Trump to declare National emergency for Wall

Discussion in 'United States' started by WalterSobchak, Feb 14, 2019.

  1. RP12

    RP12 Well-Known Member

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    True its about morals and feelings.
     
  2. ocean515

    ocean515 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I have links for every claim I make. I never just pull stuff out of the sky and many do here. These links are difficult to find, and the data isn't difficult to access.

    But I'm not compelled to do the work to provide it, again, and again, and again, especially when the person demanding it parses their questions as you have. "Significantly". When did I use that word? What does such a subjective word mean to you? As to the question of crimes committed by illegal aliens, why the need to qualify they types of crimes? Are some felonies acceptable?

    Data from the DJS shows crime and demographics within the Department of Corrections. Again, the data is available, and quite easy to access.
     
  3. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

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    I doubt if she knows who built trhe berlin wall or why
     
  4. ocean515

    ocean515 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes. Happens all the time.

    For example, Congress agrees to a certain level of funding for FEMA via DHS appropriations. That funding level is what Congress deems appropriate. When an extraordinary circumstance takes place, the President declares a National Emergency, which among other things, provides more money than Congress originally deemed appropriate, in order to deal with the crisis.

    I believe this power was granted the Executive Branch because it was apparent the nature of National Emergencies required immediate response, as opposed to the drawn out process and politics of a Congressional response. Congress does have the power, via the National Emergencies Act of 1976, to end such declarations based on the passage of a CR.
     
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  5. MrTLegal

    MrTLegal Well-Known Member

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    FEMA is not a project.

    Then give me a specific example, if it happens all the time. Stephen Miller and Jim Jordans could not think of an example when asked.
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2019
  6. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Not an NE but just as effective. Obama's unconstitutional DACA because Congress would not pass legislation on it.
     
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  7. RP12

    RP12 Well-Known Member

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    Nevermind ACA which was NOT a tax until Roberts realized if he changed it to be one it would be Constitutional.... But hey its fine for the SC to change laws now i guess eh?
     
  8. MrTLegal

    MrTLegal Well-Known Member

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    You are not providing any claims, so I don't get the "there are links to back up my claims."
     
  9. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

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    Roberts is the new kennedy
     
  10. MrTLegal

    MrTLegal Well-Known Member

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    DACA did not seek to claim more funds than Congress was previously willing to appropriate.
     
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  11. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

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    Obama didnt need money

    Just an amnesty that congress refused to give him
     
  12. ocean515

    ocean515 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    What does "FEMA is not a project" have to do with the matter at hand? Is National Security a one dimensional project?

    I gave you an example. Another would be President Trumps declaration of National Emergency due to the crisis in California caused by the fires. Congress had not approved the funds the Presidents declaration provided.

    Gov. Brown made this request: http://www.ktvu.com/news/trump-declares-emergency-declaration-for-california-fires

    "I am requesting direct federal assistance, including Department of Defense assets to immediately mitigate the impacts of this fire,..." ​
     
  13. ocean515

    ocean515 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I'm not inspired to invest the time to provide the links you're demanding. I've posted the information and links dozens of times. You can access the information yourself.
     
  14. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Which, of course, is just legislation.
     
  15. MrTLegal

    MrTLegal Well-Known Member

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    The emergency declaration to address Wildfires in California was not a national emergency declaration. Nor did Trump seek funds from Congress for that emergency, get denied, and then declare the emergency as a response.

    And "FEMA is not a project" is pretty relevant to the question that I asked you. I will ask it again in a different way.

    Presidents have declared a National Emergency 60 times in US history, including Trump's. Can you name one other instance during the previous 59 where the President sought money from Congress for a specific project (e.g. building the wall along the southern border is a project), got denied the amount of money requested, and then declared a national emergency in response?
     
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  16. ocean515

    ocean515 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Your injecting talking points that are of your own invention. That is not the way to have an honest discussion.

    The President has declared a National Emergency in light of the crisis on the Border, a crisis described by your favorite media sources.

    To address this National Emergency threatening the United States, the President will use the power granted to him to provide additional funds, beyond those already allocated, to strengthen our ability to respond and address the immediate need.

    This happens all the time as I've noted. I have no idea what thought thread you're attempting to try with regards to FEMA.

    All that being true, the bottom line is this will all play out in court, with the radical left attempting to keep their open borders pandering alive, and the Trump Administration fighting for the safety of all US Citizens. Most likely it all ends up in the Supreme Court.

    I find it interesting people think the President just barked out a command, without doing all the due diligence regarding authority before doing so.
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2019
  17. guavaball

    guavaball Well-Known Member

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    Signing that bill was perhaps the dumbest move of Trump's presidency so far.

    The bill specifically limits his ability to build any wall and restricts even where he can build it which could easily be interpreted as having to be followed by any declaration of emergency.
     
  18. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    Rambling like a foolish idiot, yes.
    But he states: I didn't need to do this. I didn't have to do this. He put the nail in the coffin of it being a National Emergency.
     
  19. MrTLegal

    MrTLegal Well-Known Member

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    Trump barks out commands without doing the due diligence regarding the authority before doing so all the time. Trump's former secretary of state admitted, in public, that he routinely had to tell Trump that he could not accomplish a stated goal, constitutionally. Trump banned transgendered individuals from the military without consulting his military. He banned the travel of muslims without telling his DOJ.

    You keep claiming that you provided examples and data, but instead you provide none. You have yet to provide a SINGLE example of a President seeking funding from Congress for a specific project, getting rejected by Congress, and then declaring a national emergency in response. You cited to FEMA and then abandoned that example about being told that FEMA is not a project. Then you cited the relief for the California wildfires, but appear to have forgotten that this not an example because that relief was not the result of a national emergency declaration.

    But yes, this will play out in the court - after Trump uses the first veto of his presidency to override the joint resolution of disapproval by the Senate and Congress against his national declaration.

    And when the courts evaluate whether this declaration was necessary and justified, they will first have to contend with, or ignore, Trump saying, "I didn't need to do this. I just wanted to do it faster, that's all."
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2019
  20. RP12

    RP12 Well-Known Member

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    https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/16/us/sec-shanahan-border-funding/index.html

    The "courts" are going to have an issue with the SoD moving DoD money around?
     
  21. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  22. MrTLegal

    MrTLegal Well-Known Member

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    There have been two instances when a President declared a national emergency to move military funds around for a construction project.

    The first was by George HW Bush during the middle of the first Iraq war. The second was by George W. Bush immediately after 9/11.
     
  23. RP12

    RP12 Well-Known Member

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    Then there is nothing to challenge.
     
  24. MrTLegal

    MrTLegal Well-Known Member

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    Nothing to do challenge? Surely you are not arguing that "month to month illegal immigration along the southern border being at ~20 year lows" is comparable to the Iraq War or 9/11?
     
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  25. RP12

    RP12 Well-Known Member

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    Are you saying the SoD can not move DoD money around?
     

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