Is "The Lindsey Graham Defense" the best Trump loyalists can come up with?

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Golem, Nov 7, 2019.

  1. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member

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    Certainly. Right after you admit your "characterization" was dishonest.
     
  2. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    Taylor not first hand, Vindmann first hand but tainted, other first hand witnesses disagree. In any case asking for help on corruption is in America's interest especially when it concerned American election interference or have you now changed your mind about that?

    By the way if Trump kids renting a foreign dignitary a hotel room violates the emoluments clause how in the hell does getting paid 50 k a month to sit on your ass and occasionally be used as a back door channel to the Whitehouse by a foreign company not violate the emoluments clause?
     
  3. Golem

    Golem Banned Donor

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    What first hand witnesses disagree? Is there a single witness who has denied under oath that Trump committed bribery?

    There are none! Not first... not second... not third.... Nobody!

    Trump committed bribery, and there is nothing to redeem him. No witnesses, no evidence, no transcripts, not even "transcripts"... nothing. Everything points to his culpability. Everything! Only thing can do is deny deny deny.... And the same for his loyalists. And this thread has proven that.

    You have one thing to pray for and only one: That Republicans in the Senate are such unpatriotic SOBs that they will save Trump despite overwhelming evidence. That might happen. But now I'm not completely sure.
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2019 at 7:12 PM
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  4. Lesh

    Lesh Well-Known Member

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    "He's too stupid to be a criminal"?

    Lindsey...you're a putz but that was a topper
     
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  5. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    BS.
     
  6. Sandy Shanks

    Sandy Shanks Well-Known Member Donor

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    The Times reports, "John R. Bolton, President Trump’s former national security adviser, knows about “many relevant meetings and conversations” connected to the Ukraine pressure campaign that House impeachment investigators have not yet been informed about, his lawyer told lawmakers on Friday.

    "The lawyer, Charles J. Cooper, made that tantalizing point in a letter to the chief House lawyer in response to House committee chairmen who have sought Mr. Bolton’s testimony in their impeachment proceedings, arguing that his client would be willing to talk but only if a court rules that he should ignore White House objections."

    Bolton did not show up for a deposition scheduled on Thursday because, his lawyer said, he wants a judge to determine whether he should testify in defiance of the White House.

    What is Bolton trying to say here? Bolton strongly opposed Trump's attempt to use extortion in a request for foreign interference in our Presidential election to benefit the President politically, and he referred to Trump's personal lawyer, Giuliani, as a “hand grenade who’s going to blow everybody up,”, describing exactly what is happening now. The whole mess is blowing up in Trump's face.

    Bolton was fired on September 10, about the time the hand grenade was going off in the Oval Office. Schiff was informed of the whistleblower's complaint on September 11.

    Despite not showing up this week, does Bolton want to testify? Testifying would certainly help his book sales.

    Or, despite their differences, does the outspoken conservative want to come to Trump's aid? Is he trying to drag this out with court fight?

    One thing is true. If it is the latter, the Democrats are not biting although they would to have Bolton testify. They have had their fill of Trump's delaying tactics. They will welcome Bolton if he comes in voluntarily, but they are through with the subpoena business. In the meantime they will trot out their own witnesses.

    They will be unimpeded by Trump. Stupidly, Trump will not allow his witnesses to appear in the impeachment inquiry which will go public next week.

    The Democrats are delighted with Trump's incriminating recalcitrance.
     
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  7. opion8d

    opion8d Well-Known Member Donor

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    At some point, usually later in life, a reflective person will begin to think about their legacy. If they are a very important person, they will think about their place in history. If not that important, then they will consider their grandchildren. Those without family may turn to reflecting upon their relationship with God. Unreflective persons won't spend much time on this, if at all.

    We are in a time where American's are faced with a stark choice involving the impeachment of a president. President Trump will have his legacy recorded in the history books. There are other notable individuals surrounding the impeachment process. What might their legacy be? The central question is; is one's fealty to the Constitution of the United States and our place in the world, or to a man? Is one prepared to listen to testimony, read the news, think, and seek the truth or does the loyalty to one man negate that option?

    I wonder if those that blindly follow Trump ever think about their place in history, their position with their grandchildren, or their relationship to God? It appears they do not. History can be either kind or unkind in the end. How will history view those persons who have pledged their sacred honor and fealty to one man? Like it or not, history will have its say. One's grandchildren will have their say and God will judge.
     
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  8. Lesh

    Lesh Well-Known Member

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    If Bolton has something to say he needs to voluntarily come forward and do so.

    Full stop.
     
  9. Lee Atwater

    Lee Atwater Well-Known Member Donor

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    Giuliani associates pressed past president of Ukraine to announce Biden investigation in exchange for state visit
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...3b69a4-0273-11ea-8bab-0fc209e065a8_story.html

    Two associates of Rudolph W. Giuliani pressed the then-president of Ukraine in February to announce investigations into former vice president Joe Biden’s son and purported Ukrainian interference in the 2016 election in exchange for a state visit, and a lawyer for one of the associates said Friday that they were doing so because Giuliani — acting on President Trump’s behalf — asked them to.

    The Giuliani associates, Lev Parnas and Igor Fruman, met with then-Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko in Kyiv, said Edward B. MacMahon Jr., a lawyer for Parnas. He said they were working on behalf of Giuliani, Trump’s personal lawyer, who was operating on orders from Trump.
     
  10. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member

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    Like most intelligent people, I generally do not discuss politics with relatives. There is virtually nothing to be gained by discussing politics with relatives. . They either already agree with you or you will end up with a new set of enemies. Politics come and go, but relatives are forever.
     
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  11. ImNotOliver

    ImNotOliver Well-Known Member

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    It may be that Bolton just wants the cover of a judge's order, so as not to be seen as a rat.
     
  12. opion8d

    opion8d Well-Known Member Donor

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    So are legacies. This was not about talking politics, it was about character.
     
  13. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member

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    My character is not in question.
     
  14. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member

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  15. opion8d

    opion8d Well-Known Member Donor

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    It was not meant to be and I apologize if I caused you to infer otherwise.
     
  16. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member

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    Thank you. A few comments might be worthwhile. I am the last of my generation. We are a close family. As many of us as possible try to get together once a year. I generally know the politics of about everyone and some are very partisan, but by mutual agreement we do not discuss politics. It is simply not worth the heartache. I have seen too many families divided over stupid things. As I said before, politics comes and goes, but families are forever. .
     
  17. Sandy Shanks

    Sandy Shanks Well-Known Member Donor

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    Trump provided another distraction recently that Graham will like. He is getting desperate.

    Trump's latest distraction to his July 25th phone call to Zelensky that contains impeachable offenses? He is trying to get people interested in another phone call.

    “I have the second call, which nobody knew about," Trump said, speaking to reporters as he left the White House on Friday morning. "I guess they want that to be produced also. ... I understand they'd like it, and I have no problem giving it to them."

    He is desperately trying to get people's attention, but nobody is listening to him. No one is interested in the earlier call, and House investigators clearly are not interested.

    "I guess they want that to be produced also. ... I understand they'd like it." No one has any idea what he is talking about.

    Trump also said he was interesting in visiting Russia next year during the height of the election campaign. :banana::roflol:
     
  18. PPark66

    PPark66 Active Member

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    Except for Trump made the ask in the phone call and turned over a memo to prove he did. And they admitted on tape they held up the funding.

    The ‘this for that’ is on stark display and they wandered into extortion and bribery land.

    A confession and the evidence that supports the confession. There is nowhere to go.

    is it possible they didn’t know what they were doing was wrong? No. Their behavior before, during, and after is evidence of a consciousness of guilt. It’s not just about the call.

    This is pound the desk time—the law nor the facts—are on their side. The best they can do is muddy-up the water and put on a show to distract from the law and facts.

    That is precisely what is occurring now, how gullible are they? Is the question they’re searching to answer.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2019 at 3:18 AM
  19. Daggdag

    Daggdag Well-Known Member

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    Well the Trumpist defense isactually "Anything that doesn't support our god-king must be based on lies, so all the evidence is forged"
     
  20. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    Except there is no mention of a quid pro quo in the phone call and certainly not in relationship to the Biden Family money laundering circus.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2019 at 8:01 AM

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