'How dare you': Greta Thunberg tears into world leaders over inaction at U.N. climate summit

Discussion in 'Environment & Conservation' started by Space_Time, Sep 23, 2019.

  1. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    After Copernicus, you would think scientists would know the difference between delusions and reality. I mean, think about what these pseudo-scientists are saying: Because the human mind is so incredibly creative, it has created technological wonders and marvels that have increased its prosperity, increased its life expectancy, increased its enjoyment of life, made deserts bloom and rivers behave, and doomed us to extinction in 12 yrs if we don't give it all up. Really? That's science? That's the truth? That's a fact? Maybe in a Kurt Vonnegut nightmare, but never in the "Creative Mind's" vision of tomorrow.

    Want to see "Tomorrow"? Here, take a look:

    [​IMG]

    Here's what "Tomorrow" won't be, not ever: (BTW: When did mass hysteria become the coin of intellectual debate?)
    [​IMG]


    I'll bet the whole human race's existence, the very existence of the universe, if necessary--this will never be. How can I be so confident? Because of these words, the greatest tribute to the human mind I have ever read.

    "Throughout the centuries there were men who took first steps down new roads armed with nothing but their own vision. Their goals differed, but they all had this in common: that the step was first, the road new, the vision unborrowed, and the response they received—hatred. The great creators—the thinkers, the artists, the scientists, the inventors—stood alone against the men of their time. Every great new thought was opposed. Every great new invention was denounced. The first motor was considered foolish. The airplane was considered impossible. The power loom was considered vicious. Anesthesia was considered sinful. But the men of unborrowed vision went ahead. They fought, they suffered and they paid. But they won.

    No creator was prompted by a desire to serve his brothers, for his brothers rejected the gift he offered and that gift destroyed the slothful routine of their lives. His truth was his only motive. His own truth, and his own work to achieve it in his own way. A symphony, a book, an engine, a philosophy, an airplane or a building—that was his goal and his life. Not those who heard, read, operated, believed, flew or inhabited the thing he had created. The creation, not its users. The creation, not the benefits others derived from it. The creation which gave form to his truth. He held his truth above all things and against all men.

    His vision, his strength, his courage came from his own spirit. A man’s spirit, however, is his self. That entity which is his consciousness. To think, to feel, to judge, to act are functions of the ego.

    The creators were not selfless. It is the whole secret of their power—that it was self-sufficient, self-motivated, self-generated. A first cause, a fount of energy, a life force, a Prime Mover. The creator served nothing and no one. He lived for himself.

    And only by living for himself was he able to achieve the things which are the glory of mankind. Such is the nature of achievement--Ayn Rand, http://aynrandlexicon.com/lexicon/creators.html

    Some still won't know, and many will disagree, but these words are holy-- because it is true, there are a few who see.

    So, Please:
    Leave the creative mind free to do as it "please"
    And we all will have a life we never dreamed could be.--Starjet
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2019
  2. tkolter

    tkolter Well-Known Member

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    I have a simpler solution the first and key second world nations are not a major issue its the rest of the world breeding and being the problem we just need to cull the global population and maintain it at say two billion people once we cull the population down. So why not create a sterility disease and once cure is created unleash it and 'dicover the cure' once the population goes down to say two billion or so and charge enough so only a people with certain means or governments can provide it. By 2100 we can have a table population and have laws to ban breeding the worlds population over a given cap say 2 billion humans.
     
  3. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If this not a satyrical mocking of doomsayer policies..,?
     
  4. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    Both yours and my 401K are totally irrelevant to the task at hand. (You just proved you don't attempt to debate the posts you reply to. ).

    Unexploited and transferable resources are available now, to build the solar, wind and pumped hydro to complete the task, and there will still be plenty of resources remaining for continuous sustainable development, including joy rides in space if you wish...
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2019
  5. Creasy Tvedt

    Creasy Tvedt Well-Known Member

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    So, money has no intrinsic value, until the subject is specific to your money(or lack thereof), and then it becomes irrelevant. I see.

    Define "available". Are the resources there growing on trees for the plucking, or will they need to be mined, smelted, processed, manufactured, etc...? Because we do realize that building zero-emissions-power-generation equipment isn't a zero-emissions process, do we not?
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2019
    Idahojunebug77 likes this.
  6. Space_Time

    Space_Time Well-Known Member

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    Here's more:

     
  7. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Donor

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    No, I'm thinking all the First World countries of today will look like Mexico or the Middle East.
    (in terms of poverty, violence, crime, corruption, etc)
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2019
  8. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Obviously, your vision of the future is wrong. Mine? The future will prove me right.
    Betcha a Hot Fudge Sunday.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2019
  9. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    https://medium.com/@kevin_640/every...about-mmt-but-were-afraid-to-ask-6ddd974de705

    I thought this growing macroeconomic heterodoxy was widely understood by now.

    You are asking the right questions. The answers - re funding the work - are found in MMT.
    [I'm amazed people think we can't "afford" to save the planet, when all the resources are at hand.....).

    Progressively lower emissions happens as the transition from filthy fossil proceeds (and more energy to power the resource extraction is supplied by renewables); and finally zero emissions, after the infrastructure build is complete.
     
  10. tkolter

    tkolter Well-Known Member

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    Well if its US or THEM (the filthy rabble) then we should strike first and culling off the global population.
     
  11. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    Comfortable Conservatives (or Randians) like Starjet aren't concerned about current or future poverty, they just assume their 'rationalism" will prevail.

    Meantime we have another solution to the world's economic and environmental problems, outlined in the post above.
     
    kazenatsu likes this.
  12. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Capitalism has brought more people out of poverty than any other economic system.
     
  13. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    Quite so: but currently many nations economies are going backwards (see the latest uproar in Ecuador); and as to the past, we have had two world wars partly resulting from the "everyman for himself" outlook of capitalism, not to mention the Great Depression which was itself associated with this paradigm.

    Further, in our time, the "everyman/nation for himself" view means eg, Brazil's solo approach to economic development will eliminate the largest remaining rain forest in the world. And the rise of (capitalist!) China is producing some interesting global geo-political tensions, in the absence of an international rules based system, to say the least...

    [And I won't mention AGW since you don't believe in it.....but capitalism is responsible for the very disruptive "extinction rebellion"...I have shown how we can kill two birds with one stone by eliminating the filthy fossil industry without cost to individual household budgets, regardless of AGW paranoia, if that is what it is].
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2019 at 8:14 PM
  14. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Eliminating fossil fuels is immoral.
     
  15. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    No more "immoral", than capitalism itself.
     
  16. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The system which gets more people out of poverty is immoral ???
     
  17. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    No, the ignorance that says central banks cannot create funds for public purposes, is "immoral", and irrational.
    [Hint: the world's miners could double output almost immediately: as could the world's educational institutions, to enable the expansion of public purpose, in this case, to transit from filthy fossil to clean green).
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2019 at 9:09 PM
  18. Creasy Tvedt

    Creasy Tvedt Well-Known Member

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    The problem there is, the Greta Ocasio Thunberg Chicken Cortez Littles have given us an impossible deadline.

    As I've previously discussed.

     
  19. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It is idiotic to recommend that central banks print money. That is truly immoral.
     
  20. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    How many dams must be built to power the US on pumped hydro ???

    Name one person who has died due to carcinogenic particles from fossil fuel power plants.

    Where are my Exxon checks ???
     
  21. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    Why? When private banks create deposits to fund whatever immoral enterprise a criminal might dream up...
     
  22. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    What bank is creating deposits???
     
  23. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    Suitable sites (on hills etc, near the sea, if local water shortage is a problem) close to sites for solar and wind farms, have already been identified in Australia, to enable complete transition from filthy fossil to clean green. No doubt the same for the US. (in some cases even old mines can be adapted for pumped hydro storage).
    In fact:
    The perception has been there are limited sites for pumped hydro around the world, but we have found hundreds of thousands,” said lead researcher Matthew Stocks, PhD and Research Fellow at the ANU College of Engineering and Computer Science. “Only a small fraction of the 530,000 potential sites we’ve identified would be needed to support a global, 100 per cent renewable electricity system. We identified so many potential sites that much less than the best one per cent will be required,”

    What an ignorant question. Guess why the world's major cities are banning fossil fuel vehicles over the coming decades...

    So....open your mind, you might benefit from cheap, clean energy.
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2019 at 10:44 PM
  24. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    So you have no answers.
     
  25. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    The bank you walk into, ask for a loan, and convince them you are creditworthy.

    Hint: if you can do that, the bank will write you a cheque, or create a deposit, immediately ('ex nihilo').
    The manager does not have to run around the back to see how much 'money' is in the vault, or check that there are sufficient depositors' accounts in the bank.
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2019 at 10:55 PM

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