Mandela's "Legacy"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_South_African

Yet, somehow, South Africa is portrayed as a diversity success story because of Nelson Mandela. They compare him to Gandhi because he didn't seek vengeance after his long prison sentence. Well, it looks like a bloodbath wasn't necessary. All he needed to do was employ policies that the left would implement in any Western country - reserve 80% of new jobs for black people, forcing whites below the poverty line and into a struggle for survival. Then, do nothing as whites are targeted for robbery, rape, and murder by the country's black population, who, in keeping with left-wing victimhood mentality, feel "entitled" to take from those who have more than they do and to punish their enemies. It's this same mindset that allowed Barack Obama to win reelection in 2012.

But let's hear again about how great Mandela was.

 

if you like your necklace, you can keep your necklace.... PERIOD

 

I have never been discriminated against even being a white guy. Having a good education and needed job skills does have its perks.

No I don't, but folks have to be accountable for their actions. Whites oppressed blacks for a long time, now they are getting a small dose of their own medicine.

 

Would you prefer South Africa become like Rhodesia and the congo
You must realize how much the blacks suffered under white rule

 

What does this example of online braggadocio have to do with the fact that you just said you support 80% of new jobs being reserved for black people? If that were in effect in this country, you would be discriminated against. You would only have 20% of the available jobs open to you.

So as a self-described white man, you oppressed blacks? You deserve a taste of your own medicine?

Your two wrongs make a right reasoning is very telling.

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Isn't that how debates typically function?

 

No, which is why I think South Africa would have been better off to continue the apatheid Government. Rhodesia was once an economic engine of Africa. Now look at it.

And now whites are suffering under black rule, as shown in the OP.

 

The USA has it's own racial issues and some of these are still playing out today. Reconstruction didn't really accomplish much in the black plight in the USA. Mandela on the other hand united a country. As for being only eligible or 20% of jobs, well I have job skills and an education that is pretty high in demand. I wouldn't worry too much. However many folks leave countries for the USA and other first world nations for economic opportunity. If I felt oppressed enough I would consider leaving and going somewhere else.

Have I personally? No. But the whole "I didn't do it, my parents did or grand parents did " doesn't fly. Is an oppressed person supposed to just say "oh okay because you didn't oppress me but your parents did you get a pass!"

I guess. I just acknowledge that actions have consequences. That can be applied to personal interactions or societies.

 

Good for you, but you would still be discriminated against when only 20% of the jobs are available to you based on your race. >>>INSULT REMOVED<<<
This is a very good example of what progressives mean when they speak of "equal rights".

That "oppressed person" isn't oppressed, their parents or grandparents were. The person they hope to oppress in retaliation didn't oppress them. Amazing logic, here.

Is there currently any black person in your field unemployed? Wouldn't it be morally right to take your job and give it to them, since your parents or grandparents may have oppressed their parents or grandparents? Would you be up for that?

Oppressing a group today because of past injustices is not a natural consequence. The natural consequence is to do nothing and see what happens. You aren't in favor of that. You want punishment to be applied (but not to yourself, of course).

 

an economic engine of Africa that benefited only the whites

Obviously you do not realize how bad it was under apartheid

 

It benefitted the whole country. Is that area in better shape now or 60 years ago?

It was bad for some, good for others. It's bad for whites now, and these countries are falling apart.

 

Yep. Passing laws to do away with the system in place that was basically Jim Crowe on steroids is my view.

Really? So ending the apartheid or slavery in the USA fixed everything? What about Jim Crowe that resulted afterwards?

I would be glad to give a black person my job, when I vacate it for another better job. See the best countries have equal opportunity, and a black person could do my job. Unlike a apartheid system where they couldn't because they were guilty of being black. A system which you admitted you support in post 7 of this thread.

But people have oppressed others in the past, some kind of restitution is only fair. People don't change over night. When Lincoln freed try slaves, did the slave owners start taking off the chains that day?

 

How can you disagree with Jim Crowe? We've established that you are not opposed to racial discrimination &#8212; it's just an issue of who benefits from it.

Which blacks are currently dealing with the harmful effects of slavery? Name them.

No, how about right now? That unemployed person is unemployed right now and can't wait for your to finish up. Isn't this about righting wrongs?

So, the "best countries have equal opportunity", when you just finished saying that you support a country that keeps 80% of jobs available for one race, and only 20% to the other race. Your position and rhetoric are completely inconsistent.

People are oppressing people right now. In South Africa, for example, there is widespread oppression, but you are in support of it. What kind of restitution should the South African whites receive, in your opinion?

 

It only matters if it's bad on white people. Let's not forget that part.

 

And it doesn't matter at all when it's bad on white people, hence your lack of concern for the white South Africans mentioned in the OP.

 

Who says I have no concern? Mine is just not predicated on the color of someone's skin like yours is. Which is fine. You are free to care about anything you like for whatever reasons you like.

 

Your only contribution to the thread is to chastise someone for being concerned over the situation of white South Africans, who are being ignored in favor of celebrating Nelson Mandela's legacy. That's a fairly compelling indication of your level of concern over the situation.

 

I clearly stated I was fine with you caring about anything you wish for whatever reasons you wish. That is the exact opposite of chastising you. Pointing out that you would not care if the folks were black is just stating a fact. You know it and I know it. I'm fine with it, but let's not pretend otherwise.

 

The whites are not being as treated as bad as the blacks were under apartheid

 

As I said, your only contribution in this thread was to mock someone's concern over the white South Africans mentioned in the OP. That is a fairly compelling indication of your lack of concern over these people. Let's not pretend otherwise.

 

Well, they don't have it as good as they did under apartheid. That is a problem for some.......

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Please link to a post where I said I did not care about them.

 

That sounds like an objective opinion to me. I don't think nearly a million blacks emigrated out of Rhodesia in less than 2 decades when whites started ruling. Maybe you could refresh my memory.

And it seems that not all blacks in Zimbabwe thought whites ruling Rhodesia was a bad thing:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1570403/Zimbabweans-praise-generous-Ian-Smith.html

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Read the article I just posted. I guess they must be wrong if you say so.

Your only contribution in this thread was to mock someone's concern over the white South Africans mentioned in the OP. That is a fairly compelling indication of your lack of concern over these people.

 

That is not an opinion but a fact and if you think whites have it as bad in South Africa
As blacks had it under white rule
I do have an opinion that you known very little about what went on in South Africa and Rhodesia under white rule
Although I dislike discussing Rhodesia on a thread about South Africa
I will say the blacks in Rhodesia had nowhere to go

 

Jim Crowe was more then just discrimination.

All and none. In the United States we have equal opportunity for all. Some classes are protected for things such as race/gender, but the barriers are coming down. The legacy of slavery will be with the USA as long as there is a country, but at the same time we as a society are much removed from it.

Why would I give someone my job?

I am not sure how it is inconsistent. For the nonwhite populuation in South Africa, measures have had to be put in place. In time those measures will go away just like we are seeing in the USA.

Who is being oppressed? Whites? No they should not get resisution. That is like giving the master his whip back.

 

It's not a "fact" at all. You're making a judgment call over which group had it worse, blacks in Rhodesia vs whites in modern-day South Africa. Your judgment call is not factually based.

Blacks were prevented from leaving Rhodesia? How?