Why These High School Girls Don’t Want a Transgender Student in Their Locker Room

Do you remember highs school? Putting kids that are horny and immature together is a bad idea. With how far back the kids have slid these days, it's even a worse idea.

Also, the things I have seen are about locker rooms.

 

My point isn't necessarily about the "bathroom" aspect of it, it's more of the locker room. The coverage I've seen lately was about a trans student wanting to use the locker room with the girls. As a father of 3 girls, that's a big hell no for me. As I mentioned before, I don't care if the boy is gay, trans, whatever... my problem is that boy trying to force his "feelings" on the rest of the students. He "feels" that he should be showering with the girls because he "feels" like he is a girl. Hell no. Get the twig and giggle berries chopped and then she can feel free to roam about the locker room. The problem comes when you have little morons that then say "hey, I can play trans and get a peep show...." and it's over. Once you open the door, it's hard to close it. There are people that take advantage of a situation and high school kids are some of the best at doing just that. I know it has got to be hard for trans kids, but they have to make a decision and stick with it base on how things are without special rules.

I agree that the bullies and little dip (*)(*)(*)(*)s that bully other kids need to be taken care of, but how are you going to do that exactly? We took care of bullies in our own way 20 years ago... I was expelled myself for showing one what it felt like to be bullied. Most of them straightened up, fast. The teachers didn't really care either when the bullies were taken care of, it was more "you get what you deserve". < That is how it should be. Now, you have all of these people with all of these "feelings", and you can't punish kids like you used to anymore. Parents don't know how to raise their kids anymore. The youth is just getting more idiotic than the last bunch. This is what trans kids have to deal with now. I get that. But don't force things upon other people that shouldn't be done, get rid of the bullies. Stop letting the little idiots run rampant. This means kids get in more trouble, and worse trouble. Maybe even let the bully get the crap kicked out of him/her in a "get a taste of your own medicine" kind of way. Everyone wants to make things so much nicer for all, but they don't understand that there are those that will abuse your weakness and take advantage in every way they can.

 

Well, at least I know that I don't have yet another response from someone that doesn't comprehend what the other is writing.

I actually haven't been doing that, you just take it like that, that's your fault, not mine. Unless you are actually talking about you, yourself as a trans or gay person. Then it is just you making the issue about being trans or gay just for you. Either way, I haven't been saying anything about trans or gay people. I've been commenting on how the rules DO NOT need to change for them because of their "feelings". I didn't say they were bad, confused, or anything else that you might be imagining. Did I attack you? No, not really. I just said you sound like the common criminal that says "it's not my fault". I didn't say you were a common criminal, just that it seems like you have that "it's not my fault" mentality. One of my daughters is going through that exact same thing... she's 12. I'll get her to grow up though and become an adult that accepts responsibility for her own actions.

 

But then should we put any together? I'm a lesbian, should I be in a locker room with other naked women? In theory I would be more interested in the peep show right? Except that I'm not. Maybe we're really talking about the difference between men and women and I can't understand where you're coming from because of that key difference. Maybe I'm naive to what happens in the boys room and you underestimate what happens in the girls. I guess for me, I don't think anyone has the right to eyeball someone else in a situation like a locker room, it doesn't matter what your gender or orientation is. I do see your point that the majority of high school students are cis and straight so if you separate based in anatomy you have the best odds of nothing going on, but it's still not a guarantee.

This isn't an easy issue that's for sure. To the trans girl you have to remember that she thinks and sees the world as female, then has to shower with the guys. It's hard for us to understand her perspective, but that is where she is coming from. It's the same discomfort your express for your daughters. I don't know how to solve it. I'm inclined to say give her a safe place to change in the boys locker room if she has to be in there, but then there is this risk of isolating and shaming someone who is already extremely high risk for those things.

Maybe the real issue is our lifelong body shaming and terrible excuse for sex education in this country. The invention of smart phones has made it possible for teens to have sex whenever they want, but we still don't see a real conversation about it with them in most schools.

 

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You are referring to yourself. I'm referring to an aggregation of high school females. Given your example, what difference would it make if men use a female restroom so long as there are stalls there? That logic does not float and is easily dismissed. The idea of assigning a rest/locker room by anatomical structure is common sense.

 

Unfortunately there is no easy answer to this for the trans person. I don't think changing the rules for the massive majority is the way to go though, not even close. People shouldn't be looking for other people to give in to what they believe or want. People should be paving their way on their own. I don't care how bad trans kids feel, the rules shouldn't change. Those kids should make a choice to get by easy and go gender specific, or make waves. I would hope they make waves myself. Bullies are out there. Fat kids have to deal with them, mentally challenged kids have to deal with them, black kids have to deal with them.... that's life. People aren't always nice, adults are almost worse. The sooner these kids learn to deal with what they want to do, the better off they're gona be.

 

Dunno, the students are the ones affected by the outcome, who cares where the funding came from, they don't live there as the saying goes, and the first time someone gets raped by a confused transgender etc..
There will be hell to pay !

When I was in grammer school, I stopped using some bathrooms, and the showers were a minefield, why ? because some of the stronger boys were taking advantage of the weaker boys, and you had to be very careful, so I would not force those students to go through all that mess.

It is very hard for boys in that situation, all this rot about being a man, and you get abused, and I would have commited suicide before ever admitting I had been abused, I still have trouble talking about it........

 

But its not about you. It is about a safe zone for females from males.

First, to claim that someone with testicles and a penis is a female is the theater of the absurd.

Second, there is absolutely no way to know if the male has the mind of a female and a true transexual, is transjacking, engaging autogynephilia, is just faking to ogle girls, is dangerously psychologically disturbed or a sex predator putting on an act.

Its a bit like claiming there is not reason for children not to take candy from a stranger because most people who give candy to children would never harm a child. What if the man says "really, I'm a child" and therefore you should let your child play with that man because he's a "transkid" at heart and not a man so it's just letting your child go off and play with a 58 year old physical man but says he's really an 11 year old transchild - this certainly true because he says it is?

Why would anyone trust a physical man saying "really I'm a girl" - and believe it because he says it? Seriously.

 

I don't know the answer except they have to use facilities when others aren't?
But you don't mind your sons sharing locker facilities with someone who wants and feels female? Probably attracted to males, is my guess.

 

I see no possibly way to KNOW a physical male is a transsexual female without SRS. Even if he can't afford full SRS, castration of his testicles is simplistic and cheap, and would be supportive of reduction of testosterone. If a man/male is NOT willing to be castrated he is NOT a transsexual. Obviously. Wanting to keep his testicles is an inherent fundamental contradict to claiming he is female. He may be something else, but he is NOT a transsexual.

 

This doesn't give men much credit and makes it sound like women should fear all men. As a female I would have no issue using gender neutral bathrooms. Stalls have doors so I'm able to have privacy from men as well as women. I don't get naked in locker rooms, I change in private places so maybe I can't understand this part. As for bathrooms meaning toilets and sinks, I don't care if a man is in the stall next to me or a woman. I would not fear a guy taking a leak next to me

 

The way I see it, bathroom time should be private for anyone, shower time too, those are needed functions most people at young age pefer privacy for many issues.

Male genitals have no place in an area reserved for female hygiene and undressing.
A separate bathroom / locker area with total privacy for those with different needs is best for all concerned.

I feel that way based on the crap I went through, oh BTW, males are not the only ones to abuse others, sometime females abuse males, and it is not good, it is pretty horrible also......
.

Abuse is about power & control, not love that is why it makes people feel badly.......

 

How willing are you to be in an isolated room with a man walking in that you don't know, never met and didn't invite in? A man coming in, in a dress or not, now sets off alarms as it is illegal. Other women would sound the alarm too.

But what if that doesn't happen? You come out of the stall, slammed in the face and a knife to your throat, and the bathroom door jammed like it is locked.

The link on my TRANSJACK thread I started gives numerous examples of convicted sex offenders who dress and women and use women's bathrooms as isolated locations as sex predators, though usually now arrested, fought off, police immediately called, woman screaming - Usually preventing the assault succeeding. However, women's bathrooms are high of the list of rape locations. Allowing men, and particularly men pretending to be women, to use women's bathrooms or gender neutral bathrooms eliminates nearly all safeguards and warnings.

I could post many, many, many links of rapes that occur in public bathrooms but see no reason to post the obvious, but at least now there is some chances of warning signs - such as a man in the bathroom.

Here's a few of them:
http://nypost.com/2015/04/14/woman-attacked-raped-in-bathroom-of-gramercy-bar/
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/03/28/11-year-old-girl-gang-raped-california-park-bathroom.html
http://www.wbrz.com/news/casino-at-center-of-lawsuit-over-bathroom-rape/

 

To some degree, women should fear all men they don't know, particularly in private locations.

"Do they know that more than 99 percent of single-victim incidents are committed by males? That they are experts in rationalization who minimize their number of victims? Don&#8217;t they know that insurance companies highlight locker rooms as a high-risk area for abuse that should be carefully monitored and protected?

http://thefederalist.com/2015/11/23/a-rape-survivor-speaks-out-about-transgender-bathrooms/

Now, if a man follows you into or comes into a bathroom with you, you have reason to put up your guard knowing this is illegal and inherently then a high potential danger. But otherwise? You come out of the stall and get slammed in the face and a knife to your throat, the bathroom door jammed like it is locked.

Would you be fine with a man you never met or know sharing a motel room with you because he's wearing a dress? How much are you willing to be alone in a isolated room with a man you never met, don't know and didn't invite in?



Don&#8217;t they know anything about predators? Don&#8217;t they know the numbers? That out of every 100 rapes, only two rapists will spend so much as single day in jail while the other 98 walk free and hang out in our midst? Don&#8217;t they know that predators are known to intentionally seek out places where many of their preferred targets gather in groups? That perpetrators are addicts so committed to their fantasies they&#8217;ll stop at nothing to achieve them?"


http://www.wbrz.com/news/casino-at-center-of-lawsuit-over-bathroom-rape/
http://thefederalist.com/2015/11/23/a-rape-survivor-speaks-out-about-transgender-bathrooms/

 

You guys realize that you probably are already sharing your bathrooms with transgender people, right?

Even without surgery, many transgenders change their hair, clothing and body to look like their preferred gender. And pre-op transgenders take hormones, which do the same thing.

should a female transgender who looks totally male be forced to use the girl's bathroom, even though that will make EVERYONE uncomfortable? Because that's what you are saying.

Doing so also basically forces the transgender person to broadcast that s/he is transgender -- a major and possibly dangerous loss of privacy.

 

I see your point, but as your stories prove those assaults happen regardless of who is allowed in the bathroom. Rapists aren't going to respect gender signs... They're rapists. I wonder if gender neutral would help in some cases. It could add to bathroom traffic and perhaps rapists would fear getting caught by another guy if men were allowed to use ladies rooms. I have to believe there are more good guys in the world than rapists.

Honesty, if the expectation was set that the bathroom I was choosing to use was gender neutral it wouldn't weird me out if a man walked in. If it wasn't established as gender neutral then yes, my radar would engage. As a woman though, that radar is always on which is a whole other topic for another thread. The real issue is that women still are taught to fear men. Society teaches us that, but crime rates teach us that too.

 

Why the presumption that we must all foremost worry of the emotional feelings of someone who claims to be or is transgender over our own emotional feelings and possible dangerous loss of privacy? What about the emotional sentiments of the 1 of MILLIONS of female rape victims who fear being alone with strange looking men, particularly weirdly mimicking a woman, in a bathroom? Do their emotions and fears matter?

Do you understand why transjacking and men mimicking women infuriates many feminists and lesbian rights advocates, not just conventional women who don't want men in their bathrooms? Feminists fought hard for their rights as WOMEN and lesbians originally not only had to battle all straights, but even male gay rights groups - then to have their female identity as women in a sense stolen from them by men who declare being a woman is so trivial and shallow as to be no more than putting on a dress, wig and makeup.

Not everyone who does NOT support the trans-rights movement are homophobic. Many feminists and lesbians do. How the hell does putting on a dress, a wig and makeup make a person with a penis and testicles a "woman?" NOR do MANY feminists and lesbians want to be gender neutered by law as the alternative.

 

We have bathrooms with handicapped access, there should be toilets & showers with privacy and changing areas with complete privacy and safety for eveyone that requests it, regardless gender, some people have fear of changing clothes or being naked in front of others, to avoid a Carey situation, like the Stephen King story.

 

Privacy is possible. Safety is not.

 

Sure it is, when you confine children in a building, for so many hours, the competent people in charge, the staff, are responsible for all the students in their charge, their safety and to be secure from harm, at all times, free from assault of any kind and from any source, that is the sole responsibility of the staff.

 

#1, way to ignore the main point of my post, the third paragraph. Care to address that?

#2, educate yourself. Cross dressing and transgender are completely different things.

#3, I didn't say we had to prioritize transgender privacy concerns. But I think they deserve consideration, especially when the consequences of losing that privacy can be severe -- even fatal.

Common sense say that if they look female, they should use the female facility. And if they look male, use the male facility. And that as a general proposition we should be moving toward gender-neutral bathrooms, for a host of reasons of which transgenders are just a small one.

 

I don't typically see the genitals of strangers, so if I see someone in a bathroom who looks like a man, but is missing the anatomy how would I know? I would just see what appears to be a man in the ladies room and that would make me feel more weird even though he has female anatomy. It makes more sense to let him use the men's room being that is how he appears. No one would ever know he has female genitals. I have a friend who is about two years into transitioning from female to male, and he has only had top surgery at this point. He uses the men's room every time and no one even knows that he hasn't had the bottom surgery yet because in all other ways he is male, down to the facial hair.

This topic is almost pointless to discuss because as another poster said you are already using bathrooms with trans people, you just don't know it. Unless someone is going to verify our genitals at the bathroom door first, there is no way to know who is really what.

As far as rape is concerned, I am a woman so yes I think about it and fear it. That underlying fear is always there. However 80% of sexual assaults are committed by people we know, not strangers in bathrooms. I'm not denying those terrible rapes happen, they do, but they are not even close to the majority of assaults.

 

What all these arguments boil down to is an attempt to propagandize against trans people by making it sound like the vast majority are abusers or wish to commit abuse. It is attempting to make every trans person responsible for the bad acts of other persons.

 

Homophobic? Wouldn't that be transphobic? Unless we're assuming the trans person is also same-sex oriented, which isn't universally the case.

This is where I remind people that there's a difference between biological sex, same-sex orientation, gender identity, and gender expression/role.

 

No, it is explaining the realities of transjacking and why many feminists and lesbians are greatly offended by the current push of transactivists to essentially erase female identity by compulsory governmental regulations and laws. The claim that a women is defined by who is wearing a dress is an obscenely sexist position possible to take and is a total attack against women's rights across history. It is outrageous that a person with a penis and testicles is declared a female by government edict and regulations as a definition that all women must accept. In addition, core women's rights issues - such as control over her body in terms of procreation - is completely obliterated when "people who have penises and testicles are women too" becomes the law.