Trump Seeks New $15 Billion Subsidy To Protect Farmers From His Own Trade War

And here's as Paul Harvey used to say, "the rest of the story". To quote you "context is your friend".

"China’s GDP will overtake the U.S. level in 2030 at these projected average growth rates:"

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2016-us-vs-china-economy/

 

I specifically asked how you would force China to end tariffs on U.S. goods. You had nothing. Tariffs on their goods is an attempt to force them to drop tariff on ours.

 

And what would these painless strategic policies be?

 

Ok going into dumb down mode.
The claim was that china has been screwing us for decades leading to imbalanced trade. I show that during that period Americans have enjoyed continuous increase in standard of living. It would appear that, as economics experts have predicted, trade deficits do not have a negative affect on an economy. Sorry, I used a few multi-syllable words.

 

Are you implying that none exist? I am not an expert in trade but I have to believe there must be a way without using a nuclear option.

 

You asked me how to balance the trade deficit .. and I responded to this question (since this was what was being discussed in the post you were responding to).

You also asked how to get them to reduce tariffs. I did not respond to this. What Chinese tariffs are you referring to ?

 

The cold war was an entirely different conflict and Reagan handled it beautifully. He was also a staunch believer in free trade. My point was that to the extent the Chinese are acting unfairly it doesn't appear to be hurting Americans. The IP problem needs to be addressed but I feel strongly that a full blown trade war is not the way to fix it.

 

We dont import food from china

We import cell phones and other items that the poor may want but do not need to live

A big screen tv is an extra not a life or death necessity

 

I honestly don't know.

Same here, and to be fair none of this would be necessary if the Chinese weren't intent on screwing us over. From what I've read, hardliners in Beijing have recently decided to tell us to go f*ck ourselves. They prefer to continue robbing our country, manipulating their currency and shunning free and fair trade policies - i.e., waging economic warfare against the United States - to the alternative.

Wonderful people we're dealing with...

 

China is using the economic leverage that previous presidents STUPIDLY gave them or allowed them to keep toforce Americans to buy their cheep chinese junk

And if we dont they will try to ruin our farmers

Thats how mercantilism is used as a weapon by stronger countries against weaker countries

 

I suspect you are chinese so I will say that greedy American liberals want you to pollute your country and the rest of the world so they can have slightly cheaper electronic trinkets

And if it were not harming America by taking jobs and hollowing out our industrisl base I would not care what you do to your own country

 

I blame both democrat and republican swamp rats in washingtion for the bad trade deals that all but destroyed the industrial base that won WWII

But the pushback today is coming from lib never trumpsters

They want trump to fail even if it means china wins

 

Reagan did handle the Russkies masterfully and Trump will never be able to hold a candle to him, but I'm beginning to think Reagan only closed the Soviet front in the Cold War while the one with China is reigniting. Furthermore, Reagan had the advantage of dealing with a Soviet Union that was in a state of irreversible decline while today we're dealing with an ascending and increasingly confident and assertive China. Obviously, we're dealing with two entirely different adversaries here.

Fair enough. Thanks for your answer.

 

You are just repeating nonsense fed to you by Trump. Just because Trump says "were winning, were winning" over an over like some broken record .. does not make it true.

I blame both swamps as well but it was not "bad trade deals" that destroyed our industrial base for the most part. These deals had something to do with it but the majority of the blame lies elsewhere.

Trump has not addressed the biggest cause of outsourcing = favorable tax status of international corporations over US corporations. Trump is doing major long term damage to our long term economic prosperity.

Going around the world starting trade wars is not going to fix the deficit problem - massive fiscal irresponsibility on the part of Trump.

Trumps trade wars are not going to fix the problem of a total military spend that exceeds 1 Trillion dollars.
Repealing and replacing Obamacare is not going to fix our 3.5 Trillion dollar annual healthcare spend.
Trump increasing the deficit -at a time when the economy is doing well in a rising interest rate environment - is not going to fix our debt problem
Trump shifting the tax burden from the wealthy to the middle class is not going to help our long term economic security.

I can't stand the lib's but, reality is reality.

 

Let me refresh your memory

 

Got it - what tariffs are you referring to ? Was there tariffs on Pork, Soybeans and what was that tariff - and how did this compare with the tariff's we had on Chinese goods ?

 

So first you say "more and better paying jobs don't reduce poverty" and you follow that with "trade deficits do not have a negative affect on an economy."
At least you're consistent.

 

"China imposes much higher tariffs on United States exports than the United States imposes on China. China’s average tariff rate is nearly three times higher than the average United States rate. Certain products are even more imbalanced, for instance, the United States charges a 2.5 percent tariff on Chinese cars, while China currently maintains a 25 percent tariff on cars from the United States."

But wait there's more.

"China has banned imports of United States agricultural products such as poultry, cutting off America’s ranchers and farmers from a major market for their goods. China has dumped and unfairly subsidized a range of goods for the United States market, undermining America’s domestic industry. In 2018 alone, the Trump Administration has found dumping or unfair subsidies on 13 different products, including steel wheels, cold-drawn mechanical tubing, tool chests and cabinets, forged steel fittings, aluminum foil, rubber bands, cast iron soil pipe and fittings, and large diameter welded pipe. In January 2018, the Trump Administration found that China’s overproduction of steel and aluminum, and the resulting impact on global markets, is a circumstance that threatens to impair America’s national security. The United States has run a trade in goods deficit with China for years, including a $375 billion deficit in 2017 alone."


Still not enough?

"The cost of China’s intellectual property theft costs United States innovators billions of dollars a year, and China accounts for 87 percent of counterfeit goods seized coming into the United States.

The United States Trade Representative’s (USTR) Section 301 investigation identified four of China’s aggressive technology policies that put 44 million American technology jobs at risk:

• Forced technology transfer;
• Requiring licensing at less than economic value;
• Chinese state-directed acquisition of sensitive United States technology for strategic purposes; and
• Outright cyber theft.

China uses foreign ownership restrictions, administrative review, and licensing processes to force or pressure technology transfers from American companies. China also requires foreign companies that access their New Energy Vehicles market to transfer core technologies and disclose development and manufacturing technology. They impose contractual restrictions on the licensing of intellectual property and technology by foreign firms into China, but does not put the same restrictions on contracts between two Chinese enterprises.

China directs and facilitates investments in and acquisitions of United States companies to generate large-scale technology transfer.

China conducts and supports cyber intrusions into United States computer networks to gain access to valuable business information so Chinese companies can copy products."

https://www.conservativedailynews.c...trump-confronts-chinas-unfair-trade-policies/

As you can see it's tariffs and numerous other free trade issues trump is attempting to fix here. Your better way than imposing retaliatory tariffs on their goods is?

 

Lets stick to tariffs.

Your article giving 2.5% is from some dude on a pro Trump website which is fine but ... This article from Bloomberg says US tariffs on Chinese vehicles is 27.5%.

The difference may be that your article is from May 2018 and Mine is from Dec 2019.

https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/china-moves-on-u-s-car-tariff-cut-trump-tweeted-about-1.1181472

I have never seen a Chinese car in the US - have you ? From what I can tell - and what the article seems to suggest - is that China does not yet sell cars in the US. This makes this example ridiculous as tariffs tend to increase as market share increases.

"China has banned imports of Poultry" - This is disingenuous. China did a ban in 2015 during the avian flue epidemic. Last year it dropped duties on white feathered broiler chickens - not sure when sales of these resumed. The US however does not allow China to sell chickens here -and never has the US opened its markets up to Chinese chickens.

So far this is a whole lot of nothing. We sell a whole lot of Cars and Chickens to China but China does not sell any Cars and Chickens here in the US.

This does not mean there may not be other things but the above is a big nothing -burger with respect to "fair trade" IMO. Complaining that China does not allow us to sell them Chickens when we do not allow China to sell us Chickens .. is nonsensical.

When it comes to "made in china" consumer electronics - which amounts to much of the trade deficit. Most of this stuff is from US companies where the China value add is 1-2% as posted previously.

Using proper math - and the using the less conservative figure (2%) 1 Billion in US goods going to china is roughly equal to 50 Billion in Chinese goods coming here - if these goods are consumer electronics.

 

This is the problem that I have with the tariffs, I don't have a problem with placing the tariffs on China, hell I want Trump to hit them over the head with tariffs. But this 15 bill will go to Agribusiness and not family farms. It is not like he is letting farmworkers collect unemployment from work on family farms of less than 5 employees.

 

I have a serious problem with protectionism - as all knowledgeable free market minded individuals do. This is not to say that tariffs are not sometimes warranted .. they are but, not on the basis of political gamesmanship.

 

Why stick to tariffs, tariffs are jut the hammer

 

Then you have a problem with China's protectionism.

 

Tell it to the Rust Belt.