Why have Jews suffered persecution for the last 2000 years?

Not entirely true, in the Old Testament the Jews slaughtering the Amalekites and many many other peoples, now today a lot of fundamentalist right wing Jews keep saying that the Palestinians are decedents from Amalek, and God has commanded EVERY single one of them to die, even the children and babies. So, its not really a surprise Israel wants to slaughter them all and would have already if Europe wasnt already so pissed off at them, well left wingers around the world are extremely pissed at Israel for good reason.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amalek#Palestinians_as_Amalekites

"Frequently Jewish fundamentalists refer to the Palestinians as the 'Amalekites' … of today… According to the Old Testament, the Amalek … were regarded as the Israelites' inveterate foe, whose 'annihilation' became a sacred duty and against whom war should be waged until their 'memory be blotted out' forever (Ex 17:16; Deut 25:17-19)…. Some of the [modern] political messianics insist on giving the biblical commandment to 'blot out the memory of the Amalek' an actual contemporary relevance in the conflict between the Israelis and Palestinians.[22]
The Palestinians have been associated with Amalek since 1974 when Rabbi Moshe Ben-Tzion Ishbezari of Ramat Gan made the association in a book.[23] The equation began to circulate in Gush Emunim circles, and its full implications were spelled out by Rabbi Yisrael Hess in 1980.[24] A former campus rabbi of Bar-Ilan University, Hess published in the university's student paper in February 1980 an article on "The Genocide Commandment in the Torah",[25] in which he concluded that:
'The day is not far when we shall be called to this holy war, to this commandment of the annihilation of Amalek.'
Hess's reference to Amalekites was later taken in Israel to be an allusion to the Palestinian Arabs, especially since he spoke of a jihad.
'Against this holy war God declares a counter jihad . .in order to emphasise that this is the background for the annihilation and that it is over this that the war is being waged and that it is not a conflict between two peoples. . God is not content that we annihilate Amalek -'blot out the memory of Amalek' - he also enlists personally in this war . .because, as has been said, he has a personal interest in this matter, this is the principal aim.'[26]
In 1982 Danny Rubinstein, in his book On the Lord's Side argued that this notion permeates the Gush Emunim movement's bulletins, citing one such article on 'The Right to Hate' which affiremed:-
'In every generation there is an Amalek. The Amalekism of our generation finds expression in the deep Arab hatred towards our national revival in our forefathers' land.'
In 1985 Uriel Tal, in his Foundations of a Political Messianic Trend in Israel,[27] argued that Hess's position is to be contextualised within a totalitarian messianic force, whose process he summed up as follows.
Palestinians in the Occupied Territories were to be reduced to the halakhic status of resident alien.
The promotion of Arab 'transfer'
The implementation of the commandment of Amalek, involving the 'annihilation' of Palestinian Arabs.[28]
Ron Geaves[29] also writes that 'in settler circles, the Palestinians are likely to be identified with the Amalekites', and citing the same pamphlet from the campus rabbi attached to Bar-Ilan University, adds that the message is passed on through 'the religious schools where boys are taught that the Arab is Amalek.' After Baruch Goldstein's massacre of Palestinians at the Mosque in Hebron, Rabbi Arthur Waskow argued that Goldstein had decided to 'blot out the memory of Amalek' by machine-gunning the Palestinian worshippers, and commented:
So then, in our generation, for some Jews the Palestinians become Amalek. Some Palestinians are terrorists? Some Palestinians call publicly for the State of Israel to be shattered? The archetypes of fear slide into place: all Palestinians are Amalek. And the fantasies of the powerless become the actions of the powerful. For in our generation, Jews have power.’[30]
After the death of Yassir Arafat, a declaration was issued by 200 rabbis of Pikuach Nefesh asserting that the anniversary of the death of 'this Amalek of our generation' should be celebrated as 'a day of rejoicing'.[31]"


The Jews are just as big of terrorists as the Muslims, and so are the Christians defending the Jews. Ive even seen a Christian video on youtube where they were saying we need to destroy Amalek because God commanded it....

"Religious beliefs seem to be damagin
I feel like runnin up to Jesus
and stabbin em with a Javelin!" - ASpirit

 

While religious persecution can be cited it really much more fundamental than that. Nations have been traditionally based upon invidious criteria such as race, religion, ethnic heritage, gender, social status, etc. that divided the people into the "preferred group in power" and "all others that are considered to be inferior" to the preferred group. In all cases the non-preferred group is disparaged by stereotyping and they are oppressed.

The oppression of the Jews historically is fundamentally no different than the oppression of African-Americans, Hispanics, and women in the United States today as the US was established based upon the de facto superiority of Wealthy WASP Males over all other people in the United States. While our Constitution was to protect the Rights of All it has historically been incapable of doing that and or nation even embraced oppression historically (e.g. slavery and segregation).

Religion was actually created to provide support for government entities, usually a monarch that was considered to be appointed by god under the Divine Right of Kings (that was promoted by the monarchs), providing an "superior authority" for oppression by government. Basically religion was a tool created by tyrants to control the people.

The Jews, because they were not the "preferred group" in charge, were considered to be an inferior minority and like all inferior minorities they've been oppressed historically. We can also note that since Israel was created where the Jews became the "preferred group" they've done exactly what every other "preferred group" has done historically and oppressed the "non-Jews" whenever they could. Of course the Muslims in the Islamic countries are no different than the Jews because they oppress the non-Muslims that can be Jews or Christians living in those countries.

It just goes on and on so long as nations create a "preferred group" that is dominate over others in society.

 

Aaaaaaaaaaah, so now we get to the heart of the issue. The Jews are taking from the poor and less fortunate. You got us. I surrender. You're a genius. And I'm not rich rich. Comfortable, but certainly not rich. I had plenty of school loans. I wasn't given ANYTHING, besides a solid upbringing. And I know plenty of Jews who are rich, some through mommy and daddy and others by sheer will. And being rich and STAYING rich are very different things. Look at how many sports stars making millions/year become bankrupt in their 30s. And you can give the dumbest person the best education there is and they still will fail. And you can take the smartest people and strip all their money away and sooner or later they'll be successful again. Happens all the time. Smart guys make a few mistakes, trusting the wrong people and go broke, then years later they're right back up again. Why is that?

You really don't think there is an inherent drive/ability that makes some people simply better at life than others? Are you really that naive and ignorant? Do you honestly think everyone is the same given the same opportunities? Thats NOT life and anyone who's lived it would understand that.

 

Oh come on....this is far too easy to answer.

Religion!

As is the primary reason for most persecution, violence, hatred, and brutality worldwide.

Thanks a lot "God"

 

I think major reason is related to the nature of Judaism.

Unlike Christianity and Islam, Judaism was traditionally a tribal based religion in that you were "chosen" if you were a member of the tribe, but not otherwise. If you weren't a member of the tribe, you really couldn't be one of God's "chosen" people no matter what you believed. And to even try to join the tribe you had to go thru some pretty stout requirements. Liking having your dick cut. And hoping the Jews didn't slaughter you while you were recovering because you weren't one of the "chosen." Contrast Christianity and Islam, where if you profess the right belief system (sometimes whether you want to or not), *poof* you're in. Unlike Christianity and Islam, Judaism didn't have a strong evangelic component, since whether you were "chosen" was a function of being a member of the tribe. When Christianity and Islam conquered a nation, they sought to spread, or impose, their religion. Not so Judaism, where they either slaughtered who they conquered, or maintained a segregation of their religion, and by extension, culture.

This meant that Judeaism never achieved a (comparatively) wide following, and ensured that their members would always be somewhat isolated from whatever culture they could have been assimilating with. This isolationism meant they were never really assimilated into other cultures, guaranteeing they would remain outcasts and minorities.

 

Quote Originally Posted by ManifestDestiny View Post
"Do you guys think you would be so advanced without America protecting you guys? Dont play dumb, you know Israel only exists because of America. Even if Israel didnt exist, how did you guys get your money? Just like any other Capitalist, taking advantage of the poor and unfortunate. You can claim its because of education and family, but the fact is you guys wouldnt have such good educations if you didnt pay for it with the ill-gotten gains of the poor. Im not saying this is a problem secluded the Jews, im saying its a problem of Capitalism.

You think the Koch brothers are better than you just because they are more successful? You need to grow up, and so does everyone else on the right wing, being rich doesnt make you a better person in fact many would argue it does the exact opposite."

Liberal hatred always oozes out. Hatred of Jews, hatred of capitalism, hatred of successful people.

Liberals do love to blame the victims whether it's students trapped in non-performing union schools, a 12-year old rape victim, or taxpayers supporting deadbeats who refuse to work.

 

You have several profound misunderstandings of Judaism here. Firstly, being "chosen" does not mean you're better than anyone. G-d chose the Israelites to be a priestly caste - ie, the upholders of righteousness. But the Israelites, being merely humans with all human flaws continually shunned G-d and turned their back on him.

Further, Judaism holds that all mankind are children of Noah and worthy of G-d's love. You don't have to be Jewish to go to heaven(unlike Christianity and Islam where only Christians and Muslims can go to heaven.)

Additionally, Judaism does not hold any ideas of racial superiority. Anyone can convert to Judaism and become a Jew. In fact converts are held in high esteem because they have chosen Judaism as opposed to being born into it.

 

Yes I do believe for the most part everyone is the same given the same opportunities and environment. Free Will does not exist, we are products of our environment and absolutely every single piece of psychology and biology points to that fact and in the opposite direction of free will. We all know black people commit the most crimes, but what about wealthy black people? They commit essentially the same amount of crime as rich whites, why is that? Obviously because its a matter or poverty, not race. If you really believe you can take everything away from rich people and they will still become successful because they are just SOOO awesome and smarter than everyone else, than whats wrong with taxing the rich? They should just see it as a challenge to work harder, and if they are so awesome and intelligent they can still get rich paying extra taxes no problem.

Yes some people have certain genes that will drive them further with ambition, but you can receive ambition from your environment if you are in the right one. Your parents can help you be ambitious even if you didnt normally have the ambitious set of genetics, its nature vs nurture, your nurturing parents can help you fight against relatively undesirable natural genetics by working through your environment.

Do you think Bill Gates was just uber smart and awesome and thats exactly how he created Microsoft, or do you think it had a lot to do with the fact he was literally one of the few people on the planet who even owned a computer at that time? Clearly his environment played a absolutely huge role in his success, there is no denying this. The same goes for Jews, the same goes for anybody of any ethnicity. Rich people are exactly the same as everyone else, get off your high horse.

 

Demonizing your enemy is old hat... They did it in the OT just the way Hitler did in Germany. Fortunately we know a lot more about the Canaanites and their religions now than previously.

 

Was this supposed to be addressed to my post?

 

Could you please quote where I said it meant you're better than anyone? You have several profound misunderstandings of my post.

Does it hold that all mankind are God's chosen people?

Could you please quote where I said it meant you're racially superior? You have several profound misunderstandings of my post.

I addressed conversion in my post.

 

Hahaha.. only Christians and Muslims can go to heaven??? you don't know anything about Islam at all... and very little about Christians.

 

Are you trolling? Christians believe that the only way to heaven is through faith in Jesus. And the same is true of Muslims. I challenge you to prove otherwise.

 

Yawn. I told you what chosen means. Chosen to be a priestly caste - no suggestion of superiority. You're attempting to paint the word "chosen" in some insidious light.

 

Of course environment effects behavior, but for plenty the best environment doesn't help them at all, because they squander it. For others who grow up in terrible environments, they somehow escape. That's just genes. And you can NEVER control everyone's environment. Its impossible. So even insinuating, which you are, that if we were all equal, we'd be equal. People are NOT the same. Some are naturally better at certain things than others. Its DNA. Lebron James in naturally better at Basketball then nearly everyone else. It wouldn't have made a difference where he grew up. If it wasn't basketball, it would've been something else.

Since you obviously accept natural genetics, wouldn't it make sense that those with good genes, marrying others with good genes consistently, generation after generation, creates people who are genetically more successful at certain things than others? You're implying that Jews are who they are simply because they have money? Its NOT that simple. How did they get all that money...By ACCIDENT? We were nearly wiped out in WWII. Most who came to the US came with nothing along with plenty of others from different cultures. Explain how some became more successful? By accident?

Stop making excuses for those who don't take advantage of their abilities or are envious of those who aren't as driven. Could it be that those who makes excuses and want to blame their failures on others, are the ones who don't rise to the top? Its no accident. Free will doesn't exist? Give me a break. You are free to do well or not. You either CHOOSE to do well or you choose to fail. Everyone single decision you make impacts that. We all can't be millionaires obviously, but we all have the FREEDOM to try, at least in the U.S. If you think you can't be successful just because you grew up poor, tell that to all of those who proved you wrong.

 

In Judaism, "chosenness" is the belief that the Jews are the chosen people, chosen to be in a covenant with God. This idea is first found in the Torah (the first five books of the Tanakh, which are also included in the Christian Bible) and is elaborated on in later books of the Hebrew Bible. Much is written about these topics in rabbinic literature. The three largest Jewish denominations—Orthodox Judaism, Conservative Judaism and Reform Judaism—maintain the belief that the Jews have been chosen by God for a purpose.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews_as_the_chosen_people

It's not just the "priestly caste" as you suggest.

I'm not sure where you are getting that. Christians and Muslims believe the same except theirs is based on a belief system and not membership in a tribe. I suggested nothing insidious about it, but explained my opinion as an answer to the OP.

 

"And you shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and a holy nation" - Exodus 19:6

 

“Thus you shall say to the house of Jacob, and tell the people of Israel: 4You yourselves have seen what I did to the Egyptians, and how I bore you on eagles’ wings and brought you to myself. Now therefore, if you will indeed obey my voice and keep my covenant, you shall be my treasured possession among all peoples, for all the earth is mine; 6and you shall be to me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation. These are the words that you shall speak to the people of Israel.” - Exodus 19:6

And in Deuteronomy 7, after God tells the Jews to take possession of the promised land, and tells them to defeat and destroy the peoples living there and show them no mercy and not intermarry: "You shall not intermarry with them, giving your daughters to their sons or taking their daughters for your sons, 4 for they would turn away your sons from following me, to serve other gods. Then the anger of the Lord would be kindled against you, and he would destroy you quickly."

Then it says:

For you are a people holy to the Lord your God. The Lord your God has chosen you to be a people for his treasured possession, out of all the peoples who are on the face of the earth. 7 It was not because you were more in number than any other people that the Lord set his love on you and chose you, for you were the fewest of all peoples, 8 but it is because the Lord loves you and is keeping the oath that he swore to your fathers ...

 

None of that refutes anything I've said.

 

It shows that according to the OT, the Jews were the chosen people, not just the "priestly caste."

None of what you said refutes anything I've said.

 

Can someone give me evidence of the Jewish diaspora by giving historical records proving a mass immigration of Semitic Jews into Europe around 0-800 AD ? also, why are the first record of Jews in Europe and North Africa not until around 800 AD ?

 

What are you talking about dude? Jews were in Europe at least two centuries before Christ. Are you just making stuff up for the hell of it?

http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_the_Roman_Empire

 

The Roman Empire extended into the Middle East. That doesn't answer my question. I'm asking of solid evidence of Semitic Jews wandering into Europe after expulsion. Even Wikipedia says "Jewish records in Europe are sketchy at best prior to 400 CE"

 

FROM WIKIPEDIA

Jewish settlers founded the Ashkenazi Jewish community in the Early (5th to 10th centuries CE) and High Middle Ages (c.1000-1299 CE). The community prospered under Charlemagne, but suffered during the Crusades. Accusations of well poisoning during the Black Death (1346–53) led to mass slaughter of German Jews,[2] and their fleeing in large numbers to Poland.

again, no direct evidence of Jews wandering into Europe until 5th century

 

I suggest you read the article. Jews came to the city of Rome - in Italy - in Europe two centuries before Christ. In fact there was a huge Jewish population in Rome. After the destruction of the Second Temple and the Bar Kokhba revolt hundreds of thousands of Jewish slaves were brought to Italy. Most were later settled in Sicily and Calabria. These were the ancestors of the Ashkenazim.

- - - Updated - - -

I can only assume you're trolling. Surely you know that Italy is in Europe right?

Jews have lived in Rome for over 2,000 years, longer than in any other European city. They originally went there from Alexandria, drawn by the lively commercial intercourse between those two cities. They may even have established a community there as early as the second pre-Christian century, for in the year 139 B.C. the pretor Hispanus issued a decree expelling all Jews who were not Italian citizens. During the last decades of the second century B.C., after the war between the Hasmonean brothers [Hyrcanus II and Aristobulus II] on one side and Cæsar and Pompey on the other, the Jewish community in Rome grew very rapidly. The Jews who were taken to Rome as prisoners were either ransomed by their coreligionists or set free by their Roman masters, who found their peculiar custom obnoxious. They settled as traders on the right bank of the Tiber, and thus originated the Jewish quarter in Rome."