US Muslims: this is worse than after 9/11

This is true. Unfortunately, some of them went to fight for ISIS. Nevertheless, USA government likes Saudi Arabia Muslims and does not want to see human rights violations in this country. All that radicalism is spewing out of Saudi Arabia and other UAE countries and this is OK with our government. Our government hates secular dictator Bashar Assad. Putin wants to eradicate terrorism worldwide, but our government is reluctant to destroy ISIS. Why this is so? http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world...fight-after-mali-attack/ar-BBnhwAL?li=BBnb7Kz

 

WTF?

 

14 years? Is that all?

The East has been under the Western boot for a much longer time.

 

I think you have that wrong. It is the ugly radical Islamist terrorists that are beheading and killing Christians, not the other way around.

As far as Muslims in America "being impacted by . . . " What about the Christians in Syria who are being 'cleansed' from Syria?

 

What the (*)(*)(*)(*) are you talking about?

 

exactly, blame the cult, not the religion. As Richard Silverstein says in this article anyone could do exactly the same with either Christianity or Judaism - just picking the awful bits out

His article puts the extremist organisations into perspective

http://jfjfp.com/?p=78179

Excellent article for those who can be bothered to read it.

The West is making two mistakes 1) blaming all Muslims and 2) the way we have been trying to resolve the issue since 9/11 which has done exactly the opposite but people are still crying for more of the same which will no doubt result in more of the same.

ISIS may be barbaric but they do not appear to be stupid. Indeed I read that they had studied all the different forms of terrorism/guerilla war and believed they had found the best collection - one of their interests is to get Muslims in the west living in terror. The sort of thing the 68 attacks in Scotland in the last few days produces, people feeling scared, resentful and blamed for something which has nothing to do with them. They hope for that to get them a few more recruits, another terrorist act, worst treatment of the West's Muslims and on and on as it was before with Jews - except that their hope is that muslims will either become involved in terrorism here or even better be so scared that they go back and join them. I remember reading at the Breivik time that Islam extremists, wasn't ISIS then but Islam extremists and Muslim haters both want the same thing - Muslims deported from the West and this is years before any attack in France - France just gives a feeling that it is justified and of course being a prolonged recession which we may not come out of is ripe for such picking on the other.

I put in another thread some research done in Africa which suggests that religion though a part is not nearly as significant a part as people wish to believe. If we want to solve the issue we need to give up on our desire to blame all Muslims for the actions of some and start looking at how the hell they get their recruits. Then we can start looking for the way to resolve this.

By the way about six months ago I was reading that top US experts also believe now that Islamic terrorism is just the same as any other kind of terrorism, that is it is motivated by politics not religion. That included experts who had previously been selling the religious line.

link to research on what gets people to join these groups.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/26/extremism-kenya-somalia-research

 

By giving them some slack, I mean we were extremely hesitant to fault all of Islam for the 9/11 attacks. We blamed it on a few mass murderers.

But now radical Islam is growing and metasticizing. We're starting to believe the problem wasn't just a few idiots. The problem is Islam.

 

So what happened between 9/11 and now that might have caused that growth?

 

Yes, and nobody does panic-stricken hysteria quite like our right-wing American chums.

 

America finds itself, once again, accused of duplicity; on the one hand it utterly condemns the horrifying brutality of Jihadist beheadings while on the other hand turning a blind-eye to the beheadings and human rights abuses of the Saudi royalty.

- - - Updated - - -

There are several 'Christian' terrorist groups doing no different in Africa to Muslim victims. They are no more 'Christian' than ISIS are 'Muslim'. This lot are just one of them doing 'God's work': http://www.commdiginews.com/world-n...an-terror-groups-attack-african-muslims-9691/

Perhaps one day the world will be free of the curse of 'faith' and religions will die out. We can but hope.

 

Worse ?? Mmmmmm.... No.
Muslim Arabs have 22 countries ..
Americans are not stupid as the Europians.
I hope

 

US posters would be wise to completely ignore what European liberals have to say on the subject of immigration and Muslims. You follow their appeasing ways and you are going to bitterly regret it within 20 years or so. Then it will be too late to rectify the problem.

For heaven’s sake, it's not a nuclear science. Saudi Arabia is still financing all sorts of Sunni terror groups and religious schools which teach hatred across the globe. The spread of violent Wahhabism and their teachings directly correlates to spread of terror. All they teach Sunni Muslims is hate. Hate for everyone else who is not like them.

 

You're probably right about religion; but don't hold your breath that it will die out. I write this as I'm listening to Christmas carols--now playing: We Three Kings. I love them music.

My sister is a fundamentalist Christian. If somewhere in the Bible it said to kill innocent people and you can go to heaven, she would be killing innocent people. Radical religion seems to usurp common sense. Up next:
Have Yourself a Merry Little Christmas

 

Christmas carols with still a month to go before the gluttony and 'niceness' begins.

 

You're being offensive...Shouldn't you be writing Season greetings carols not to offend sensitive minorities from some exotic countries. Also don't forget to greet people with Season Greetings instead of Merry Christmas. And make sure that you 'bully' the school director not to have a nativity play as it may offend some immigrants.

 

You might also be interested in the Rand study about how terrorist organizations end.

http://www.politicalforum.com/terrorism/433088-us-military-only-has-7-chance-defeating-isis.html

Since only 7% are ever defeated by the military it makes sense that ISIS would go for a military option to create their caliphate state.

The disruptive threat that ISIS poses to the western nations must be dealt with by InterPol and intelligence. That is the best means we have (43%) to stop what they currently doing.

It is highly unlikely that ISIS is interested in a political settlement of any kind but if it does then it is going to have to reach it with the other middle eastern states. That is unrealistic IMO so they will have to take and hold whatever ground they want to lay claim to for their own caliphate state. It will be up to the rest of the ME states to decide how they want to deal with that but the West would be foolish to put troops in there again since the current unstable situation is as a result of western meddling and warmongering.

The smart move is to contain the problem to the ME and allow them to fight their own battles and then deal with whatever is left standing afterwards.

 

They could learn a thing from England who endured horrendous IRA attacks, and did so with a fair bit of stoicism (aside from the occasional overreaction we won't get into here). You didn't even in the darkest days consider barring Irish from England or putting them on lists sorted by religion or closing their churches

 

Nice attempt at sarcasm. No, I don't do Christmas and its phony one day a year bonhomie, just like I don't do religion or superstition. If I offend anyone for their annual jaunt into hypocrisy, gluttony and conspicuous over-consumption I couldn't give a rat's arse, frankly.

 

Admirable. And I also enjoyed Surfer's sarcasm too.

Me, I enjoy the annual bout of gluttony, alcoholicly induced stupor and all round incorrigible over consumption while listening to Christmas carols amid the usual chaos and barminess of the annual family get together. It takes me a year to recover.

 

I find this to be a very simplistic, almost child-like, view of this, and yet, I cannot completely disagree with it either.

After the 911 attacks, the Muslim world did a (*)(*)(*)(*)-poor job of showing that it even cared about the dead.
Since then, over 27,000 terror attacks, more than 99.98% of them caused by Islamist bastard terrorists, have dirtied our wonderful planet and cost us a lot of lives, the majority of them Muslim lives.

So, though I do think that the situation is more complex than you state, I cannot disagree with the statement about patience wearing thin. Because none of this is solace to the families of the innocents so brutally slain in Paris, the city of love, at the hands of people who literally swear by the Kuran. It's not enough for US Muslims, who were like molasses in January after the 911 attacks, to suddenly, after years of silence, say "hey, those aren't really Muslims", because that is just bull(*)(*)(*)(*). Those terrorists ARE Muslims and they are engaging in a very literal interpretation of Kuran and Hadith. Goes to show once again that fundamentalists rarely do our world good.

So, you win support in a corner you never imagined possible: from me. My patience has finally run out. There are Salafists who have a Mosque just 1 KM from where my daugher goes to school and I don't like it one damned bit. I don't like it because many of those Salafists have already been arrested for verifiable ties to El Quäida. I don't like it one bit because already, my daughter has heard fellow pupils who are Muslims say some very gross things about Jews and Jewry, something that is a major offense where I live. I don't like it one damned bit.

Where in the frack were all the moderate Muslims 14 years ago?

Like I said, my patience is now gone. And I am generally considered a Liberal.

 

After 9-11, we were shown videos of Muslims, dancing in the streets and told Osama would NOT be turned over to the US. Saudis were given permission to return home, during a period, no flights were allowed nation wide and only because Bush43 made his appearance in NYC, telling the World what he was going to do....did American's relax.

I don't think this is a Democrat/Republican or a Conservative/Liberal issue, rather a proud to be American issue. The question then is, what's the future. I'm not clear/sure what a "Moderate Muslim" actually is or maybe that it's definition is still to far from acceptance, by most American's, or to near the terrorist definition, that their is only one clear way to bring the issue to it's inevitable climax and Mr. Obama IMO, will never allow that ending most of us American's could accept.

 

I know of only one video, and that was of palis dancing in the streets. I have never seen a second, similar video vis-a-vis 911, to this date. Just to note.

I agree with you WHOLEHEARTEDLY that this is not, or rather, should not be a partisan issue in terms of D/R, L/C as you outlined. We are talking about the lives of potentially millions of innocent people all around the world. Does anyone here think that if ISIS could get it's hand on a portable nuke, it wouldn't use it? Sure they would, because they are ineducable barbarians, plain and simple.

Now, as to Pres. Obama, I am not sure what you mean. It is clear to you that he, like any other US-American president, is hated among radical islamists, right? I really don't think this is about Obama at all.

The damned shame in all of this is that there really ARE refugees, people whose lives have been torn out from under them, people who have first had to suffer enormously under Assad and now, under ISIS. Many of them are bright, eager, willing to learn and could actually become model citizens in a functioning Republic like the USA or a number of European states. But there is indeed (and I give some very loud Conservatives right, here) the possibility that a number of ISIS soldiers have embedded themselves among the refugees. Only, it would be a terribly stupid thing to do. The refugee process, especially in the USA, takes years. That would be a very, very slow route for a terrorist who wants to act now. So, although I concede that it's possible, I see no logic in it. We cannot and we should not turn our backs on people in need. The entire idea of American being formed was so that people from Europe could escape persecution. Essentially, the first generation of Europeans on American soil were: refugees.

 

I've mentioned this many times, but why would a Muslim Terrorist, want to put an end to Obama's Presidency, which any successful major attack in the US, would do. IMO, even Ms. Clinton, would have listened to her advisors, long ago and never let ISIS form, whether or not the troops were removed.

On the refugees, again Obama is padding ISIS actions, wanting to allow 10k to 250K (pick your source)so called refugees into the US. I keep hearing 3% would be of fighting ages, most women and for some reason "Little Children" 3 year olds according to Obama. I've seen many videos of these migrants, none under at least 10 were alone, very few women and I'd bet 75% were of fighting ages and ISIS doesn't seem to have a problem training young boy's or messing with little girl's. In all honesty, few Muslim's IMO have problems with a lot of ISIS's moral opinions.

I do understand the old theory of accepting refugees or migrants, but keep in mind the US accepted none legally for a good share of the early 20th Century and a lot of domestic problems, does come from illegal's now in the US. Yes, I consider mass acceptance of refugees, that can't be vetted, as illegal's, because many will not change their minds or accept American values, any more than I would accept theirs. Sorry if I seem a bit crude, but things have change over the decades, IMO so should policy....

 

All the US muslims do is whine about being afraid they will be treated unfairly.

If the muslims in the US want to change peoples attitude about them then they should stop spending their time whining and spend time visibly protesting ISIS, muslim terrorists and fanatics. They should be cooperating with the police and turn in their radicalized members. They should be marching in the streets shouting "America is Great! Death to ISIS!".

But they don't. Until they do, US muslims are suspect and deserve to be evicted from the US.

 

But they do. Where do you think the information comes from that allows the FBI to thwart attacks and make arrests?

Give me a break. Do you do that?