-Known Member

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