"What Was The Holocaust? What Actually Happened?"

Discussion in 'History & Past Politicians' started by John Sholtes, May 28, 2012.

  1. ThirdTerm

    ThirdTerm Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2012
    Messages:
    4,325
    Likes Received:
    462
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Anne and Margot Frank were spared immediate death in the Auschwitz gas chambers and transferred to the Bergen-Belsen concentration camp. Anne Frank died of intestinal typhus and she contracted the disease while taking care of her dying sister Margot.

    I have a dim memory of Anne Frank speaking of her father. She was a nice, fine person. She would say to me, "Irma, I am very sick." I said, "No, you are not so sick." She wanted to be reassured that she wasn't. When she slipped into a coma, I took her in my arms. She didn't know that she was dying. She didn't know that she was so sick. You never know. At Bergen-Belsen, you did not have feelings anymore. You became paralyzed. In all the years since, I almost never talked about Bergen-Belsen. I couldn't. It was too much.

    http://www.ou.org/yerushalayim/threeweeks/annefrank.html
     
  2. SAUER

    SAUER New Member

    Joined:
    May 16, 2012
    Messages:
    1,628
    Likes Received:
    18
    Trophy Points:
    0
    It’s silly to deny the Holocaust. Nazis annihilated 6, 000, 000 jews (this number is enshrined in the protocols of the Nuremberg Trials) also about 27 , 000, 000 Soviet ppl. lost their lives.

    Unfortunately, the full nominal list of victims does not exist. By the end of the war, the Nazis destroyed even the traces of the death camps and annihilated remains of their victims before the arrival of Soviet troops.

    Also the Nazis planned to annihilate the Jews completely. They used the term “Final Solution” for their plan to annihilate the Jews. But in 1945 the Soviet Army put a stop to that.

    Auschwitz concentration camp
    img15.jpg
    osvenzim08.jpg
    0_41191_fe42a337_L.jpg 0_41181_68f22dcd_L.jpg
     
  3. _Lisa_

    _Lisa_ New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2011
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    19
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Isn't it amazing that the most famous of all Holycost "victims" didn't die in gas chambers....she died of disease.
     
  4. _Lisa_

    _Lisa_ New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2011
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    19
    Trophy Points:
    0

    Are you aware that the plaque outside of Aushwitz originally, and for many years, read that 4 million died there and that it now reads that 1.5 million died there. Does 6 million minus 2.5 million still equal 6 million in your world? I will further tell you that my personal research shows that the actual figure is far, far less than that. The 6 million figure is central to the Holycost tale and it is FALSE. A lie. The TRUTH is, Zionists have created and expanded the Holocaust tale to muster up sympathy and support for Jewish causes and primarily for the creation of Israel. It has been their excuse for murdering the indigenous people of Palestine...for stealing their land and for extorting money to the tune of billions of dollars. The TRUTH is, there isn't 6 cents difference between a Zionists and a Nazis ideology, only the names are different....that's why I affectionately call them ZIONAZI'S. The TRUTH is that our culture has become so permeated...so thoroughly saturated with the Holycost tale, that it affects our foreign policy and listen to me GOOD here, what is good for Israel isn't automatically GOOD for America.

    If these Jews want to constantly remind us that "we must not forget", then they better be prepared for just that. They want to continually shove the Holycost down our throats, then people are gonna take a good look at it.
     
  5. MisLed

    MisLed New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2011
    Messages:
    7,299
    Likes Received:
    329
    Trophy Points:
    0
    are ya counting?
     
  6. _Lisa_

    _Lisa_ New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2011
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    19
    Trophy Points:
    0
    There is not one single solitary document that comes close to incriminating the Nazi's on the charge of "exterminating" via gas chambers yet we are told that the German's were such meticulous record keepers. The claim is made that the plan to "exterminate" Jews came into fruition at the Wannsee Conference. A copy of the Wannsee Protocol here: http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/imt/wannsee.htm contains language like "evacuation" and "expulsion".........words beginning with E, but nowhere is the BIG E word, EXTERMINATION, mentioned. "Evacuation and expulsion" was the language used because that was the plan. There were originally 30 copies of this document and all but one was destroyed by the Nazi's near the end of the war. One single copy was found in the papers of Undersecretary Martin Luther when he died in 1947. Essentially, Holocaust proponents best argument is, "well they may have SAID "expulsion" and "evacuation" but they reeeeeeeeally meant "extermination". Incredulous, but in line with their "abscence of evidence doesn't mean evidence of absence" mentality.

    There was NO intent to exterminate Jews in gas chambers period and there are many other Nazi documents that were found that support what the Wannsee Protocol suggests, expulsion and evacuation, NOT extermination. Further, there is no evidence of gas chambers......that is, the gas chambers themselves. The Russians refused to allow anyone into Auschwitz until 10 years after the war and the "ceremonial gas chamber" on display there now they say was destroyed by the Nazi's and then rebuilt for posterity by the clean up crew.
     
  7. _Lisa_

    _Lisa_ New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2011
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    19
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Last week, as Jewish Lobbies continue to invest enormous efforts in dictating and imposinga rigid and unquestionable Holocaust narrative, Israeli Haaretz published a short, succinct and courageous report challenging the validity of the Wannsee Conference as proof of the Nazi ‘final solution’.

    Just ahead of Holocaust Memorial Day, the Israeli paper reported that Dr. Norbert Kampe (63), director of the “Wannsee Conference” Memorial Centre in Berlin, has challenged some of the most widely-accepted historical ‘facts’ associated with the conference and its meaning.

    Jewish Holocaust scholars have always insisted that the master plan for the Nazi Judeocide was conceived at the Wannsee Conference but Dr. Kampe is quoted as saying that the conference dealt only with “operational matters” instead of being a platform of any form of “decision making”. To prove his point, Kampe pointed to the fact that Hitler and his ministers were not present at the conference. Furthermore, he says, “At the time, January 1942, there was no organized plan for extermination camps.”

    And yet, Haaretz admits, “Make no mistake. Kampe is not anti-Semitic. Certainly not a Holocaust denier. On the contrary. As expected of a professional historian, he studied countless relevant texts, documents and testimonies on the particular event…His conclusion is the direct outcome of an educated analysis of written material in his possession.”

    So courageously, a Hebrew paper praises Kampe and his “fascinating historical lesson” and also acknowledges that the Israeli Ministry of Education lacks the capacity to engage in any form of informed Holocaust debate. Haaretz clearly admits that

    “to this day no one knows with complete certainty and confidence what exactly happened on 20 January 1942, in this pretty villa in the wealthy suburb of Berlin.”

    Only one copy of the Wansee Conference protocol, found in 1947, survived the war, others having been deliberately destroyed by the Nazis in an effort to conceal evidence. This protocol is the only authentic documentation as to what happened in Wannsee and one of the few that made explicit use of the term “final solution”. However, Haaretz concedes that, like any historical document, the Wannsee document should be read carefully. The words “death” or “murder” do not appear in the conference protocol. Instead, it refers to “natural diminution”, “appropriate treatment”, “other solution options” and “different forms of solutions.” In fact, the only explicit references in the document deal with deportation rather than extermination. Even the famous table attached to the protocol that counts the Jews in each occupied country, does not state that those Jews are destined to be destroyed.

    Just a few days ahead of Holocaust Memorial Day, a Hebrew paper found the courage to admit that “decades of Holocaust research could not find a clear and explicit command made by high-level Nazi officials to engage in systematic mass extermination of Jews.”

    more:

    http://veracityvoice.com/?p=13619
     
  8. King of Fishers Island

    King of Fishers Island New Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2012
    Messages:
    100
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    0
    No.. They retreated to the Germans because
    advancing Russians are world-renowned for way-ill-treating women;
    even way worse than Herr Hitler's German Army Troopers..
    All european women knew and know that. .
     
  9. King of Fishers Island

    King of Fishers Island New Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2012
    Messages:
    100
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Yes..

    So far I'm up to Zero people who deny that the Holocaust occurred..

    You?
     
  10. King of Fishers Island

    King of Fishers Island New Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2012
    Messages:
    100
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I don't know anyone who denies Jews died in Hitler's Concentration Camps

    I do know that 5 Million Christians died in Hitler's Concentration Camps,
    and that that FACTOID rarely gets disseminated .. as if their deaths in Nazi camps are mere chopped liver..

    In 1945,
    The Allies confiscated Tonnes of meticulously kept Nazi Records..
    The Allies were astounded that the Nazis did not destroy their records as every other loser would have.
    These records are not only under extremely tight lock and key,
    their very existence has almost been completely obliterated from anything connected with "history".

    +++
     
  11. ThirdTerm

    ThirdTerm Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2012
    Messages:
    4,325
    Likes Received:
    462
    Trophy Points:
    83
    During his trial in Jerusalem, Eichmann testified as follows during session 107 on July 24, 1961:

    What I know is that the gentlemen convened their session, and then in very plain terms - not in the language that I had to use in the minutes, but in absolutely blunt terms - they addressed the issue, with no mincing of words. And my memory of all this would be doubtful, were it not for the fact that I distinctly recall saying to myself at the time, Look, just look at Stuckart, the perpetual law-abiding bureaucrat, always punctilious and fussy, and now what a different tone! The language was anything but in conformity with the legal protocol of clause and paragraph. I should add that this is the only thing from the conference that still has stayed clearly in my mind.

    When the Presiding Judge asked Eichmann what Stuckart had said "in general" "on this topic," Eichmann answered, "The discussion covered killing, elimination, and annihilation." On the basis of Eichmann's testimony, it is now accepted that the minutes of the Wannsee conference were written with euphemisms, instead of the actual words used at the conference.

    http://www.scrapbookpages.com/EasternGermany/Wannsee/
     
  12. MisLed

    MisLed New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2011
    Messages:
    7,299
    Likes Received:
    329
    Trophy Points:
    0
    disturbing
     
  13. King of Fishers Island

    King of Fishers Island New Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2012
    Messages:
    100
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    0
    My True statement disturb you?

    Allow me to restate myself..

    I've never met one single person in my entire life
    who claimed that Jews did not die in Hitler's Concentration Camps..

    For one who's read every issue of the NYTIMES for 1945..
    I can assure you that almost everyone knows that Jews - and many others, such as Christians -
    died in Hitlers Concentration Camps.

    Still, and my testimony is my testimony,
    I've never ever met one single person who alleged that Jews did not die in Hitler's Labor Camps..

    IF anyone knows of anyone who does not believe that Jews died during WWII,
    please to show me.. ?

    +++
     
  14. John Sholtes

    John Sholtes Banned

    Joined:
    May 6, 2012
    Messages:
    328
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Wednesday, November 23, 2011
    What Was The Holocaust... What Actually Happened?
    a
    Over the past 20 years I have read - with a very open mind - roughly 40 books on the Holocaust. So just what exactly was the Holocaust? What happened during that period?

    During World War II, Germany rounded up millions of civilians (both Jews and non-Jews) who could be potential saboteurs, belligerents, spies, informants, messengers of the enemy, subversives, etc. Germany put them in camps whilst the war was going on. At the end of the war, Germany planned to move them elsewhere (assuming Germany had won WWII). With regard to the Jews, Hitler had considered moving them to Madagascar (yes, you read that correctly, Madagascar). With that said, and despite what Jewish dominated Hollywood has been peddling for the past several decades, there was never, I repeat never, a plan to kill the Jews of Europe. Hitler's "Final Solution" was a plan to relocate Jews out of Europe - it was not a plan to exterminate them. This distinction cannot be emphasized enough.

    As it turned out, the vast majority of such potential subversives were, in fact, Jews. Why? Because Jews were overwhelmingly leftist, communist, Marxist, etc and thus many were naturally sympathetic to the USSR (which was of course communist and at war with Germany). For these reasons, Jews couldn't be trusted. Hence they were put in secured camps along with anyone, of any religion/creed/ethnicity/race/nationality, who may potentially engage in subversive activities. Homosexuals were put in not because they were homosexual but rather because homosexuals are almost universally, politically speaking, leftist. Thus homosexuals were put in the camps because of their subversive politics, not because of their sexuality.

    Incidentally, the USA did the exact same thing with the Japanese and to a lesser extent German and Italian Americans. FDR put them in camps because they couldn't be trusted during the war (the U.S. was of course fighting against Japan, Germany, and Italy). Further, the practice of rounding up potential belligerents and holding them in camps is extremely common during war - you will find this to be true when studying the history of warfare: from the ancient Greeks, ancient Chinese - you name it - rounding up potential belligerents has always been a common practice during war, all throughout recorded history.

    So what about all these Jews who allegedly died in and around the camps? Well, the majority who died did so in the final months of the war (perhaps 600,000 at most). In late 1944 and early 1945, the Allies were bombing Germany into the stone age. Roads, bridges, rail lines, etc were destroyed and hence Germany could no longer supply the various internment camps with food and medicine. The result? A lot of people died of disease and starvation both in the camps and all throughout Germany, including huge numbers of German civilians.

    Regarding the gas chambers... yes, there were indeed gas chambers but they were used to disinfect the prisoners (and their clothes) as a measure to prevent typhus from spreading. Zyklon-B was the chemical used for this purpose; it was the standard disinfectant chemical used in Europe at that time. Jews have manipulated this and claim, "the Nazis gassed 6 million Jews to death." Absolute nonsense. There is no evidence of this, none. What tourists are shown at Auschwitz is easily refuted. For example, the lone "gas chamber" at Auschwitz I (i.e., Auschwitz Camp 1; there is also an Auschwitz II, called Auschwitz-Birkenau, 3 km away) was built/modified by the Soviets after the war for propaganda purposes; the Polish government has acknowledged this (Auschwitz is in Poland, not Germany). Regarding Auschwitz-Birkenau's (i.e., Auschwitz II's) so-called "homicidal gas chambers," I refer you to this excellent critical analysis:



    So what was life in the camps really like? In short, the camps were run in an orderly and humane manner. They met all International Red Cross standards for POW camps (they were regularly inspected by the Red Cross). The German-run camps were very similar to the American camps for Japanese-Americans, German-Americans, and Italian-Americans (e.g., Manzanar in California for Japanese-Americans). Are there Holocaust survivors who speak honestly about their experience? Yes. In 1994 Steven Spielberg created the Shoah Foundation. This project involved interviewing some 52,000 Holocaust survivors and recording their testimonies. Hundreds if not thousands of survivors gave honest assessments of their treatment in the camps, indicating it was humane. Surprising to many people, recreational activities were available to the Jewish inmates: art classes, sports, musical performance, etc. But of course, Spielberg didn't use any of these testimonies because they undermined the "horror story" he so desperately was trying to implant in the public psyche. Researcher Eric Hunt visited the Shoah Foundation archives at Stanford University and copied several such video testimonies. Here is a small sample:



    .
     
  15. John Sholtes

    John Sholtes Banned

    Joined:
    May 6, 2012
    Messages:
    328
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    0
    One may wonder how is it that most Americans don't know about this? Easy. Americans are incredibly ignorant and gullible with regard to historical subjects. Americans are too busy watching sitcoms and sports to be bothered with studying history. Any "history" they do "learn" generally comes from TV and Hollywood movies. And these mediums are fully Jewish controlled (more on this below)... i.e., Jews make sure the truth about the Holocaust doesn't get out. Some may watch The History Channel and/or The Military Channel and think they're getting the truth about WWII, Hitler, and the Holocaust. But both of these cable channels are Jewish edited and provide extremely misleading and outright false accounts of such subjects. Hence, ignorant and misled Americans are easily manipulated into believing almost anything. To give you an example of just how ignorant Americans are: UCLA recently conducted a nationwide survey of 25 - 40 year old Americans. A staggering 56% could not name even a single Allied nation of World War II.

    Anyway, let's move onto another aspect of the Holocaust. Regarding the Eastern Front, it is indeed true that many Jews were killed there. After Germany invaded the USSR in June 1941, they encountered, in addition to the Soviet troops, tens of thousands of partisan fighters, mostly Jewish. In response to this, Germany expanded the Einsatzgruppen which was then tasked with finding these partisans and capturing or killing them. Thus, these were not "innocent Jews" in the context of war, they were Soviet supporters (i.e., partisans) engaging in guerrilla warfare against the German troops.

    That's what happened. That's the truth about the Holocaust.

    But Jews have grossly exaggerated the Jewish death toll (more dead = more sympathy); they claim six million when in reality the number of Jewish deaths (of all causes) during WWII is more like one million (at most). Organized Jewry has turned the "Holocaust" (as they branded it back in the 1970's) into a marketing tool - selling to the public "Jewish victimhood" which garners world Jewry tremendous sympathy. Any Psychologist will tell you that people who are viewed as "victims" tend to get away with more than others. The Holocaust is essentially a psychological weapon which targets the Western World. In particular, it is implicitly used as an excuse for Jews to commit horrendous crimes against the Palestinians and also engage in warmongering against many Muslim countries. The Holocaust is also used to extort billions of dollars in Holocaust reparations from Germany. Jewish scholar Norman Finkelstein explains this reparations racket in his book, The Holocaust Industry.

    Here we see the warmongering technique in action. The Prime Minister of Israel pushing for war against Iran in order to prevent another Holocaust:



    How do Jews get away with perpetuating this lie? They control Western mainstream media - this is their main weapon. What people see on TV and in films - and read in popular publications - contributes 95% to how they perceive matters of politics and history. On extremely rare occasion, a story exposing Jewish lies will "slip through the cracks" and be shown on mainstream media, as we see in the following. Incidentally, the editor at Good Morning America who allowed this piece to air was fired the next day:



    There are thousands of researchers who have published countless books, videos, and technical papers on the Holocaust. For those wanting to explore this topic further, I refer you to the following:

    Auschwitz: The Underground Guided Tour by Carolyn Yeager

    Auschwitz: Open Air Incinerations by Carlo Mattogno

    Treblinka: Extermination Camp or Transit Camp? by Carlo Mattogno and Jurgen Graf

    A Brief History of Forensic Examinations of Auschwitz by Germar Rudolf

    Expert Report on Chemical and Technical Aspects of the "Gas Chambers" of Auschwitz by Germar Rudolf

    David Cole, a Jewish man, thoroughly debunks the Holocaust in a 7-part Youtube video. Part 1.

    More Academic Books On The Holocaust:
    The Barnes Review Books
    .
     
  16. SAUER

    SAUER New Member

    Joined:
    May 16, 2012
    Messages:
    1,628
    Likes Received:
    18
    Trophy Points:
    0
    It has been estimated that the Nazi holocaust in Europe slaughtered some 6 million Jews, 5 million Protestants, 3 million Catholics and half a million Gypsies. This was the product not of international warfare, but a calculated State political policy of mass murder that has been termed "a structural and systematic destruction of innocent people by a State bureaucratic apparatus".(6) The Nazi intention to destroy particular human nations, races, religions, sexual groups, classes and political opponents as a premeditated plan was manifested before the Second World War. The war later offered the Nazi German leaders an opportunity to extend this policy from their own country to the peoples of occupied Poland, parts of the Soviet Union and elsewhere, with an
    intention of Germanizing their territories. The "final solution" included (as evidenced at the Nuremberg trial), "delayed-action genocide" aimed at destroying groups' biological future through sterilization, castration, abortion, and the forcible transfer of their [Page 8] children.(7) The term genocide, with also its concept as an international crime, was first used officially at the subsequent International Tribunal at Nuremberg. The indictment of 8 October 1945 of the major German war criminals charged that the defendant had:

    "conducted deliberate (8)

    The concluding speech by the British Prosecutor stated that:

    "Genocide was not restricted to extermination of the (9)

    23. The present two German Governments have been unflinching in their acknowledgment and condemnation of these guilty events, in their efforts to guard against any repetition of them or of Nazism. The Government of the Federal Republic of Germany had stated that official action will be taken, without the need for complaint from any member of the public, to prosecute people who seek to deny the truth about the Nazi crimes. President von Weizsacker in a forthright recent speech to the Bundestag made clear his belief that his countrymen must have known during the war of the fate of the Jews:

    "The genocide of the Jews is without example in history . . . at the end of the war, the whole unspeakable truth of the holocaust emerged. Too many said they knew nothing, or had only an inkling of it. There is no guilt or innocence of a whole people because guilt, like innocence, is not collective but individual. All those who lived through that time with full awareness should ask themselves today, quietly, about their involvement."
    http://www.preventgenocide.org/prevent/UNdocs/whitaker/section5.htm
    ________________________________________
    The Aushwitz was not only one concentration camp. There’s a list of nazi concentration camps.
    http://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/begdv_6/anlage_6.html
    BTW this list has been approved by The Ministry of the Interior of Germany. What do you think how many ppl including the jews were annihilated there?
    Also I hope you’ve heard about “Sonderaktion 1005”.

    Unfortunately, the full nominal list of victims does not exist. But ok Lisa let us suppose that nazis wasted not
    6 ,000, 000 but only 5, 4 even 1 mil jews. Is it makes the fascist regime more human?
     
  17. SAUER

    SAUER New Member

    Joined:
    May 16, 2012
    Messages:
    1,628
    Likes Received:
    18
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Tell it your grandma or relatives of killed by the Nazis during WWII Slavic, Jewish and Gipsy women. 07.jpg 4893.jpg
     
  18. SAUER

    SAUER New Member

    Joined:
    May 16, 2012
    Messages:
    1,628
    Likes Received:
    18
    Trophy Points:
    0
    that's right. who in their right mind would deny that? the fascist regime responsible for the Christian Holocaust as well.
     
  19. King of Fishers Island

    King of Fishers Island New Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2012
    Messages:
    100
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    0
     
  20. King of Fishers Island

    King of Fishers Island New Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2012
    Messages:
    100
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Fortunately, for all those who were not tall, fair-skinned, blond, blue-eyed, whilst possessing perfect Nordic-Skulls,
    Hitler failed.
     
  21. SAUER

    SAUER New Member

    Joined:
    May 16, 2012
    Messages:
    1,628
    Likes Received:
    18
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Ok what about fascist troops? Are all fascists were law-abiding ppl?

    Yep. The story of Adolf ends with the hero's death.
    s640x480.jpg
     
  22. _Lisa_

    _Lisa_ New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2011
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    19
    Trophy Points:
    0
    You and your link have misquoted Eichmann testimony. Amazing when you string a bunch of words together and change a few around, how the context changes, huh?...or take one statement and read it by itself without benefit of the ENTIRE dialogue. Sola Scriptura Protestant Jew worshippers do it all the time...LOL

    Here, at this PRO-JEWISH website, you will find the transcripts from Eichmann's entire trial:

    http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/e/eichmann-adolf/transcripts/Sessions/

    Specifically, in Volume V you will find session 107....and at part 2 (of 6) you will find what you have misquoted and out of context right at the top of the page, here:

    http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/e/eichmann-adolf/transcripts/Sessions/Session-107-02.html

    To summarize.....Eichmann relates that AFTER the formal first part of the meeting where they discussed EMIGRATION, RELOCATION and DEPORTATION, the booze started flowing and he says basically that he overheard some rather "blunt" language between some of the attendees. I bold typed and increased the font size of the pertinent parts below. Any reasonable, intellectually honest person WITHOUT an agenda, would understand that AFTER the meat of the meeting was over, the guys were slamming a few back and started talking smack amongst themselves.....NOTHING "official"......and frankly, nothing that Eichmann could remember verbatim.

    WHAT is most important about that bit of testimony, is as you read further down he absolutely and without hesitation states that there was NO TALK ABOUT GASSINGS.

    The Trial of Adolf Eichmann
    Session 107
    (Part 2 of 6)

    Q. Now, in connection with the Wannsee record of proceedings - in connection with the Wannsee Conference - you replied to my colleague, Judge Raveh, that in the part not referred to in the record, methods of killing were talked about.

    A. Yes.

    Q. Who spoke about this topic there?

    A. Today, I no longer have any detailed recollection of this matter, Your Honour, but I know that these gentlemen stood together and sat together, and in very blunt words they referred to the matter, without putting it down in writing. I would definitely not be able to remember this, if I did not know that at that time I said to myself: Look at that...Stuckart, who was always considered to be a very precise and very particular stickler for the law, and here the whole tone and all the manner of speech were totally out of keeping with legal language. That is the only thing, I would say, which has actually remained imprinted on my mind.

    Q. What did he say about this topic?

    A. In detail, Your Honour, I would like...

    Q. Not in detail - in general.

    A. There was talk about killing and eliminating and exterminating. I myself had in fact to make my preparations for drawing up the record - I could not stand there and just listen - but the words did reach me...got through to me because the room was not, in fact, such a big one that one could not catch single words from the flood of words...

    Q. I thought this was in the official part of the meeting?

    A. The official part - that did not last very long, that was the...

    Q. Was this in the official part or not? I thought it was in the official part, because it appears in the record and...

    A. It was also in the official part, Your Honour, but the official part, if you like, in turn consisted of two parts - that is to say, the beginning, where everyone kept quiet and had to listen, and then near the end, where everyone spoke about the matter all at once, and where the whole time the orderlies kept serving cognac or other drinks, and it got to the stage of alcoholic influence...all I mean is that, although it was an official matter, but still, it was not a stiff official matter, where everyone is quiet and everyone lets all the others have their say to the end, but at the end everyone spoke all at once.


    Q. But this was also taken down by the male or the female stenographer?

    A. Taken down by the male stenographer.

    Q. And apparently you were instructed not to include that in the official record of proceedings?

    A. Yes, that was the case. The shorthand-typist sat next to me, and I had to ensure that everything was recorded. And after that the shorthand-typist typed this up, and then Heydrich decided what should and what should not be included in the record. And then he, so to speak, polished it further, and then it was ready, this record of proceedings.

    Q. And what was said about this important topic, you have no recollection at all of this?

    A. Your Honour, this is not the most important point. What is the most important point in the record...

    Q. Excuse me, I did not say the most important point, I said "an important topic" - so important that it was then left out.

    A. No, on the contrary, Your Honour, Heydrich wanted to make sure that the main points were worked into the record. So it is in fact precisely the other way round. The essential points are in the record, and the non-essential points were then left out by him, because here, so to say - how shall I put it - he created a form of reinsurance, by pinning down the State Secretaries separately.

    Q. Does that mean, then, that the methods of killing were an unimportant topic?

    A. Oh, the methods of killing?

    Q. That is what we are talking about.

    A. He did not include those, no, no.

    Q. At that time was there talk of killing by gas?

    A. No, not by gas.
     
  23. _Lisa_

    _Lisa_ New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2011
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    19
    Trophy Points:
    0
    ...and btw, you do know that Israel illegally kidnapped Eichmann from Argentina and then LIED about it for quite some time before coming clean?......tried, sentenced and executed him in a country where he committed NO CRIME and in a country where what he was convicted of wasn't even a crime at the time that he was accused of committing it.

    Can you wrap your mind around that?
     
  24. _Lisa_

    _Lisa_ New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2011
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    19
    Trophy Points:
    0

    Follow the bouncing ball here. In 1990, Poland revised the figure from 4 million, to APPROX 1 1/2 million at Auschwitz....here is a newspaper article:

    http://news.google.com/newspapers?n...UlPAAAAIBAJ&sjid=KgMEAAAAIBAJ&pg=6841,5035859

    Now...if we have an original total of 6 million and take away 2 1/2 million, just how the hail do we STILL come up with 6 million?
     
  25. _Lisa_

    _Lisa_ New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2011
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    19
    Trophy Points:
    0
    The origin of the six million number is cabalistic and WW2 wasn't the first time it was tossed out:

    In the American Hebrew Magazine of October 31, 1919, there appeared an article entitled "The Crucifixion of Jews Must Stop!" By Martin H Glynn, former governor of the state of New York. This article begins, "From across the sea, six million men and women call to us for help ...". The article was published approximately 20 years before the outbreak of WW2. An image of the complete article is here:

    http://www.thebirdman.org/Index/Jew...WW1-GraphicFromTheAmericanHebrew31Oct1919.gif
     

Share This Page