US to accuse Russia of complicity in Syrian chemical attack: report

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by litwin, Apr 9, 2017.

  1. litwin

    litwin Banned

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    quote of the day "The trans-Atlantic allies this weekend were composing a plan to demand that Russia halt military support for Assad and let Syria transition to a new government"

    Look like democracy and kleptocracy can not be allies (friends) even for a 1 month, as i predicted a huge changes are on the way, and one for sure Assadists time is counted. my qestion, will Putin back off from "Syria" or moves toward confrontation with EU/USA?


    http://nypost.com/2017/04/09/us-to-accuse-russia-of-complicity-in-syrian-chemical-attack-report/
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  2. litwin

    litwin Banned

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    bbc
     
  3. vis

    vis Well-Known Member

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    By new govenment NATO mean ISIS?

     
  4. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Ok so the ball is in Putin's court, perhaps he will negotiate for something he wants in exchange for dropping his support for Assad... I'm not sure but perhaps sanctions against Russia might be on the table?
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2017
  5. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Can't see that happening. Syria is his back yard. He has a naval base there. It looks like this is turning into a fight for control of the area - BBC were suggesting it may be about that yesterday.

    Here is the article on Russia's red line I mentioned in the other thread.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...ggressor-air-strikes-war-latest-a7675031.html
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2017
  6. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I'm not writing anything out the equation, Trump's policy has shifted, he is now listening to someone else and I think that someone is Erik Prince who've been in contact with the Russians pre inauguration and James Mattis. Both of which would explain America getting embroiled in war. Trump also many times expressed his desire to do away with sanctions, (prior to the Russian investigation) and on top of that he is a deal maker. For Putin, sanctions are choking the Russian economy and placing his leadership in jeopardy. I would think he would choose Russia above Assad.
     
  7. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No, I do not think it would be that easy. No one has suggested Prince's involvement in Trump's change of mind. The suggestion has been it was Jarad Kushner who got him to do the strike, going along with that, him becoming the top dog over Bannon - who I think was not for war with Syria. It would be a massive humiliation for Putin. He would lose all the prestige he has built up in recreating Russia as a world power and instead look a wimp. I think that could be a gamble which would have gross unintended consequences.

    Further the US are not the people who are doing most of the sanctions. It is Europe who is paying for that.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2017
  8. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Jared Kushner would not advise Trump on war matters and if he is then we should all be very very afraid, other issues... sure. If there's a suggestion Kushner advised Trump to do the strike I don't believe it, did he have an opinion on it... I'm sure he did. There is much history between Erik Prince and Trump, all through his election campaign, his sister receiving the education portfolio, the meeting in the Seychelles with Russia... more.

    Trump (not Europe btw) is threatening Russia with more sanctions, it's typical of him... using his threats as a bargaining chip. Europe might carry out the sanctions but let's not pretend it is not the US who implement them.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2017
  9. One Mind

    One Mind Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Trumps tremendous shift of beliefs and position is troubling. It means something nefarious is going on, IMO. No way in hell believes assad used gas, but that is the position he has been, IMO, forced to assume.

    Assad had the radicals on the run, peace talks were close, trump said he could stay, and then opposition forces or CIA pulled this false flag operation. Russia knows it is a ruse. And how do you transition assad out of power and insert a sunni who will turn it into a non secular state? Will Russia agree to this. Not IMO. For Russia is more at risk being closer and sharing borders with these muslims. This muslim problem is a big one for Russia. How can they afford to?

    Russia, china iran are allied with assad. If you want a war with a more modern military, then that is what we will face. I think Russia will dig her heels in, and there is no telling where this stupidity of the US will lead. Russia is already being hedged in by nato which they see as an enemy and a national security risk. So, back them in a corner and see what happens. All it takes is one mistake and its over with folks This is whey the US is indulging in the most irresponsible behavior ever seen, ever seen.
     
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  10. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The BBC had someone they were interviewing who was supposed to know about things. They suggested the Hawks had got to Trump. He said no, and said he believed in was Kushner. He would have an opinion due to his position on Israel to make it clear that the US was now on the same page as Israel. That is certainly how Israel has read it.

    http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/227936

    But of course he still would need the input of others once he had made the first change.

    Remember Trump's first reaction to hearing of the chemical attack was basically that that is Syria's business. Only he could change his mind so fast without blushing.

    Yes I know and his sister is the Education Minister. Jeremy Scahill has suggested Blackwater would be Trump's private army should he move down the fascist route - a fascism which would use as it's ideology the Christian Right which both of them are a part of.

    Your suggestions do not seem viable to me.

    We have both countries now threatening each other. Not good.

    You are saying the EU bows to the US. I don't think it is as easy as that. We are engaged in more trade with Russia, hence have more sanctions and sanctions cost both ways. Now I doubt if Europe would agree to more. It has hurt some people a lot.

    I am beginning to feel like I did during the cold war - watch out for that siren.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2017
  11. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Which one in particular, you're being vague.

    The one Erik Prince and James Mattis are advising him on war in favour of his son in law Kushner (who has zero experience in matters of war)
    The one where Trump may use Sanctions as a bargaining chip (which he already is btw http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/ct-syria-airstrikes-20170407-story.html)

    No I did not say the EU bows to Russia... where did you get that from?
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2017
  12. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The whole thing. If Trump is wanting Russia out the US is making a move for control of the area. Russia moving in was that but he had his naval base to protect. It's pretty much a not very stealth declaration of war.

    Your belief that Russia would be such a pushover that all you needed to do was offer a carrot or stick over sanctions when Russia has not been bothered by them up till now does not wash with me. Believing that Russia will allow itself to be humiliated over that does not wash. So whoever has thought it up, your view of what is going on, if it were, I absolutely cannot see it work. We have already got to both threatening each other.
     
  13. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Trump does not want Russia out... he wants Assad out, big difference.
     
  14. zoom_copter66

    zoom_copter66 Well-Known Member

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    And Putin had such high hopes for the marriage of convenience? So if it's confronting, that means more resources being allocated by Russia, ships, hardware, boots on ground, or. At same time sanctions? Almost like Custer's last stand?
     
  15. zoom_copter66

    zoom_copter66 Well-Known Member

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    If Assad's out, eventually Russia may have no choice, depends who comes next after Assad, and if they're Russia friendly?
     
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  16. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well let's be honest if you're going to take a stand you make sure it's a firm one.
     
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  17. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well he does not need to go and invade Syria and threaten it to get Assad out. Putin or someone else has said more than once that they would consider that.

    However what we have now is both of them threatening each other. That is something quite different. And he very well might not let Assad go. Russia needs to look after others in the area - for instance Iran and the idea of getting rid of Assad is not for humanitarian reasons it is to please Israel which brings us back to Kushner being the ear he was listening to.
     
  18. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I would think Putin's best option here is to "pick another puppet" and do it soon
     
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  19. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Where? Putin supports Assad this is what the whole fiasco is about.

    Iran doesn't need Putin to look after it, it has it's own agenda in Syria.

    So your logic is Russia looks after Iran and Kushner wants Assad out to keep Israel happy.... Im sorry but.... no, just no.
     
  20. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    "Haley: 'amazing' how Russia covers for Assad"

    Indeed.
     
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  21. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That would not work at all. The whole reason for getting rid of Assad is because of it's relationship with Iran - to get at Iran by getting at Syria. The puppet which would be suitable for Russia would not be the puppet which would be suitable to the US.
     
  22. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The reason for getting rid of Assad is the chemical weapons attack that occurred last week in Syria, Assad had a relationship with Iran for decades.... why out him now....and we circle back to the chemical weapons attack that occurred last week in syria

    That's why he needs to do it soon
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2017
  23. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    no several times it has been said that possibly Assad can go.
    Iran has been the next to go down after Syria. They just did not expect Syria to take so long. Who do you think will take over. Isis? I can remember reading somewhere that there was a reason why Assad has lasted so long - can't remember but he would not have if there were not.

    No I am just playing with ideas with you. My suggestion is the one with history. Are you unaware of that? but it is 2.40 am here so I am going to catch some sleep. Now has not Trump already warned Iran? I remember him doing it very early on.
     
  24. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Where... give me proof

    Russia and the US both wants to decimate ISIS and I don't use the word decimate lightly. ISIS will not be allowed to take over, they know this and are moving into Africa and Asia (particularly the Phillipines, Thailand and Indonesia who has the largest sunni muslim population in the world).

    Trump has made suggestions regarding war on Iran in the past but not Russia, they have a good relationship with Iran. I can't see that happening if he also gets embroiled in North Korea.

    my apologies but the ideas you are playing with is so grossly incorrect they border on being dangerous
     
  25. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No it is not. That is the excuse. Some people believe it was a false flag and I am beginning to think so to. What we have is the US getting into a confrontation mode - that is a mode which if it does not get the desired result will result in war with a nuclear power.

    Nope we circle back to Israel. This has swa to do with chemical weapons imo. Absolutely nothing. Assad has been using barrel bombs and starving people to death and god knows what and they are just about as bad. Like I say I am moving to thinking the chemical attack may be a false flag. This is not the reason. However the desire to please Israel and get at Iran (supposed nukes again) may very well be and the Republicans were promising war with Iran even when Trump was saying he was not going for such things.

    Scarlet witch if a President thinks that chemical weapons are sufficient to risk WW3 they do not first of all say it is none of the US's business which is basically what Trump said.

    He is misjudging Russia. A very big mistake but not a surprise.

    Thanks for the chat. I must go to bed now. :)
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2017

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