NATO FILM: Forest Brothers – Fight for the Baltics

You are clearly a pro-Nazi guy, advertising here the books of fascists.

 

Should - or can?

Russia is not more responsible for Soviet Union as a thing than Ukraine or Belarus. And as these people today have nothing with SU but history of past - so do we. Why of all we are supposed to be responsible TODAY for what been done to us in the past?

And on top of that - what bloody "100 million" shιt is that?

 

I am a human, not a machine, my temper is not made of steel. Shortly - what you keep narrating there is an insult too.

 

Ok, listen. Basically - I can give you explanations. You can learn things.

I get tired of arguing with people who judge without knowledge. You are not in 70th, this is 2017. You can learn about my country. You can learn about my people. You can start understanding us.

Or you can do none of that and continue living with false perception. We can endure yet another generation of blind prejudice, and another and another. It is annoying. Harmful. Tiring. But we will survive. But it'll be less than what we can achieve with understanding.

You want to try understanding what Russia is, or not?

 

You asked me for them. That must make you a pro-Nazi fascist as well.

I don't like Socialism, Nazism or Communism.

 

I did not ask you to bring the books of Nazis to the attention here. Those books written by criminals do not deserve any credit.
This is very interesting, you show here the image of the guy who smashes socialistic symbols, but not the image where the Nazi symbols are smashed. Why?

 

Murdering people who were trying to leave was "their job". Wow! You Russians are something else. I doubt anyone else anywhere would try to defend this behavior! Truly amazing!

Sat what you will about the Germans but at least they had some shame, some guilt, some remorse.

 

Of course, he does not want. Russians are so cruel, killed 100 million people (why not 200 million or better billion?). They have to be blamed for everything.

 

Who said I defend it? I explain it. These soldiers didn't chose this service. They got such order, and had to carry it out - does not means they all accepted it. How many people crossed the border with aid of these people? Looking away when needed, delaying a patrol, or even helping people directly.


What I point at - is that you had false judgement. You made opinion on that judgement. What false - must be corrected. Mistakes are must be fixed.

 

In your imagination, there may be a Nazi behind every tree or under every rock---but there are many a few hundred current Nazi Party members active worldwide. Real Nazis are too rare to bother with. Unfortunately, there are millions and millions of Commies like yourself making the World a worse place.

 

Very funny. How do I say it.. "In your imagination, there may be a Communist behind every tree or under every rock..."

There is very little of actual communists on the planet. Majority of them are probably right now in North Corea. Even China is pretty much a not communistic country at present time.

 

Well, just looking at this thread as a representation, there must be millions of Communists in the World, and not just in China, Vietnam, North Korea, Laos and Cuba.

I go by the standard English dictionary by what a Communist is, not what you or their apologists "think they are" by some narrow criterion.

 

It is not in imagination- Nazis are here- exactly in this thread, recommending Nazi books to read, defending criminals that killed Jews and civilians in Baltic states.

 

Not everyone who criticizes US politics is a communist. Nothing is perfect, everything has flaws.

 

Well, not every member of NDSAP was a zealous supporter of nazism. These are - from the look at the covers - are memoires of soldiers. How much they are, or are not pro-nazy depends on authors, each of whom is a human. Which means they can be sincere, or full of shιt or anything in between. Anything. You would never know unless you look in.

 

Accoding to the one who recommended it for reading it is written there that Nazi were kind during the first year of the war in Soviet Union,and only in 1942 became monsters because of partisans.
I am sorry, but this is a BS and lie. There are facts, photos, official documents that say the opposite things.
Do you know Babi Yar? Do you know when it happened?

 

Well, technically it is somewhat correct. The punishment measures were harsh. The people been taken to work in Germany. Sometimes by force.

But think logically: german army was moving forward. They not encountered resistance, capable of repelling them yet. They NEEDED the support of population, they needed resources, order - and most importantly - work force. So logically - they were trying to avoid massive resistance. Taking people quietly, executing them away from people sight.

Babiy Yar is one of actually good examples of that: a remote place, quiet and somewhat hidden. People, who been executed there in thousands, were not just locals. It was a place, chosen among many - and designated to be place for execution. Disposal of corpses. A monstrous mass grave.

Monstrous mass grave, that majority of population, occupied by germans, was not supposed to see and know about. It was kept secret for as long as possible - so it will not inspire a massive rebellion.

We both know that people are people, to fight they need hope and reasons. Germans expected there will be no hope, and tried to give for a time as less reasons as possible. Does not means there were no plans of genocides. Does not means holocaust didn't happened. It means that in 1941 on occupied territories germans been mild and even decent with people. Until they started loosing this war and treating occupied people decently became unnecessary.

 

I do not quite understand what you mean by "technically it is somewhat correct." The fact that Nazis tried to hide the mass murdering does not mean that they were mild.
There are many examples of how Germans treated local people in 1941 in occupied Kiev, Minsk. It was far far from mild one. Moreover, the turning point in the war happened not in 1942, but in 1943, so.... no, I can in no way agree with your reasoning.

 

In winter 1941 their actual advance was stopped. They suffered a first major strategic loss. They faced possibility of defeat.

As for Kiev and Minsk - well, share these examples. We can take closer look at them.

 

Possibility of defeat is not defeat. Remind you that Sevastopol, Caucasus, Cuban were taken by German army in 1942.
I have already shared. Babi Yar is in fact in Kiev and citizens of Kiev were killed there.
As for Minsk- here are the photos.

All are done in septemeber-october 1941 in Minsk. If you want more evidence- go to the any History museum and you will find many evidences.

 

Babiy Yar was not yet in Kiev at that time, it was on outstricts.

A map from http://toursdekiev.com.ua/ru/map - shows Babiy Yar being in northern part of city, barely occupied, with graveyards nearby.

The executions in Minsk do not look massive. They do not mean that germans were not treating people decenty.



So you understand me clearly: I do not advertise fascism or nazism. I do not claim german government had no sickening criminal intent towards people they invaded. I claim that germans at time indeed were capable of treating people decently - for sake of two means. First - being the strategic necessity - to restrict violence towards occupied population to avoid a mass rebellion. And second - for fact that it is not in human nature to destroy each other with no reason. We are social creatures, we naturally get along. I can pretty much believe, that germans - even those who believed in nazist ideology - were able to get along with people who they invaded, whom cities they been stationed in. That - is until they given orders that they could only refuse by price of their own safety, life and safety of their beloved ones.

They were humans. Their government was constiting of humans too. Humans, who issued orders to murder, torture, "clear" the pepople in hundreds of thousands, in millions. But that was an order - without it there was no desire to do such things among majority of them. They were soldiers, conquerors, occupants - but still humans. Just like you or me.


Main point is - we can't alienate ourselves from any of these people. We mustn't judge them as nazy, communists, capitalists, as terrorists, rebels, soldiers or anything else - but as humans. As humans like any of us is.



So yes, frightening part might be that germans treated people decently, when they had no order to do otherwise. That rapists, looters and murderers were punished for comitting crimes and violating discipline, even against the "lesser races" in nazist philosophy. And then - at same time these people been participating in ethnic cleaning, abduction of hundreds, executions of thousands - destruction of millions. Because they been ORDERED to - and they followed orders of people who claim to govern - guide - direct - own them.

In the end - individuals pulled triggers in their hands. Individuals held scalpels that disected children. Individuals shoved corpses in furnaces. Individuals raped. Stolen. Tortured. Destroyed other individuals. Ended, one by one, tens of millions of unique lives. Irreplaceable.


That's the problem, if I might say. We got too fond of idea that these people were different, and that we are not same as them, that we are guaranteed to act differently. We are not. We are the same kind of monstrocity - if we choose to be.

Some have not pulled triggers. Some refused orders. Some put value of life above the politics and philosophies. So can we. Some did right choises. Some did stopped the bloodshed, some stopped the terror and mutual destruction - so can we. We can stop blaming.


Wrongs are wrongs. They have been done. They can not be undone, but they can be corrected. All in that war wanted one thing - for it to end, for not to be making the chose between living or murdering. We can make sure that choise will not be faced by people anymore, we can save people from doing what have been done in the past. We can make a future worthy of not dying for - for letting live for.

We are not just humans, we are humanity. We are all connected, we live on same planet, we share same sky and same air, we are all in this life together. We have incredible things to do - ahead of us.

 

Where is your remorse over what we did to Yugoslavia; to Iraq; to Syria; to Libya? What do you think about the pilots and soldiers who did it... or do you see the victims as untermensch and not worthy of life? What about all the civilians being killed in Mosul and Raqqa by the American coalition... which by the way Amnesty International considers war crimes. And yet Washington and the MSM accused Russia of bombing non existent hospitals.





Why do you look at the speck in your brother's eye, and not notice the beam in your own?

 

In Greece the gold and food was sent to Germany and one out of every ten people starved. Other than Russia, Greece suffered the most during the war. Germany has never made war reparations. When it was split up they said they couldn't do so until Germany reunited, and then when it reunited, they gave the excuse that it was too late.

 

More recently they have made 90 billion from the money they loaned Greece, while making the German people believe they were being charitable.

 

She is now gone, but the rats nest is still full. She handled this for Obama.

Watch essentially your video but more to say.