I don't claim to be a historian either. I suppose that it's because of my family's German and English background and growing up around WW 2 Veterans that I developed an interest in European history. I am a little over 70 years old, am an ex paratrooper & American combat Veteran and, as you know have lived, worked and studied in Germany in the early - mid 1970s where I came to know honest holocaust survivors, German WW 2 war widows and German WW 2 Veterans who after a few glasses of wine or beer felt comfortable talking to another far more fortunate Veteran who understood the horrors of war. So, what little I know about WW 2 and the holocaust is based on what is now called eyewitness testimony and no little amount of objective reading and research. Additionally, I have done enough manual labor to know what is possible and what is not as far as dragging/carrying bodies, burning things, digging pits, building things and destroying them. That's how I know that many of the stories told by dishonest holocaust survivors are simply not physically possible. When you claimed that the reason there are no skeletal remains at Auschwitz was because they were ground up by people using "pestles", I suspected that you were fabricating an explanation because the skeletal remains of 1.1 million people simply do not exist because nowhere near that number died or were killed. That's what holocaustians and dishonest holocaust survivors do when confronted with the truth, they fabricate an impossible explanation and hope that no one notices. Since there is no physical evidence that 1.1 million people died at Auschwitz, you simply made up an explanation and hoped that no one would notice. Re: I question everything and then believe the explanation that makes the most sense. If, for example, the skeletal remains of even about 700,000 people were discovered at or near Auschwitz, then I would consider changing my mind but with no physical evidence why should anyone believe a few "eyewitnesses" whose stories contradict each other or are physically impossible?. Basically, the only evidence to support the SHN is comprised of some "eye witness accounts" who report things that are not physically possible. There are just as many honest holocaust who tell the truth but their stories are repressed by the greedy Holocaust Industry that attempts to extort money from anyone they can far into the future(1) for more profitable theme parks and child brainwashing projects(2). That's why Norman Finkelstein wrote the book "The Holocaust Industry" and was subsequently persecuted by the same influential crooks he exposed. Re: What "stuff" supports the SHN other than a few physically impossible and contradictory stories? (1) "Holocaust Survivors' Children Sue Germany for Therapy Fees" https://www.haaretz.com/1.4952800 EXCERPT "Suit, filed in Tel Aviv, seeks funds to pay for biweekly therapy sessions for up to 20,000 affected by the scars of their parents. The lawsuit marks the very first time that the German government will be asked to take responsibility and to care for those of the second generation in Israel and indeed, worldwide, attorney Gideon Fisher said before filing the suit at the Tel Aviv District Court."CONTINUED (2) "Holocaust Education: Passing on the Knowledge" http://www.claimscon.org/what-we-do/allocations/red/education/ EXCERPT “The Claims Conference funds numerous organizations that train educators from around the world, including in countries with tiny Jewish communities. Claims Conference allocations provide scholarships to allow needy students from around the world to visit sites of Nazi atrocities through organizations such as Birthright Israel, Israel Experience, and the Jewish Agency for Israel.” CONTINUED
O.k., let's put it this way... Show me, where are the x-numbers of murdered Jews, Sinti and Homos? IF you are so convinced they were gassed and/or shot, then where is your evidence?
Of course the murder of even one innocent individual is not morally justified but, like it or not the number of people killed often determines the magnitude of the crime in the eyes of most. For example, in a court of law, a killer of 10 people is judged far more harshly than a murderer of one person. On the other hand, I believe Stalin said: "“If only one man dies of hunger, that is a tragedy. If millions die, that’s only statistics.”(1) However, I will go so far as to say that 1 million deaths is more desirable than the deaths of 6 million people but in the eyes of most, a deliberate genocidal agenda to murder 1 million innocent people is not quite as heinous as a deliberate genocidal agenda killing 6 million. The difference is in the intent. While there were certainly war crimes, executions and even mass executions committed by every participant of WW 2, it is claimed that the Germans had a genocidal agenda (i.e. a "Final Solution") against Europe's Jews when, in reality no such genocidal plan existed. Out of the tons of captured German documents absolutely no document has been found anywhere that confirms that Hitler ordered the mass extermination of anyone.(2) As you probably know, the British cracked the German Enigma code and were able to listen in on all secret German radio transmissions. Nowhere in any of those countless intercepted radio transmissions is there anything to indicate that a genocidal Final Solution was going on.(3) The real Final Solution in its early stages was a joint project between the German Zionist Federation and Germany's National Socialists to relocate Germany's Jews to Palestine(4). The mutually agreed upon document between Germany's Zionists and the National Socialists was The Haavara Agreement. After the war broke out, the British blocked the transfer of Germany's Jews to Palestine and some Jews, Communists, Catholics, the Roma etc were transported to work camps to the East. Jews were persecuted not because they were Jewish but because the spreading of Communism was one of Germany's greatest threats and the fact that the Communist leadership had been mostly Jewish(5), many Jews were suspected as national threats and were interred in camps. Most Jews were not interred in work camps and, as I showed earlier, some were high ranking Nazi Party members others served in Hitler's military and some were Hitler's personal friends(6), (7). Still, there is no doubt that many innocent people of many different backgrounds were sent to work camps. in the East where, according to mainstream historian, Arno Mayer, more died of natural causes and disease than were executed. Other than several fraudulent stories that contradict each other, there was absolutely no evidence of a German genocidal agenda. Finally, was it moral to confiscate the property of innocent people and inter them in distant work camps? No. Were other countries actually committing genocide while doing the same thing? Yes. The spotlight has only been on exaggerated German war crimes because Germany lost the war and only the victors get to write the history. (1) https://quoteinvestigator.com/2010/05/21/death-statistic/ (2) “To the present day a written order by Hitler regarding the destruction of the European Jewish community has not been found, and, in all probability, this order was never given.” - Walter Laqueur, Was niemand wissen wollte: Die Unterdruckung der Nachrichten uber Hitlers Endlösung (What Nobody Wanted to Know: The Suppression of News About Hitler’s “Final Solution”), (Berlin-Vienna, 1981), p.190 (3) “THE HOLOCAUST NARRATIVE” https://archive.org/stream/BreakingTheSpell_48/BreakingTheSpell-Kollerstrom_djvu.txt EXCERPT “In 1941, British Intelligence analysts cracked the German “Enigma” code. This undermined the German war effort—but also threw new light on day-by-day events in the Nazi concentration camp system. Between January 1942 and January 1943, encrypted radio communications between those camps and the Berlin headquarters were intercepted and decrypted. Oddly enough, historians have largely ignored the information furnished in these intercepts relating to “arrivals,” “departures,” recorded deaths and other events at these camps.The only reasonable explanation is that the intercepted data contra-dicts, even refutes, the orthodox “Holocaust” narrative. The information does not expose a program of mass murder and racial genocide. Quite the opposite: it reveals that the Germans were determined, desperate even, to reduce the death rate in their work camps, which was caused by catastrophic typhus epidemics.”CONTINUED (4) "The Zionist-Nazi Collaboration" https://dissidentvoice.org/2012/07/the-zionist-nazi-collaboration/ EXCERPT "The Zionists’ use of Nazism involved, among other things, the blocking of avenues of escape to other countries of Europe’s Jews and diverting them to Palestine" CONTINUED (5) “Putin: First Soviet government was mostly Jewish” https://www.jpost.com/jewish-world/...st-soviet-government-was-mostly-jewish-317150 EXCERPT “Russian President Vladimir Putin said that at least 80 percent of the members of the first Soviet government were Jewish.” CONTINUED (6) “5 Jews Hitler Actually Liked” https://historyofyesterday.com/5-jews-hitler-actually-liked-c702217e1aa5 EXCERPT “Surprisingly, during this time in his life, Hitler also had extremely good relationships with Jewish people. At his house in Vienna, almost all of his friends were Jewish, with Josef Neumann being the closest. And when Hitler took over Germany, he spared some of his old Jewish friends, kept some in his party, and even formed new friendships.” CONTINUED (7) "Remarkable tale of Hitler's young Jewish friend" https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-46192941 EXCERPT "Hitler continued the friendship despite knowing her Jewish heritage But this did not dissuade Hitler from carrying on his friendship with girl, to whom he had sent a signed copy of the photograph." CONTINUED
What is "hateful" about discussing a historical event. The following example is a true example of "hate speech": Fortunately, Hitler had no plan or desire to exterminate Europe's Jews. Hitler's fight was against the spread of Stalin's Communism.
Re: The evidence, of course would be the skeletal remains of "millions" of people. The way that the Holocaust Industry deceives people is to lie about crude and rushed cremations and claim that the bodies were reduced to ashes which disappeared with the wind. That's another complete lie spread by the Holocaust Industry and its complicit MSM. Even in modern cremations bones and teeth remain(1). People who were allegedly burned in pits are even less thoroughly burned and also leave even more bones and teeth. Therefore, if 1.1 million people were killed at Auschwitz, according to the the Holocaust Industry, then there would be billions of bones and teeth at or around Auschwitz but to date, absolutely no mass graves containing even a tiny fraction of the 1.1 million people. @pitbull claimed that the bones and teeth were ground to dust by "pestles" but has since retracted that claim so there is still no explanation for the absence of billions of bones and teeth except that the Holocaust Industry is lying, again. So, we still have no explanation for the absence of skeletal remains of 1.1 million people except that the Holocaust Industry and Western MSM is lying, again. (1) "9 Things About Cremation" https://www.elementalnw.com/2014/05/26/9-things-cremation/ EXCERPT "2. You don’t get ash back. What’s really returned to you is the person’s skeleton. Once you burn off all the water, soft tissue, organs, skin, hair, cremation container/casket, etc., what you’re left with is bone." CONTINUED
Hatred of jews manifests itself in numerous lies in this discussion. For example, the claim that the Nazis didn't want to exterminate the European Jews is an anti-Semitic lie. Anyone who claims that is a Holocaust denier Jewish shop owners and Jewish scholars had nothing to do with Communism which was definitely as evil as Nazism. But they were Hitler's scapegoats, a false reason to attack Eastern Europe as he predicted in "Mein Kampf".
Are you kidding me? This is page 100+ of an HC-related thread. Everyone here who has come to this point should know the SHN ((c) by Grau)
I can only speak for myself so where have I expressed any hatred toward Jews in anything that I've written anywhere on this forum. I have certainly never written anything so hate filled as wishing that Hitler had killed them and calling them an evil "anti-race": It is a simple and supportable fact that there was no genocidal plan by the Germans to kill Europe's Jews(1) Nowhere in any of the secret German radio transmissions(2) was there any mention of a genocidal agenda nor is there any mention of a genocidal German agenda in the post war books written by Eisenhower, Churchill, or de Gaulle. The Wannsee Conference, too, make no mention of killing Europe's Jews.(3) How is the fact that there was no genocidal German agenda to kill Europe's Jews "anti Semitic" when it says nothing about Jews? Re: I never said that all of Germany's Jews were Communists but, again, it's a supportable fact the early Communist leadership was primarily Jewish. Finally, Germany attacked Poland because the League of Nations refused to stop the massacres of German nationals in and around Danzig by murderous Poles who turned out to be more anti Semitic than the Germans(4). (1) “To the present day a written order by Hitler regarding the destruction of the European Jewish community has not been found, and, in all probability, this order was never given.” - Walter Laqueur, Was niemand wissen wollte: Die Unterdruckung der Nachrichten uber Hitlers Endlösung (What Nobody Wanted to Know: The Suppression of News About Hitler’s “Final Solution”), (Berlin-Vienna, 1981), p.190 (2) “THE HOLOCAUST NARRATIVE” https://archive.org/stream/BreakingTheSpell_48/BreakingTheSpell-Kollerstrom_djvu.txt EXCERPT “In 1941, British Intelligence analysts cracked the German “Enigma” code. This undermined the German war effort—but also threw new light on day-by-day events in the Nazi concentration camp system. Between January 1942 and January 1943, encrypted radio communications between those camps and the Berlin headquarters were intercepted and decrypted. Oddly enough, historians have largely ignored the information furnished in these intercepts relating to “arrivals,” “departures,” recorded deaths and other events at these camps.The only reasonable explanation is that the intercepted data contra-dicts, even refutes, the orthodox “Holocaust” narrative. The information does not expose a program of mass murder and racial genocide. Quite the opposite: it reveals that the Germans were determined, desperate even, to reduce the death rate in their work camps, which was caused by catastrophic typhus epidemics.”CONTINUED (3) "The Wannsee Conference: Another Lie Crushed" http://barnesreview.org/the-wannsee-conference-another-lie-crushed/ EXCERPT "The actual minutes of the Wannsee Conference can be read in their entirety—in the original German here, In reality, the Wannsee meeting and its minutes do not contain a master plan to kill Jews; – Nowhere in the meeting’s minutes is genocide discussed, planned, proposed, or even suggested; – The Wannsee meeting never discussed gas chambers, shootings, or any of the fantasies propagated by the exterminationists; – The Wannsee Minutes reported that there were only 4.5 million Jews under German control (yet 4.3 million Jewish compensation claims have been lodged against the postwar German government); – The Wannsee meeting was a planning meeting on how Europe’s Jews should be deported, via transit camps, to the East; with able-bodied Jews being forced to build roads and other labor intensive tasks in those regions; – The Wannsee Conference also made allowance for specific exceptions to Jewish evacuation, such as Jewish German World War I veterans; ALL Jews over the age of 65; and ALL Jews working in industries vital to the German war effort, to be released from the threat of evacuation and be allowed to stay in Germany. There is therefore, no justification for the allegation that the Wannsee Conference was a ‘master plan for mass murder’ and everyone who claims this to be the case, from Netanyahu down, is simply lying." CONTINUED (4) "1946 US report said ‘Poles persecuted the Jews as vigorously as did the Germans’" "Post-war declassified State Department document found long history of Polish anti-Semitism before, during and after Holocaust" https://www.timesofisrael.com/1946-...ed-the-jews-as-vigorously-as-did-the-germans/ EXCERPT "A US State Department report from May 15, 1946, found “evidence that Poles persecuted the Jews as vigorously as did the Germans” during the World War II Nazi occupation of Poland. The declassified report was distributed Thursday by the Simon Wiesenthal Center, the same day that a Polish law making it a crime to accuse the Polish nation of Nazi-era atrocities took effect. Also Thursday, senior Israeli and Polish diplomats met in Jerusalem in a bid to resolve differences over the law." CONTINUED
Hey, I'm a little elderly and need clear explanations, preferably with some links. Could you, please, be so kind and name me a few sources that show exactly where and when the dead people were buried? I honestly don't know. Everything seems to be "understood, generalized and clear as ink", yet nothing is concrete or written in stone.
No problem. This PDF might enlighten you: https://www.holocaustremembrance.com/sites/default/files/MMWG_Killing_Sites.pdf
You don't have to write it yourself. That's the way Nazis thought of Jews and how they treated them. Most HC deniers only deny the intentional mass killings. Do you also deny the persecution of Jews completely? Do you think Jews could lead normal lives under Hitler's regime? We never talked about that, with the exception that you named Jews Hitler didn't kill because they were useful to him. This is a spurious correlation. Communism received special attention in intellectual circles. And at that time, almost every third intellectual was a Jew. Hitler attacked Poland because he wanted Lebensraum for his fictional Aryan race, as he wrote in "Mein Kampf". I agree with you that it's wrong to blame all Germans for Hitler's crimes. There were many German opponents against Adolph, but unfortunately, they couldn't prevail.
Thanks a million for your effort! That is quite the handful and will take me a while to check out. From the little I Iooked at tonight I gather there are many mass graves all over Europe, especially in Poland and the Ukraine, as well as Lithuania. Unbelievable! Mostly just shootings.
Re: How the Nazis thought of Jews has nothing to do with my feelings toward Jews which is friendly. I'm sure that different members of the Nazi Party had different feelings toward Jews just like different American Republicans have different feelings toward Blacks. The fact that some Jews were members of the Nazi Party simply proves that some Nazis liked Jews while some did not. Apparently your hatred of Jews is more in line with the feelings of some Nazi Party members toward Jews. Re: Again, I don't deny that the holocaust happened and have already shown that there was no genocidal German agenda to kill all of Europe's Jews. Yes, many Jews who were avid Communists, had Communist sympathies etc were persecuted and put into camps very much like the Japanese-Americans during WW 2 while other Jews prospered(1) under Nazism and carried out their lives in society with some restrictions. In spite of what brainwashed holocaustians have been trained to parrot, Hitler did have friendly relationships with some Jews(2), (3). Hitler saw that high ranking Jewish Communists overthrew Russia and he feared that they may do the same thing in Germany. That's why they were persecuted. Re: As long as the victors write the history books, Germany will be blamed for "starting WW 2." The truth is that Hitler invaded Poland because the murderous Poles were massacring German nationals and in spite of dozens of German appeals to the League of Nations to resolve the matter peacefully, the League of Nations did nothing and the massacres continued(4) so Hitler invaded to prevent more massacres. Yes, Hitler did plan to retake territories to the East and only attacked Russia because he learned of Stalin's plan to sweep Westward in 1941 - 1942.(5) (1) "Top 10 Nazi Collaborators Who Were Jews" https://listverse.com/2017/01/03/top-10-nazi-collaborators-who-were-jews/ EXCERPT "When we think of the Holocaust, we often imagine that the Germans were solely responsible for the identification and deportation of Jews and others to the death camps. The truth, however, is that a number of Jews worked under the Nazis and helped to identify thousands of their fellow men for deportation to the death camps. The Nazi collaborators on this list either volunteered to help the Nazis or were forced to trade the lives of hundreds or thousands of their fellow Jews for their own lives and the lives of their families. Greed, self-preservation, and hate are the main reasons for the actions these individuals took." CONTINUED (2) “5 Jews Hitler Actually Liked” https://historyofyesterday.com/5-jews-hitler-actually-liked-c702217e1aa5 EXCERPT “Surprisingly, during this time in his life, Hitler also had extremely good relationships with Jewish people. At his house in Vienna, almost all of his friends were Jewish, with Josef Neumann being the closest. And when Hitler took over Germany, he spared some of his old Jewish friends, kept some in his party, and even formed new friendships.” CONTINUED (3) "Remarkable tale of Hitler's young Jewish friend" https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-46192941 EXCERPT "Hitler continued the friendship despite knowing her Jewish heritage But this did not dissuade Hitler from carrying on his friendship with girl, to whom he had sent a signed copy of the photograph." CONTINUED (4) "The 1939 Danzig Massacres of ethnic Germans which caused Hitler to invade Poland" http://fr.soc.histoire.narkive.com/...-germans-which-caused-hitler-to-invade-poland The 1939 Danzig Massacres EXCERPT "In the months leading up to the German invasion the Polish Army and independent Bolshevik units had been slaughtering German nationals in the Danzig corridor. Mass killings of thousands of civilian ethnic Germans (Volksdeutsche) by both civilian and Russian NDVK Jews, who were confident that Poland would quickly defeat Germany. Many apparently expected to take possession of German farms and businesses. An estimated 58,000 German civilians lost their lives in the massacres carried out prior to the 1939 invasion. Poles had been merrily slaughtering anything or anybody German since at least as early as April 1939, with smaller incidents stretching back to the close of WW I -- you haven't been told that by the Mass Media, or the fact that these atrocities were one of the main causes for the German invasion of Poland. Germany had protesting in writing to the League of Nations literally dozens of times with no results."CONTINUED (5) "Did Stalin Plan to Attack Hitler in 1941? The Historiographical Controversy Surrounding the Origins of the Nazi-Soviet War" http://www.inquiriesjournal.com/art...urrounding-the-origins-of-the-nazi-soviet-war EXCERPT " He [Victor Suvorov] cites a lack of defensive preparations, such as the construction of fortified lines and anti-tank ditches, and notes their deployment in hidden areas (such as woods) as evidence of the intention of the soviet leadership to conceal an imminent offensive operation. …Stalin’s desire to attack Nazi Germany in 1941 with an analysis of soviet foreign policy during the 1930s. They contend that Stalin believed in the concept of world revolution, and that the Second World War provided Stalin an opportunity to extend soviet influence throughout Europe. Mel'tiukhov, for instance, asserts that, “the USSR’s principal aim was to expand the “front of socialism” across as much territory as possible.”CONTINUED
Thanks again. It is a real challenge for me to plow through this article. Already on pg. 4 I encounter a stumbling block. It states: "... massacres were carried out in all of the territories from East to West and not only in Eastern Europe. Massacres also occurred in Western Europe, especially during the spring/summer 1940 with even more during 1944, not to speak about the “Final Solution,” which was implemented on the entire continent." As far as I know has the latest research resulted in a declaration, that no-one was gassed in Germany proper throughout the war. So, the above statement makes a false claim, UNLESS the massacres were conducted without the gas chambers. Then, still on pg. 4, it states: "... Immediately after the invasion of the country, the German army and the Einsatzgruppen in the Polish territory killed several thousand Jews within the very first days of the occupation. In parallel, the Germans started the elimination of the Polish intelligentsia, which led during the first months to the killing of thousands of Polish citizens (e.g., Aktion Tannenberg‟s 20,000 victims). Up to 100,000 people were killed during the first year of occupation. " The Polish intelligentsia was killed by the Russians---> Katyn is one example. From Pat Buchanan I learned that Hitler wanted a pact with Poland to fight Stalin. So, why kill millions of Poles to make them angry and aggressive? I begin to suspect this Mr. Tal Bruttmann, the author of your pdf is heavily biased against the Germans. "By the end of 1941 it is estimated that at least 1,100,000 Jews (according to Hilberg) were killed by the Einsatzgruppen, police battalions, and various nationalist units operating in the territories of the USSR." That is as much as now is listed in Auschwitz as having been killed altogether. I am confused as to what to believe. Then I googled for a mass grave in Treblinka and the closest photo I found is this... Treblinka mass grave site It shows and proves no corpses or other remnants. Again, I am disappointed of not being shown the real thing. For now I give up, but will keep reading and checking as strength and time permit.
I just came across this. I haven't had time to look at much of it but I'm posting it anyway. It's in French but it has English subtitles. Vincent Reynouard - Les Einsatzgruppen partie 1 : Hitler et la "guerre juive" - Einsatzgruppen part 1 - Hitler and the Jewish's war https://archive.org/details/VincentReynouardEinsatzgruppenHitlerAndTheJewishsWar1De4 Vincent Reynouard - Les Einsatzgruppen partie 2 : Pourquoi Hitler a envahi l'URSS - Einsatzgruppen part 2 - Why Hitler invaded the USSR https://archive.org/details/VincentReynouardEinsatzgruppenPart2WhyHitlerInvadedTheUSSR Vincent Reynouard - Les Einsatzgruppen partie 3 : les Einsatzgruppen et les Juifs- Einsatzgruppen part 3 – The einsatzgruppens and the jews https://archive.org/details/VincentReynouardLesEinsatzgruppenPartie3LesEinsatzgruppenEtLesJuifs Vincent Reynouard - Les Einsatzgruppen partie 4 : Juges et historiens pris en flagrant délit de mensonges - Einsatzgruppen part 4 : Lying Judges and Historians Caught Red-Handed https://archive.org/details/Vincent...gesEtHistoriensPrisEnFlagrantDelitDeMensonges I came across those videos when I was looking for this. Good Morning from the Zundelsite: http://www.zundelsite.org/assets/981005.html edit ---------------------------------------- I just found another. I haven't watched it. Vincent Reynouard - Plaidoyer pour les Einsatzgruppen - Shoah par Balle - Plea for the Einsatzgruppen - The Holocaust by the bullets https://archive.org/details/Vincent...satzgruppenShoahParBallePleaForTheEinsatzgrup More here... https://archive.org/search.php?query=Vincent+Reynouard+
I keep finding stuff that I don't have time to read. Full text of "The Einsatzgruppen" https://archive.org/stream/EinsatzgruppenCarloMattogno/EinsatzgruppenCarloMattogno_djvu.txt
Hello Jazz, I looked through the same document that @pitbull was kind enough to provide for you. Unfortunately, it is simply more of the same fraudulent Holocaust Industry lies and unproven speculations that you would expect from people so dishonest that they would cheat holocaust survivors, embezzle tens of millions of dollars and cheat various governments for self enrichment(1), (2). Anyplace can be claimed to be a "mass grave" by installing a few large rocks and putting up a few signs and that's about what happened at Babi Yar, Treblinka and countless other places. Treblinka where about 850,000 people are claimed to have been killed and has had two detailed examinations but no mass graves were found.(3), (4) Additionally, no mass graves have been found at or around Auschwitz where about 1.1 million people are supposed to have died. The explanation that holocaustians have for the absence of human remains is that the bodies were burned and only ashes remained. This is another lie used by the Holocaust Industry because when someone is cremated, there are still bones and teeth that remain.(5) So, if about 850,000 people were killed and burned on pyres, millions of bones and teeth would be impossible to miss. The same reality exists at Auschwitz where the skeletal remains of 12 people were found in a nearby river. These 12 remains could, like countless skeletal remains throughout the area could have been from Napoleon's Army, WW 1 or any era but they are far from support for the claim that 1.1 million people were murdered. Tickets for a guided tour of Auschwitz are about $25.00 so I'm thinking of building my own holocaust memorial / mass grave in my back yard and only charging $15.00 since as you know, a German submarine carrying 1.5 million Jews came up the James River in 1944 and there was a "death march" to my property where all the Jews were forced to dig a huge "death pit", cut down trees and then burn themselves at the point of a gun. The evil German crew who conducted the massacre used the 2 "death shovels" in my tool shed to cover everything up so thoroughly that it looks like nothing happened. By the way, I've still got the 2 "death shovels" that anyone can touch for $5.00. Of course anyone who doesn't believe the famous "James River massacre" is just one of those crazy anti Semitic "holocaust deniers". (1)"17 CHARGED IN $42 MILLION HOLOCAUST FRAUD CASE" http://www.nbcnews.com/id/40093058/...ed-million-holocaust-fraud-case/#.XU62pSMwi_U EXCERPT "Federal prosecutors said Tuesday they have broken up a long-running scam in which people falsely claimed to be victims of the Nazi persecution so they could get money out of a fund that pays Holocaust reparations."CONTINUED (2)"HOLOCAUST CLAIMS CONFERENCE FRAUD LIKELY ‘MUCH HIGHER’ THAN $57 MILLION" http://www.jpost.com/Diaspora/Holoc...aud-likely-much-higher-than-57-million-408298 EXCERPT "For over a decade, a criminal ring within the organization embezzled tens of millions of dollars through false restitution claims.”CONTINUED (3) “Treblinka: Revealing the hidden graves of the Holocaust” https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-16657363 EXCERPT “Despite this, in a later statement they said they had discovered no mass graves.” CONTINUED (4) “Treblinka Ground Radar Examination Finds No Trace of Mass Graves” https://www.historiography-project.com/jhrchives/v19/v19n3p20_radar.php EXCERPT “A detailed forensic examination of the site of the wartime Treblinka camp, using sophisticated electronic ground radar, has found no evidence of mass graves there.” CONTINUED "9 Things About Cremation" https://www.elementalnw.com/2014/05/26/9-things-cremation/ EXCERPT "2. You don’t get ash back. What’s really returned to you is the person’s skeleton. Once you burn off all the water, soft tissue, organs, skin, hair, cremation container/casket, etc., what you’re left with is bone." CONTINUED
Hi, Grau, I have also partially looked into Scott's "Einsatzgruppen..." article, written by Mattogno, and am truly shocked to learn that the German Einsatzgruppen did operate in the German-occupied countries, like Russia etc. and they apparently did kill thousands over thousands of mostly civilian people. That I never knew! I thought they went after the cruel partisans who mixed with and hid under the civilians and were hard to catch. The partisans for instance were the ones who tortured and mutilated any German soldiers they could lay their hands on. This Mattogno guy has gathered from archives lists of shootings in various locations that the German officers put together and submitted to Berlin, often exaggerating the numbers. It shocks me how coldblooded they would herd a bunch of Jews together and shoot them. IF I am reading and understanding this correctly, then I am very sad and disappointed and it serves the Germans right to have lost the war! But as I have been reading some more, I also learned that the Einsatzgruppen performed practical tasks, like harvesting overdue crops and repairing damaged houses, so people could live in it again. Even the people's religious needs were considered and orthodox clergy was hauled back and encouraged to talk to the people. A big Thank You to colleague Scott for supplying us with good links! This is definitely a subject I need to study more. Dear Grau, I hope you will read this link, too, and let me know how you see and understand it. Thanks everyone! Here is Scott's link: https://archive.org/stream/EinsatzgruppenCarloMattogno/EinsatzgruppenCarloMattogno_djvu.txt
I am happy to have given you something that interests you. ) Gassing was not the primary method of killing. Most of the Nazi victims were shot. Besides other cruelties like killing through forced labor or medical trials. Both murdered Poles and other innocent people, Nazism and Communism alike. It doesn't matter who killed more. Bolshevism and Nazism are both extremely evil ideologies. May our Lord save us from any of these ideologies ever coming back to life.
So far it has made me suspicious that it is nothing more than allied-tempered material. But I haven't done anymore reading yet. What really knocked me down is Scott's link about the Einsatzgruppen. https://archive.org/stream/EinsatzgruppenCarloMattogno/EinsatzgruppenCarloMattogno_djvu.txt Page 249 example: - The Police Regiment South shot 4,414 Jews at Ostroh and Polonne on 2 September 1,548 at Ruzhyn on 10 September, 1,255 at Koziatyn on 11 September. - The Police Battalion 304 killed 2,200 Jews at Vinnytsia on 5 September, 486 at Lodyzhyn on 13 September, 1,438 at Haisyn on 16 September, 4,200 at Ki- rovohrad on 30 September; - the 1st SS Infantry Brigade eliminated 5,397 Jews between 10 September and 10 November; - “the brigade’s maintenance platoon under SS Untersturmfiihrer Max Taubner shot 969 people: 319 Jews in Novohrad-Volynsky (Zhytomyr Oblast), 191 Jews in Sholokhove (Dnepropetrovsk Oblast), and 459 Jews in Oleksandriia (Kirovohrad Oblast)”; - the Police Battalion 304 killed 305 Jews at Oleksandriia on 4 October, 6,000 at Uman on 8 October and 47 near Zniamianka on 14 October; - a detachment of Einsatzkommando 5 shot 5,300 Jews at Proskuriv on 4 No¬ vember, the Police Battalions 315 and 320 and a company from the 33rd Po¬ lice Battalion killed 15,000 Jews at Rivne on 6 and 7 November. ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ I don't know what to say except, I will do some investigating!! It can't be true! As it happened, I had ordered the book by Pat Buchanan: "Churchill, Hitler and the Unnecessary War", which I've started to read at the same time. All together, it is an overload for my emotions and my brain as well. I'm disappointed to find that Buchanan, although he really exposes Churchill and Stalin as war criminals, does not shelter Hitler. Truth is, my childhood memories of the good Nazis and the first class SS soldiers are being threatened. It is really too bad that I never talked with my brothers as an adult about the war and their experiences. That is new to me. Nevertheless, any method would produce corpses to take care of. Where are all those graves? Or were they lugging the crematoriums around with them to burn the dead? Bolshevism killed their own people! In contrast, Hitler really cared about the German folk, the common worker.
It's not that easy to figure out how many Jews were killed by the Germans. It certainly isn't zero. There's a lot of second-hand info and circumstantial evidence. http://politicalforum.com/index.php?threads/about-the-holocaust.552312/page-88#post-1072758448 Media Coverage of the Irving-Lipstadt Trial http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v19/v19n2p47_Raven.html (excerpt) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Irving contends the Nazis didn't kill as many as six million Jews in a systematic extermination effort. But he accepts that the Nazis were responsible for the deaths of many Jews, maybe one million, most of whom were killed by malnutrition, disease or firing squads. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- There's also some pretty good physical evidence. http://politicalforum.com/index.php?threads/about-the-holocaust.552312/page-89#post-1072763242 It's pretty clear that the official story of how the bodies were removed from the alleged gas chambers was impossible. We can be reasonably sure that the number is much lower than six million and that none were killed in gas chambers. This link doesn't work any more but I saved an excerpt from it. http://nazigassings.com/ (excerpt) --------------------------------- There are NO photographs of corpses of Nazi gassing victims. The cheap, dirty trick which really makes the hoax succeed is the wilful misuse of pictures of countless sick and dead in the camps at the end of the war—none of which are of people killed in gas chambers—but which are repeatedly shown to give the false impression that millions of people must have been murdered in gas chambers. There really is no direct connection--but for the more than gullible masses, the connection is “undeniable.” The people who show those pictures are all in on the trick. They all know perfectly well that the pictures are of people who died of other causes such as typhus—but they use the pictures anyway for their powerful psychological effect to precondition their audience for the gassing and mass extermination pitch which inevitably follows. The pictures are irrelevant except for their enormous shock value. Pictures of countless healthy prisoners in the same camps are generally not shown for reasons that are all too obvious. This delibeerate misuse of photographs is rather widespread and illustrates the collective eagerness of many people (the “hoaxers“ or co-conspirators in the hoax), especially in the American media, to throw whatever they can find against the Nazis, SS and Germans generally just like spiteful children. They want to believe in the hoax. ----------------------------------
I, too, am in the process of reading the link that @Scott was kind enough to provide but all previous accounts I've read about the Einsatzgruppen grossly exaggerate the atrocities committed by the German Einsatzgruppen which was comprised of only about 1,800 men and divided into 4 units. We've watched the Holocaust Industry change its story over and over again as each lie is revealed. Immediately after the war, they trotted out the old human skin lampshades, human fat soap, shrunken head "evidence". For years it was a "fact" that 4 million were killed at Auschwitz. Even though holocaustians were forced to drop that number to an equally impossible 1.1 million, their deliberate willingness to lie about non existent homicidal gas chambers, "6 million Jews killed" and a non existent genocidal German agenda is still as pronounced as ever. As no homicidal gas chambers have been found, no mass graves discovered and no paper trail indicating a genocidal agenda revealed, the holocaustians have switched their focus from the work camps to the Einsatzgruppen and the Eastern Front which is impossible to investigate thoroughly because the Communists have forged documents and photos for propaganda purposes. (1) I'm looking forward to reading the rest of the piece about the Einsatzgruppen but will also bear in mind that the original authors may have inflated the numbers of people killed while the Holocaust Industry and the Soviets who had possession of the documents have a proven history of exaggeration and deliberate lying. (1) “Soviet’s Anti-Nazi Propaganda, Fake Pictures during World War” http://www.hoaxorfact.com/Crime/soviet-s-anti-nazi-propaganda-fake-pictures-during-world-war.html EXCERPT “The Soviets and the rest of the allies were in fact faking hundreds of pictures during and after the World war, as a part of psychological warfare against the German people and propagandize their own people. However, in later years, with the user of computers and the internet, the usage of those hundreds of images were proved to be faked during and after World War Two, which also intended to demonize Hitler and the NSDAP (Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei).”CONTINUED
Re: The homicidal gas chambers story is just another part of Allied propaganda(3) along with homicidal steam chambers, homicidal electrocution chambers(1), a newly invented vaporizer(2) and numerous fanciful contraptions however in the thousands of post war autopsies, not one person was found to have died by gassing. The homicidal gas chambers were simply a fictional part of the Allied propaganda effort(3). Some of the Allies got so tired of hearing about fictitious homicidal gas chambers that they threatened to lock up the many holocaust survivors who lied about their existence(4). If millions died in homicidal gas chambers as per the standard holocaust narrative, the Germans would need to have built hundreds of them however, there is not one work order, blueprint, maintenance record etc that exists or existed. Do you know of even one homicidal gas chamber and if so where is it? (1) "Auschwitz Electrical Conveyor belt of Death" https://disjecta.wordpress.com/2018/01/26/auschwitz-electrical-conveyor-belt-of-death/ EXCERPT "It’s a little known fact that running alongside the scientifically implausible gas chambers at Auschwitz ran the electrified conveyor belts of death. These industrialised slaughter belts, we can assume took the passive cargo directly from the “cattle cars” and electrocuted the hapless victims without struggle then disposed of the evidence in Nazi furnaces. One can only guess at the “special devices” for killing children. Somehow visions of Willy Wonka’s Chocolate/extermination factory spring to mind."CONTINUED (2) "Auschwitz: Myths and Facts" http://www.ihr.org/leaflets/auschwitz.shtml EXCERPT "At the Nuremberg Tribunal, chief US prosecutor Robert Jackson charged that the Germans had used a "newly invented" device to instantaneously "vaporize" 20,000 Jews near Auschwitz "in such a way that there was no trace left of them." [8] No reputable historian now accepts either of these fanciful tales."CONTINUED (3) “Auschwitz: Myths and Facts” http://www.ihr.org/leaflets/auschwitz.shtml EXCERPT “Allied Propaganda The Auschwitz gassing story is based in large part on the hearsay statements of former Jewish inmates who did not personally see any actual signs of extermination. Their beliefs are understandable, because rumors about gassings at Auschwitz were widespread. Allied planes dropped large numbers of leaflets, written in Polish and German, on Auschwitz and the surrounding areas which claimed that people were being gassed in the camp. The Auschwitz gassing story, which was an important part of the Allied wartime propaganda effort, was also broadcast to Europe by Allied radio stations. [15] CONTINUED 15. Nuremberg document NI-11696. NMT "green series," Vol. 8, p. 606. (4) “The Holocaust Myth” http://www.searchforthetruth.co.uk/holocaust EXCERPT “Major Miller of the Allied Military Police HQ in Vienna signed memo/order #31/48 on Oct. 1, 1948 declaring that since the Allied Commissions of Inquiry had established that no one in the 12 German concentration camps was killed by poison gas, that any former inmate maintaining otherwise was to be arrested and charged with perjury.” CONTINUED
Yes, because gassing many people is extremely gruesome. The allies did exploit this until ... they won! After 1945, nobody needs to tell lies or exaggerations about Nazi Germany and its crimes anymore. Just face it, bro. The Hitler gang tried to exterminate Jews and other "racially hostile" minorities. They didn't do it out of malice. They did this to save the Aryan people.
