What Is Economic Fairness?

Actually, recognition of the problem that land is not rightly private property long antedated the Communist Manifesto. Locke recognized it nearly 200 years earlier and tried, but failed, to resolve it. Of course, because you cannot refute any of the arguments for equal rights to access what government, the community and nature provide, you have to pretend that there is no difference between that and Marx's advocacy of collective appropriation of what private labor provides. "Disingenuous" would be the most charitable word one could use to describe such rhetorical sleights-of-hand.

Marx and Engels actually borrowed this idea from previous economists like the French physiocrats. It was a well-known viewpoint at the time, and far from original with Marx, who merely used it to curry favor with people who knew about the problem of land. It had been advocated by the Chartist reformer Thomas Spencer and others many decades before the Manifesto was written. But Marx never paid much more attention to it than this mention in the 10-point plan.

Oh, and another of their "shocking" plans:

Outrageous! No children working in factories? The owners will be ruined, just to salve the consciences of fanatics!

 

But capitalism requires government to issue and enforce private titles to land. That directly contradicts the claim that government is a parasite.

<yawn> You are makin' $#!+ up again. The socialists who killed ~100M people in the 20th century all believed that 2+2=4. Does that mean 2+2=4 is false?

 

GARBAGE. We have to pay landowners full market value for access to it. Look at the prices of homes or rents near good public schools. "Free" public education is not free. We just have to pay private landowners for it instead of the school board.

But only once we have paid landowners full market value for everything government, the community and nature provide.

 

And the answer to this problem is of course to fund government out of the value its spending on desirable services and infrastructure creates, rather than stealing from producers:

"Men did not make the earth... It is the value of the improvements only, and not the earth itself, that is individual property... Every proprietor owes to the community a ground rent for the land which he holds." -- Thomas Paine

"Whenever there is in any country uncultivated lands and unemployed poor, it is clear that the laws of property have been so far extended as to violate natural right." --Thomas Jefferson

 

yep, Jefferson badly wanted everyone to own their own private land so they would be free and independent of govt and free to use it or sell their land as they saw fit. So??

 

you know nothing as always:

"Government interference in mercantilism—through taxes, regulations, price controls—hinders the activities of merchants and so prevents these natural laws of economics to take place; none of the benefits—increased wealth, increased productivity—will be realized by regulated mercantilism.

The Physiocrats argued, then, that government leave the economy alone and allow individuals within the economy to do as they please in attempting to realize their own selfish interests; this doctrine they called laissez faire, or "let them do."

Private property
None of the theories concerning the value of land could work without strong legal support for the ownership of private property. Combined with the strong sense of individualism, private property becomes a critical component of the Tableau's functioning.

 

Wow, what helpless ignorance of societal facts of history!

Let automatic weapons onto a free market and there will be daily gun fights in any town/city in the US where there is a heavy percentage of both the rich and poor.

Have you never heard of the Watts rebellion in 1965? It can't happen again, this time with everybody owning a Kalachnikov or a Bump-stock American made machine-gun?

You betcha - it can and will happen! And I truly hope it is the people like you who go down first in the resulting bloodshed because that is the ONLY WAY they learn how factually ignorant they are ...

 

Ah yes, the threats.
Give us your money or we will kill you.

**** off.

You can afford a Kalishnikov? I can afford a T 55, you prat.
Superior numbers mean nothing since the advent of the Maxim gun.

Revolution? Pfft. It will be short lived one with you at the helm.


And here they are, revolting...

All 99% of him.

No Ak47.
No legion of 7 billion poor.

Just some unhygenic middle class student twonk who talked so much arse on the internet he ended up believing in his own bollocks.

You are taking things too far.
Yes the government is about as corrupt an institution as institutions come. The most corrupt.
But corruption occurs in other places too.

No, the government does not have a monopoly on guns. It definitely has the monopoly on national defence.
Yes the government was instrumental in nukes, however the atom was split at Cavendish Labs. Quite without the government's direction or involvement.


A free market that regulates itself, is otherwise known as a governed market.
We have that already. No need to re-invent the wheel.

 

That's a PhD in Economics from a libertarian university isn't it?

 

Infantile cartoon.

The government is or should be the representation of the will of the people as demonstrated in a fair and democratic vote. Ie., a "democracy".

Definition of democracy (from here):

 

Democracy is mob rule. Most people cant identify President and Vice President. 2% know what the Fed is and virtually none can identify the 3 branches of govt let lone vote intelligently. This is obviously why our founders did not give us a mpb rule democracy. Do you understand?

 

I proved you objectively wrong as always:

<sigh> Yes, the physiocrats were the original proponents of laissez-faire (Adam Smith learned most of his economics at the knee of Jacques Turgot). They also said taxes should be levied only on land rents, as land rent is not earned by any contribution from the landowner. Google "l'impot unique" and start reading.

But only private property in WHAT IS PRIVATELY PRODUCED, not in land. The landowner is just a pure parasite. Hong Kong has had no private landowning for over 160 years, and is a model of prosperity despite a total lack of natural resources.

 

Wrong again. Jefferson wanted yeoman farmers to work the land they held themselves, not hold vast estates worked by tenants or slaves. That means they could not own it as private property the way products of labor are owned. Private ownership of land makes Jefferson's ideal impossible, as it inevitably concentrates ownership in the hands of the biggest landowners. The mechanisms are inexorable.

 

Let's notice the role of regulations and socially beneficial programs relating to fairness. During the Roaring Twenties, there was great wealth inequality and little regulation. The G.D. happened. Some top capitalists used it to increase their wealth but the people suffered greatly. Unfairness had taken its toll.

FDR addressed the problems with his New Deal which regulated the rich and their businesses and created programs to help people using the taxes extracted from the rich. Wealth inequality shrank and wages rose as FDR applied regulations on business and reformed tax law and improved fairness.

About 35 to 40 years of growth and improving lifestyle for ordinary people followed as FDR legislated economic fairness.

Little by little, like plucking a chicken one feather at a time, FDR's New Deal and regulations were chipped away. Wages began to flatten. Wealth for the wealthy began to increase again. Economic fairness was being repealed. "Trickle-down" didn't happen although plenty of financial advantages and benefits accrued to the rich.

Regulations were mostly repealed and tax rates were reformed mostly in favor of the rich by the time 2003, 4, 5, rolled around and in 2008-9 a near-repeat of the G.D. occurred again, deepening the unfairness and harming all of us but the big banks.

Little has been done to restore economic fairness since then.

So we see that, contrary to the stories bantered about by conservatives, regulations greatly improved life for the people and the corporations still made plenty of money. And when regulations and social programs are diminished or eliminated, the economy plunges back into disasters and the people suffer.

"Free market benefits" are a lie.

"Trickle-down benefits" are a lie.

Regulations and social programs benefit all. They are required for economic fairness and they don't harm wealth. RW economics lies to us.

Resist the greed. It's a killer.

 

thats exactly what I said??????

 

wrong of course there are probably 120 million private parcels in the USA

 

Actually New Deal was 16 years of Great Depression and World War that killed 60 million. Worst economy x 10 in American History. It only ended when thankfully FDR died. FDR was communist so liberals loved him and ghoulishly loveed the 120 million people that communism killed!!

 

There was free market for guns when America was founded. Thankfully, because we used them to win our freedom.
There is no conflict between rich and poor unless liberal communists teach class warfare to gain political power. Do you understand?

 

China just switched to free markets and instantly eliminated 40% of all the poverty on earth. Its been in all the papers. See why we say liberalism is based in pure ignorance? Is any other conclusion possible?

 

No, there are not, and the number of parcels is irrelevant in any case. It's how concentrated their ownership is. And while most of that land came into private ownership in fairly small parcels quite recently in historical terms, the concentration of ownership is already well advanced.

 

Absurd. Everything in China's economy is still controlled by government officials who must be paid off. There is essentially no such thing as honestly earned wealth in China.

No, that is another false and absurd claim from you. It has taken 40 years.

See above for real ignorance, and the inevitable conclusion.

 

No, it is not. There is a world of difference between a nation of smallholders working their land themselves and a nation of tenants or employees working the vast estates the parasitic rich have accumulated.

 

Probably 160 million privately owned homes in America. Seem like a good number.

 

Of course I have proved you wrong on that claim many times. The 12 -- not 16 -- years of Roosevelt's New Deal (1933-45, for those of us who can do elementary school arithmetic -- i.e., not you) were the biggest economic expansion in American history.

You are just sad, now.