Why the need to prove God does or does not exist.

What do you mean they invented the idea of human rights? Are you saying that they were the first ones to say that rights were inalienable, came from God, or that nobody else before them ever thought that men should have certain rights in a society?

 

Yes, that

Human Rights were designed to protect individuals from State Tyranny. Free Speech was also pushed in the early United States to protect religious disciples from being censored by Church OR State. The Puritans were being persecuted by the FALSE, CORRUPT Church of England at the time. They were Heretics.

Human Rights are granted and protected by GOD, making them UNIVERSAL TO ALL MEN IN THE WORLD. That's how everybody knows of Human Rights. But, who protects Rights? Do men? Do governments and states????? NO!!!! Liberals are the worst threat against Human Rights out of everybody! Liberals are the ones who want to repeal the U.S. Constitution, our laws, our greatness! Liberals are very traitorous.

Liberals don't protect human rights. Why are liberals so pro-abortion? Because they don't see babies as humans, even though they are. All humans, especially the unborn and most innocent, should be MOST protected.

 

What do you mean protected by God? Where is God protecting these universal moral rights? I look around the world and I see what you are calling "God-given and protected rights" violated or simply taken away. Obviously they aren't inalienable since they can be alienated and I don't see any divine protection against tyrranical foes. And I think you are absolutely wrong saying that governments can't protect rights. Give me one example of God protecting these rights himself. Because the only system that is keeping us from breaking up into total anarchy and having our rights stripped away by our fellow man are the laws put into place by our Congress.

For example: I would assume that you think slavery is against the principles of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, correct? Who abolished slavery in the United States, was it Congress, or man through a very bloody war, Congressional bills, and then enforcement of the new laws through police action?

That's a very simplistic and naive view of people you are claiming to despise. I know that there are many people who don't see babies as humans because they lack your religious views that there is a soul and that a soul is implanted within a cluster of cells upon conception. I certainly disavow that view, but it also goes a bit more into depth as well. Should the state have the power to dictate that a woman carry a baby to term even though she has to sacrifice so much to do so? ALL of the burden of carrying a baby to term is placed on the woman and without the mother a baby simply could not survive (depending on how old the fetus/baby is). Next comes the additional plight of what we do when a woman becomes pregnant through rape or the pregnancy threatens the life of the mother. Obviously there is some leeway given even by the most conservative members of our political scale.

 

Sure, Rights are violated everyday across the world, but why? SIN! Men crave power, and hurt and maim other men. Men rape women. There is crime, poverty, and massive death.

But you can never kill an IDEA. And that idea, Human Rights, is a divine protection. Even if you are young, defenseless, orphan without parents to care for you..... YOU STILL HAVE THAT RIGHT TO LIFE! Who could have granted this to ALL MEN, EQUALLY, except GOD? Who except GOD can give all men FREE WILL, FREEDOM to live life as you see fit, morally, ethically, and responsible for oneself?

You can never kill the idea.....that is immune and immortal.

 

I'm asking you how God is protecting these rights. I believe that the concept of rights is useless unless those rights are protected. What does it mean to say that you have a right to happiness or liberty if, once again, you are put into a cage for the rest of your life? Which leads me to asking this: what exactly do you mean that God "gave us" rights? Are you saying that he gave us the ability to recognize things that should not be inalienable?

 

So what about the rights of the citizens of ancient Greece? You know, the ancient society that the american revolutionaries admired because they recognized the rights of citizens?

 

God's existence does matter:

• Many religions maintain that God has prepared an afterlife and we have reason to reject hopelessness. Obviously what happens to us after death is of great import.
  
• If man is not created in God's image, if man is merely a sack of chemicals, why does he deserve rights? Why does he possess value? (Incidentally I think evolution can be considered part of God's plan of creation.)
  
• If there was no God, no Designer, the universe would just be a random mess, an ugly chaos. Instead of the Music of the Spheres we would only hear noise.

So really the only alternative to theism is despair.

Fortunately science provides us with evidence for God's existence: What is the “fine-tuning” of the universe, and how does it serve as a “pointer to God”?

 

No! We all recognize the rights of others because that is what insures others will recognize our rights. It isn't a question of whether or not we deserve rights. It is to everyones self interest that we recognize the rights of others and its intuitive. Thats what makes a society we all want to live in. Mutual cooperation is what makes a successful society.

 

why is this such a hot topic, i can't even keep up with it.

 

Our selfish interests could just as well be served by lying, bullying, and other elements of politics. Those focused on self-gratification do not build a solid foundation for human dignity.

 

Your confusing "selfishness" with "self interest". There not the same and you should take the time to understand the difference.

 

Your confusing "selfishness" with "self interest". There not the same and you should take the time to understand the difference.

 

You are acting like these are somehow issues that only arise when secularism exists. Theists cannot lie or bully? I would beg to differ. Look, even theists recognize that the social contract theory simply makes sense and it also makes sense that cooperation is a much better solution than war. There is a reason why most animals live in groups and don't simply hoard food for themselves while hiding in a cave.

 

again, I don't understant how I'm getting the double posts. Any thoughts?

 

deleted.

 

Click on Post Reply only once. (And I am not helping you to gain myself any benefit.)

 

Do you really think animals are always altruistic? If cooperation is always beneficial how do you account for:

rights violator


I'm saying self interest alone can cause both animals and people to misbehave. Deception and brutality have been used on numberless occasions successfully to advance self interest.

 

Of course self interest alone can account for rights violations. There are also collective ways to strip away rights as well (theocracies aren't known for their liberation of human rights). I, however, see no reason why we can't simply say that we determine what rights will be followed when we set up our social contracts (governments). What exactly is God doing in regards to our rights? He gave us life therefore we he gave us rights?

 

Truer words have rarely been spoken.

 

capriciously malevolent bully Now that's not fair.

 

Did you seriously post a picture of a pack hunting animal to somehow make an argument that cooperation is not always beneficial?

 

Intolerance from atheocratic fanatics:

Chinese Police Proudly Record Their Torture of Christians

New Reports Tell of Executions, Torture of Christians in North Korea
New reports from former North Korean eye-witnesses indicate that the totalitarian government tortures, executes Christians and people related to the faith.

50,000 Christians tortured and abused in North Korean prisons

Christians victims of rising 'hostility' from gov't and secular groups, report says

If man is just a sack of chemicals, the product of an indifferent universe, more similar to an ant or robot (or even a cockroach or vacumn cleaner) than the exalted Renaissance man, why should he be accorded rights or respect? Makes no sense.

 

Maybe helpful to the pack, not so caring for rabbits, sheep, etc.

 

Dawkins doesn't like the God of Judaism, but of course the God of Christianity is forgiving and compassionate.

 

The person you were responding to wasn't talking about interspecies cooperation, and the thread isn't about protecting the rights of species other than our own. So I don't see why you'd use a wolf's eating habits to make a point here.