When does one gain person-hood?

So when does a foetus become a person?


At conception?
At birth?
Somewhere in between?

I personally think conception.

 

At birth....

 

Why's that?

 

What are the attributes of a person, as opposed to a plant or an animal? A conceptus doesn't cut it. A person is self-aware, it has "agency", it has a moral sense, for example.
You can't be an American citizen unless you are "a person born..."

 

Because until birth the baby is inside the mother.

 

So by popping out the mother one is magically imbued with personhood?

 

So is self-awareness contingent for personhood?

 

It's the only rationale pro abortionists can lean on in their demented effort to marginalize human beings for the sake of convenience.

 

the question is : is the fetus a human being? I think that the answer is yes.

as far a personhood goes, people's self conceptions as persons change throughout their lives. we aren't really the same "person" or "personality" at 50 that we were at 15. so, in that sense I think that a human being is constantly gaining and loosing person-hood.

 

Well a foetus is definitely a unique human being.

I'm going for a rather simplistic definition for a "person" which they have intrinsic moral worth and rights.

 

Exactly.. no fetus has ever been considered a "person".

 

No.. infants do not have self awareness.

 

That's when it enters society.

 

Yes they have... but that isn't the point.

If you remember the definition of person we're using is "of having intrinsic moral worth and rights".

 

So one gains moral worth and rights only through entering society?

 

Suit yourself.. Persons live outside the womb unless you can prove otherwise.

 

Persons live inside the womb too, unless you can be lunatic enough to try and prove otherwise.

I love the dancing on pinheads abortion lovers do.

 

Your definition of "person" is incorrect.

per·son
noun \ˈpər-sən\
Definition of PERSON
1
: human, individual —sometimes used in combination especially by those who prefer to avoid man in compounds applicable to both sexes <chairperson> <spokesperson>
2
: a character or part in or as if in a play : guise
3
a : one of the three modes of being in the Trinitarian Godhead as understood by Christians b : the unitary personality of Christ that unites the divine and human natures
4
a archaic : bodily appearance b : the body of a human being; also : the body and clothing <unlawful search of the person>
5
: the personality of a human being : self
6
: one (as a human being, a partnership, or a corporation) that is recognized by law as the subject of rights and duties
7
: reference of a segment of discourse to the speaker, to one spoken to, or to one spoken of as indicated by means of certain pronouns or in many languages by verb inflection

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/person

 

I disagree. Scott Peterson was tried and convicted of the "double murder" of his wife, Lacy, and their unborn child (or in your own words "fetus"). The unborn child ("fetus") must have been considered a "person" for the prosecutors to charge, try, and convict Mr. Peterson. I agree that Mr. Peterson was rightfully convicted for the murder of his wife, but using your own logic of what constitutes a person, should he have been convicted for the murder of his unborn son ("fetus")?

Just my observation.

 

Yes he was... Both she and the unborn were victims.

Research the law.

If you kill a pregnant woman.. the law recognizes the unborn, but that doesn't mean the unborn is a PERSON.

 

Actually the pro abortion crowd was none too happy when fetal infanticide laws started being enacted. None too happy.

Dance on the head of a pin for too long and eventually you fall off and it impales you up your rectum. If the death lobby cannot successfully marginalize the human being, then their position falls faster than Paris Hilton's panties in the balk of a limo.

 

Right, because the mother said she wanted the baby. Had she been ready to abort, it wouldn't be a baby, just a tissue mass of choice cuts for the butcher.

Keep dancing, Ms Conservative. Got your Obama 2012 law sign yet?

 

I'm interested to know why you think that is a definite fact. It's a question that has been forever debated by scholars, and no consensus has been reached.

 

Fetal death as a result of crime against the mothr has been around since the bible was written.

 

But it's not a baby unless the mother says it is.

Get your argument straight.

Speaking of, if a guy hits his preggo slut GF in the gut while arguing over the meth pipe, and she was just on her way out the door to the local abortion mill, but his punch killed the little mass of garbage first, should he be subject to prosecution for the death of the non child.

Dance on that one, Madame.