Would you raise kids to be homophobes? No? Well why do you do this?

See, my greatest hope is that we avoid fanning the embers that do exist into a flame or allowing outside agitators to push our buttons and pull our strings to get us to see each other as the enemy instead of the REAL enemies planting the seeds for what could be an everlasting hatred which would keep them wealthy and in power for the rest of our days.

Here's an example of a hatred that;s gone on for a while.

Hutu vs Tutsi* may have killed 1,000,000

American deaths in ALL wars in US history is about 1,300,000

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rwanda...Tutsi.22_in_the_imperial_and_colonial_periods

 

See that forest? There are trees in it. Wow can you manage to miss a point. You're asking other people to do something you yourself refuse to do. That's not how things work.

 

That few of them are honest and non-contradictory? Embrace the ones who ARE honest and non-contradictory....

but MOCK those who say "I'm for individual freedom"...but who want to deny that freedom to others because they think the way those people love other people is "icky" or "condemned by God"?

just like those who say "I'm for Government getting off your back and out of your lives"....but who pass laws in Virginia with a GOVERNMENT MANDATE saying a woman has to have a probe shoved up her vagina?

Or how some of them are HYPOCRITES.....demanding "Stop demonizing the Right"...when most of their posts on a blog are demonizing the Left???

 

His signature is doing him no favors either. It's amazing. He's saying that we gay people should not defend ourselves- we should just let the right abuse us as much as they want. And If we don't they'll cause a civil war. We'll gee- how about the right stops abusing us?

 

It's hypocrisy. Especially the 'stop demonizing the Right'....when even in this thread, certainly in his other threads and responses on PF, he constantly attacks "the Left".

You've seen it a million times. Some self-righteous Rightwinger who says "Lib'ruls are just full of hate and don't want any opposing viewpoints expressed"....

and then five seconds later are screaming "Lib'ruls are nasty, stinking, anti-American scum who should all be shot for the traitors they are!"

But this "Why don't you gays shut up and stop attacking us for not wanting to give you equal rights" stuff.....I'm sure was quite popular in the 60s with other types who wanted to maintain the status quo and wanted other groups demanding equal rights to "shut up".

 

Mandatory ultrasound laws are technically not "mandated". If a woman has a sense of right and wrong and doesn't want to have an abortion, then she is not mandated to have an ultrasound, even if mandatory ultrasound laws actually existed. The woman also has the option to not have an ultrasound, if she chooses to not have an abortion.

 

Its pretty obvious to everyone that you are focused negatively on Liberals, and are unable to hold yourself or Conservatives to the same standards you ask from Liberals- its pretty obvious to everyone here that you have a wierd bias against Liberals

So far, all i have seen is you asking Liberals to change.

I haven't seen any commitment from yourself to not do what you tell Liberals not to do.

Nor do I see you asking Conservatives to change.

When I see that you are asking from both Liberals and Conservatives what you have committed yourself to- well then I will believe you have taken the first step.

When I see follow through on your behalf on posts here at PF, I will be glad to congratulate you on your efforts to reduce hate in America.

I look forward to the day when you take that worthwhile first step

 

That sums things up very reasonably.

 

I don't believe homophobia to be a real thing either.....

 

Although I am sure there are a very minuscule few who actually fear homosexuals, I don't think there are many. I think homophobia is a terrible word for people who actually hate gays, because it makes no sense whatsoever as it is not fear that they are feeling, it is hatred. Completely different.

 

If parents--left right and in-between--were given a choice as to what their child's sexual orientation will be, I bet there is only one box that gets checked 99.99% of the time.

 

I did some searching around- appears that the prefix 'miso' would probably be appropriate- as in misanthrope. But mishomo or misohomo doesn't look right in English.

Not as if racist or anti-semite really convey the meanings well from their actual roots. For instance anti-semite technically refers to all semites but is actually used almost exclusively to describe those with a hatred of Jews. But anti-jew seems rather non-technical and misojew.....well sounds like something you would eat.

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Sure- thats the reason why I don't buy into the idea that being gay is a choice- just as few parents would wish for their child to be the subject of intense bullying, discrimination and rejection, I don't believe that a person would chose an identity that faces those same things.

 

You're comparing Conservatives and Republicans...a political ideology...with Homosexuality? Well...maybe there is a connection, since there seems to be an abundance of Homophobes within the conservative movement. I'm not sure why the are so scared of homosexuals, but that's pretty obvious to most people.

Why do you hold this unfavorable view toward LGBT's? You claim to know how powerful Hate Teach is, and yet you seem to overlook the source of that hate teach is straight out or your own ideology. Then you have the nerve to tell, liberals to stop the hate with the outrageous claim that it begins with "you", and to stop demonizing the right? Really?? So the right shouldn't be held up to scrutiny for their own demonization of the LGBT community? Our offspring are being taught to think, and use reason and logic in confronting issues that come up. Republicans present a totally discriminatory bill in Arizona with others pending in Georgia and other states, and you think that holding those up to the light of day, amounts to "hate teach"? What exactly is it that you're teaching with this kind of legislation? You're teaching that discrimination is justified. You're teaching that hate is cool. And then you have the gall to play the victim with this; "Please stop demonizing the Right.". Here's a word of advice; Stop presenting yourselves as morally repugnant idiots and you'll find that the problem goes away. There's a reason that you lose every minority group in every election. Maybe you should ask yourself,. what's going on here? Maybe its us?

 

Yeah it all sounds very Japanese. lol

Not that any of this matters though. Even if someone is a bigot I'm not going to sit here and call them that. But it seems those who know they are bigots tend to use the words they so strongly dislike more than anyone else, which is rather ironic.

 

negative attention is still attention

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just as those that commit affairs tend to accuse the spouse of having an affair first.

 

Yup. I think they call that self-projection. lol

 

Let me start by saying that we have a couple of things in common. I too came up in the 60’s. Graduated high school in 1965 so I’m a little older. I am straight as I presume that you are. Also like you, I was, back then, exposed too much scorn and ridicule of gays. They were always the freaks that inhabited ‘The Village” in NY. The thought of being in the presence of a gay person was absurd not to mention talking about “rights” for gays. However, I was also taught respect and acceptance of others who are different in terms of their culture and lifestyle and that translated into a generally liberal/progressive attitude on social issues. Sure as a young person, I participated deriding gays. But then I grew up and realized that you can’t go through life carrying the burden of hate and scorn for no good reason other than your past exposure to such things. You can’t hide behind your childhood experiences and use it as justification for treating others as inferior to you. You have to grow up, take responsibility and learn how to think for yourself.

The fact that at one point you say that you have a “generally unfavorable view of LGBT people, and then say that you have a “slightly unfavorable view” tells me that you really haven’t thought this through. It can’t be both so which is it? Can you articulate that reasons for those feelings? Have you discussed any of this with the LGBT people who you know? What are your views of them as individuals and does it mesh with you generalized view of gays?

As far as demonizing the right goes, they do a pretty good job of that themselves…..when you behave like a demon, you will create the perception of being a demon. If conservatives want to repair the rift between left and right, the have to stop DEMONIZING the poor, women, immigrants and yes, gays. These are groups who want to live in peace, with equality and opportunity. Conservatives attack them relentlessly. The divisiveness starts with conservatives who seek to turn back the clock on civil rights, social safety net programs, women’s reproductive rights.

They are the aggressors and they need to stop the demonization first before any healing can take place. Hatred for the sake of hate-hatred as a gut instinct that that you yourself do not full understand is indeed a burden. But some things, and yes, some people are worthy of hate or at least scorn. I am a tolerant person, except when it comes to intolerance, and far too many conservatives are in fact intolerant.
‘

 

You bet that because that's what you want to believe. What are you basing that on? What if the questions was: What's more important, that your child be straight, or that your child be happy, well adjusted, accepted and comfortable with who they are? What do you think the answer would be?

 

Another thought. If there is any truth to that assumption, could it be the result of the fact that those parents are aware of the fact that because of people like you, a gay person still-in the 21st century- has a harder time of it than straight kids? Could it be that they really don't care about sexual orientation nearly as much as they care that their child does not have to be subjected to knuckle dragging bigoted Neanderthals?

 

But are you intelligent enough to realize that the problem may be with a faith or belief that teaches you this? What is the basis of the hate for the homosexual? It's your religious view, or your faith or belief. Fine, but what is that based on? The Bible? If that's the case, then you're referring to a passage in Leviticus that also tells you what you should do about growing a beard, eating shellfish, or what to do with a disobedient child. So if you're going to grab onto one passage to justify your hate for homosexuals, then why would you ignore the others? You're practicing a selective application of your faith. This turns your faith into a Smorgesborg or Pot-luck belief system. Just because you believe, or have been programmed to believe something, doesn't make it true. You say that you don't hate the person, but rather the behavior of the person, as if you can separate the two. I don't hate right wingers per se', I just hate the ideology; the thinking that is intolerant of people that don't think as they do. I hate the sin, not the sinner. Isn't that about the same thing. So when somebody actually says that it's the problem of the left for demonizing the right for their behavior with regards to others, how is this different from what if being suggested here? What's being demonized here, is the irrationalism that is being displayed and the stubborn refusal to examine the reasoning process. The refusal to hold ones own beliefs up to scrutiny. It's the all too predictability of the right winger to KNOW that he's right, because his "belief" tells him so, and it's a belief that can't even demonstrate what makes itself true. The Liberal knows that he could be wrong. Which of the two do you think is more likely to be closer to the truth...and isn't the truth the thing that matters most here?

 

I don't find a problem with "demonizing" hypocrisy. I would tell a conservative, "don't take it personal. I just think that your reasoning process is totally f****ed up." Other than the way you think which totally dictates the way you act, I'm sure you're a fine example of a human being. It does seem to me that those on the right don't like having their hypocrisy pointed out. Paul Ryan is the biggest hypocrite in Congress, and I see no reason in giving the guy a pass on anything.

 

Then why would you challenge him on an opinion that is based on the ideals of sin ?!

What sense did that even make?

ffs

 

If you reread the beginning of the thread you'll see that he is the one who brought up the issue of sin in response to me, totally unrelated to what I was talking about. So I thought I'd make it clear that I don't believe in 'sin' and since it cannot be proven to be a real thing there's really no point in dragging it into the topic.

 

I never made it personal. It has been only about what you've typed.

I explained the "Unless you're gay" portion and how I should have said "Unless one is gay", instead.

I asked a simple question, you misinterpreted part of it, got defensive on part of it, denied the rest of it, then I pointed out the truth, and now you're bringing up the age of the post. and here we are.

I didn't realize how old it was when I posted, I don't tend to look at dates. The latest posts made the thread more current, and I hadn't seen it previously.
Once I did notice a date, I stopped commenting.

I'll try hard never to respond to one of your posts again, or "pick a fight" as you call it, so you will have no reason to feign offense.

 

Yes, you definitely had to back pedal on that one when I pointed it out. But you sure seemed ready to attack with that personal question, "Unless you're gay?" Which I should have said, who the f*** cares?

Anyways, have fun picking a fight with someone else (because that is most certainly what you're doing here). I really do not care about this conversation or this thread anymore. /welcometomyignorelisttroll