Why Americans are Saying 'No'

Yes, but it's not as simple as that even.

Israel is an extremely 'strange' place.

I think many may have a perception that since it seems to think it is 'Western', that it is much like anywhere else. It's not. There is something inherently odd about the state. Not just the clear and obvious end product actions, that we see and we despise. Beneath that. For instance, when you have time, listen to this interview, tell me what you think...

[video=youtube;DIT9sLz29iQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIT9sLz29iQ&feature=player_detailpage[/video]

 

I cannot see, for the life of me, how you could aver that I fail to see the similarities between Dubya and The One since I have been saying Obama is no more than Bush with a tan and an ugly wife for more than a few years.

If you want to extrapolate, you can say that negligence in the middle east dates back to the Truman administration.

The fact that Obama "just continued" the policies of what came before underscores the entire apologist strategy of the liberals, "it's Bush's fault" has been the mantra since February 1st 2009, when The One was elected on change...well he added the "hope" thing because it sounded really, really neat.

 

If it wasn't for Washington's unconditional support, they'd perhaps have been far less arrogant and would long ago have been forced to respect Palestinians legitimate rights, to coexist and not behave like a super power towards their neighbours.

T he Arabs , including the Mufti, were at first openly friendly towards them , until it became clear that Zionist Jews posed an existential threat to the non-Jewish majority. See Weizman with Feisal :


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Having them and using them are two different things. I've not heard of Gaza being hit with a VX attack and all inhabitants dying.

Let's say you have two men and each have a pistol. One man keeps his in his nightstand drawer just in case he might need it one day to kill a burglar. The other goes out, robs a store and kills a clerk with his. Which one is the criminal?

 

I'm not disputing that. You said there is no strategy in the U.S. Middle East policies. There is a strategy. It just looks shambolic on the surface but the goals and objectives are very clear. Even the means how to achieve them. The end justifies the means. No matter how many millions of innocent people die in the process of achieving the objective.

 

Correct.

Well done for making my argument for me.

 

This has been manufactured from the beginning. Remember when Obama was everywhere in the middle east BUT Syria?

Suddenly he's ready to risk at the very least hostile reactions from the Russians and their friends because of chemical weapons? There's suddenly a "red line"?

I have said from the beginning this has more to do, as most US wars do, with domestic politics than foreign and a lot to do with Obama's "legacy" and his inflated view of himself.

 

It's getting so old hearing these 9/11 truthers who demonstrate through their theory that 9/11 was staged, their ignorance on how things actually work in the real world. For example, hundreds of air traffic controllers watched those planes on their radar screens. So you are saying that every air traffic facility in the Eastern US was infiltrated by govt agents so that they could orchestrate 9/11? Because that would be required according to your "staging" plan. The conspiracy would have to involved thousands and thousands of people, and I could go on and on about the specific occupations and work facilities of people that would need to be remaining silent for this conspiracy to work. Believing in nonsense like this seriously degrades your overall credibility imo.

 

Not true.

People can be complicit in something without even realising that they are.

 

There were no planes nor rockets nor strange orbs nor anything else what so ever, except the Military, was in the air.nothing, nothing flew, all were grounded that morning, every flight was grounded. and I am not here to boost my street cred ............. Truth, just plain simple old truth please, with that we can go forward.

 

The bigger the lie, eh?

Well, I don't know about that hypothesis. It seems plenty obvious and well enough documented that planes hit the twin towers. It would take some pretty strong evidence for me to change my view on that. I also don't buy claims of demolitions being carried out - it's another extraordinary claim needing extraordinary evidence.

On the other hand, someone with a Mideast agenda and a lot at stake helping arrange the attack or letting it happen in order to give us a new 'Pearl Harbor' is, in my mind, a possibility. Whoever it is/they are would even have good reason to keep mum about it, assuming they're still alive, because the consequences of being caught for it would undoubtedly be pretty harsh.

However, there remains the question of how many or how few would have been, then. The more people in on something like that, the more likely it is end up publicly known, probably because one or more would blow the whistle.

 

Sure. But thousands not realizing it? Those planes put targets on ATC radar, just like all planes do. Many controllers saw them. Painting targets on the radar screen is not interfaced or connected; it's not the like the internet, each facility has its own independent radar that paints targets. In order for the 9/11 conspiracy to happen, someone would have had to go into each one of those ATC facilities, and somehow paint false targets on it, which I have never seen or heard of being possible, and neither have radar maintenance personnel, who were good friends of mine at my facility. None of that happened ofc, we saw the planes just like everyone else.

 

Not really. Using white phosphorous is akin to using applesauce when compared to VX.

Gunpowder is a chemical compound. I suppose one could argue that shooting someone with a musket is deadly chemical warfare.

 

And that's not all. Lee Rigby's murder was faked.....That's the best.

 

I take it you have been burned with WP then, have you?

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Depends again. If you are ignorant to the bigger picture, you don't see anything to realise.

 

I've heard the controllers with my own ears making the communications to those planes during taxiing, takeoff, en route. Those planes did exist, and there is a record of them being controlled. When one of those planes took off from Logan, there was a controller that had to scan the runway to ensure it was clear, ensure there was a 2 minute window in the sequence of traffic in order to depart, and clear it, on the radio. Right next to that controller were many other controllers. Your conspiracy would have to have taken into account this group of people in the Boston tower. They would have had to have fooled them into sequencing in a non-existent plane into their busy flow of traffic.

 

I am not entirely convinced it was Assad in the first place.

The clueless people in the WH keep making insanely stupid statements. Obama says that Syria is not a credible risk to the US which means that there is no national security concern, both the WH and other surrogates including Kerry keep saying that the attacks would be minimal and according to Kerry "almost nothing". Those two points beg the question, why bother? Seriously, if we don't like either Assad or the Rebel Alliance (minus gold bikini Princess Leah) and the attack isn't going to do any harm anyways why waste the tens of millions of dollars just to get the ships over there and then fire expensive cruise missiles and empty shacks. Obama is by far the absolute worst president on foreign affairs quite possibly since this country began.

The only silver lining is that this guarantees a Republican take over of the Senate and even more seats in the House. I would say also the Whitehouse in 2016 but it wouldn't surprise me to see the Republicans (*)(*)(*)(*) that up like they did in 2014 which should have been an shoe in. Thanks alot establishment Republicans and religious right nutjobs. You guaranteed us either a lukewarm mediocre candidate because the only other exceptions were fundamentalist nuts like Bachman. My guy unfortunetaly turned out to be a serial womenizer.

 

Because the people in charge of that country will not allow them to practice it. I thought this was obvious. Before democracy can happen, the dictators preventing it must be removed. They are in the way.

I do not agree that dictators deserve the benefit of the doubt, or that they deserve any constitutional protections.

Because that is the function of our military. To identify threats and remove them. Enemy combatants are not entitled to due process.

Are you trying to argue that all those Germans and Japs killed by our soldiers in WWII were victims? That they each deserved due process before being shot or bombed?

Democracy is proliferated by removing dictatorships and putting democracies in their place. War is necessary because the dictatorships will not remove themselves willingly.

Because no one elected them. I did not give those whistle blowers permission to blab my nation's secrets to the world.

ORLY? A democracy exists now where there was a dictatorship before. What exactly do you call that if not proliferation?

One has nothing to do with the other. democratic proliferation is occurring whether or not people are water boarded in Gitmo. I just gave you an example.

It always amazes me that people like you cry bloody murder over Gitmo but do not seem to have any problem at all with dictators torturing and murdering people merely for their own pleasure (not even for defense). Why are you defending them?

 

what if 911 was a call for help?

simply because they cannot get past the media to even have a voice....???

what if?

i dont like it either but to be human each side should be observed.

I say NO to the syria chem weapon issue as siding with the concept that Assad did not do it but that the rebels murdered them people.

So Jack, now i would like to see someone point out, that when syria gives up its stockpiles, that the chmical signature of them be compared to the chem signature of the march and august usage and i bet they dont match.

i bet the chems used in the attacks were mixed in the field and if assad has them, that they are weapons grade (mixed properly). The signature will tell all.


Jack..... do what you do.

 

It's a really stupid way to ask for help. Besides, most of the hijackers were apparently Saudis. What help did they need? Were they hoping to have the US take out their princes and liberate the Sinai?

Are you addressing Jack Napier here?

 

TT - range from whining and crying to screaming, kicking, hitting, and breath holding. Get the facts on managing - and preventing - temper tantrums

people are capable- sheet happens

oil put a dominance to one family

i have always asked, why didnt the US take out SA and then have the oil. But instead, chasing Osama, destroyed countries and afghanistan is now an opium farm.

i didnt get the memo, directly from the wingnuts

but i do know enough about islam to understand that they DO NOT want to make the word into muslims, by force. It was not a jihad to make the world islam, that islame to even feed people.

the top line was for you to know that i didnt and dont like the 911. It was/is sad.

The rest was to return to the thread

and then jack reads a bunch and does homework that is more on matters than i like to.

I had an idea when this chemical stockpile path came up. Compare the evidence samples of the murdered with the stockpile chemical signatures.

Each batch will have samples taken to verify validity of the weapon. Likewise, i bet the signatures of the used material has already been determined.

It's a no brainer

 

TC notes 12 years of war is enough for Americans, but this goes back, way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way longer. My Dad fought in Korea We left that place divided and our enemies empowered. (Germany too but Nazis utterly defeated). We lost Viet Nam. Some would argue we won, but the USA's fifth column snatched defeat from the jaws of victory. We left Iraq unfinished business, which was insane. There was an argument for going or not going. There was no argument for going and losing. Kosovo? Had nothing to do with us. We're not happy we were involved. Libya? Stupid, illegal, counter productive. Closest to a hard call: Afghanistan. Yes, they sheltered our enemies. But we should have hit and run. Instead we engaged in Nation Building. We've had enough thanks.

 

Good find Jack,

Absolutely disgraceful the way the Zionists treated that man.

It was a long video but quite revealing , + time well spent watching it. .

AS he said , if that's what they can do to a Jew , just think what they are doing to Palestinians.


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Still no proof :


"Obama's Syria Case Still Lacks Proof"

"Obama voiced his conviction Tuesday night that Syrian President Bashar Assad was to blame for deadly chemical attacks against civilians, but again he offered no proof.

A look at his remarks to the nation, seeking support for a military strike against Syria, and how they compare with the facts as publicly known:

OBAMA: "We know the Assad regime was responsible. ... The facts cannot be denied."

THE FACTS:

The Obama administration has not laid out proof Assad was behind the attack.

The administration has cited satellite imagery and communications intercepts, backed by social media and intelligence reports from sources in Syria, as the basis for blaming the Assad government. But the only evidence the administration has made public is a collection of videos it has verified of the victims. The videos do not demonstrate who launched the attacks.

Administration officials have not shared the satellite imagery they say shows rockets and artillery fire leaving government-held areas and landing in 12 rebel-held neighborhoods outside Damascus where chemical attacks were reported. Nor have they shared transcripts of the Syrian officials allegedly warning units to ready gas masks or discussing how to handle U.N. investigators after it happened.

The White House has declined to explain where it came up with the figure of at least 1,429 dead, including 400 children — a figure far higher than estimates by nongovernmental agencies such as the British-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights, which has counted only victims identified by name, with a current total of 502. In his remarks, Obama more generally accused Assad's forces of gassing to death "over 1,000 people, including hundreds of children."

———

OBAMA: "So even though I possess the authority to order military strikes, I believed it was right in the absence of a direct or imminent threat to our security to take this debate to Congress."

THE FACTS:

Obama's statement that he has the authority to launch military action is par for the course for presidents, and historically disputed by Congress. The issue never gets settled.

The Constitution delineates power between the president, who serves as commander in chief of the armed forces, and Congress, which has the ability to declare war. Over time, however, questions arose over where the president's authority ends and where Congress' begins.

The 1973 War Powers Resolution sought to end the debate, but it has only fueled arguments between Republican and Democratic administrations alike and those who consider themselves constitutional purists.

The law gives the president the power to act without congressional approval in cases of national emergency for up to 60 days. In such a case, the president must consult with Congress. And if the deadline passes without congressional authorization, the president has 30 additional days to remove troops.

But what constitutes a national emergency and what consultation means remain subjects of continued disputes.


http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/fact-check-obamas-syria-case-lacks-proof-20219813



How can Syria's civil war or even the use of chemical weapons within Syria be considered an America "National Emergency ?


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Indeed. Disturbing stuff. And it is not (by any means), the first time I have heard and listened to such things. Would their thugs capture this man, and do what they did? Sure they would. Remember, they kidnapped Vanunu, drugged him, and brought him there. Then he had a secret trial at which he could not speak.

If a Jew steps out of line,he is an obstacle to whatever they have going on there, same as anyone. I don't think they would make a distinction between a Jew and a non Jew, at that point.

Did you know that Savile was not only a friend of Israel, but he met Begin. He even told Begin that 'Jews had forgotten how to be Jewish' (he meant don't give back anything you take). Begin agreed and actually had this nonce address his Knesset colleagues with the self same message.

Of course, no danger did Mossad ever have an inking that there was anything dodgy about this man. No way would Mossad or other secret services fully check out someone's entire past, before lording him in front of the Knesset. No way at all. Neither did British Intelligence. Nup. Esther Ratzen knew. Most of his circle in the BBC knew. But the entire Israeli secret services and British secret services did not have a clue.

And if you believe that, I have some time share in a black hole for sale - very good price.