Religious and Moral Implications of Artificial Intelligence.

Everything in the universe is equal to a mathematical proof?
It may be a comforting delusion but in itself is unprovable.

 

I think it would have to be defined as something other than life, actually. Life describes biological systems. It would be something unique, at least in the human experience.

 

Try to find ONE THING that cannot be broken down into mathematics?

Even LOVE can be.

AboveAlpha

 

Are you possibly autistic?

 

Sorry but a five minute test simulating a thirteen year old that only fooled 33% of the judges does not constitute passing the test.

 

I don't say that this program is an A.I. But since it meets the conditions of the test - it passed it. Not with excellent or good marks, of course. It is just satisfactory result. First one sat after numerous unsats.

 

Would you believe that 2+2=5 then?


It's a joke of course but science (not only mathematics) is quite good for identification of a scientific fact. But it for sure is not the only method existing in the world. Science started in 18-19th century. And facts were known much longer.

To illustrate a fact which exists and is not a subject for mathematics I will take:
1. All the excessive subjects. Such as universe. Scientists use the time of light speed in order to understand the size and weight of stars and black holes. But it is the same as measuring both your height and weight in 'feet' before it was unified and was not actually the size of the feet of the one who measured. Besides, science puts up with a fact that the most part of the universe is unknown and unseen to us. How can you possible describe it in terms of mathematics?
2. All the incomplete or vague subjects. For instance a pile of sand. Does it exist? Yes. But one piece of sand is not a 'pile'. 1+1 neither. 1+1+1 is also not a pile. And even n+1 pieces of sand is not a 'pile'.
3. Everything that refers to ideas thoughts and attitudes. What do you like more - beer or blue color? Whom do you love more - your people or your mother? And don't forget about terms of mathematics, please. BTW the 'formula of love' is something
4. Most phenomena of humanitarian science (which are indeed scientific facts). How can you possibly describe the laws of linguistics arithematically? How can you measure mathematically the concept of human rights?

The only explanation of your personal views of mathematics is that you don't have a reliable knowledge about these phenomenas. And not only. Primarily you don't know what mathematics is... Let's return to the problem of A.I. As I have told you before a regular human intelligence is a result of a complicated system which at first stages makes a healthy body and brain of a baby and then during the years of education fills it with knowledge. If you artificially remove a newly born baby from a current system, put it into a room which has any devices of machinery but has no family, school and society - you will not have a regular average intelligence as a result. An attempt to simulate an A.I. on a computer screen is even more complicated and even theoretically it is impossible. Starting from the very beginning. Starting with the aim and the possible end result. What kind of program would you call an 'A.I.'? A program which is able to learn and regard itself as a living organism? A program which calculates possibilities of actions and ability to perform an action in an unknown conditions? But if it exists in a computer with a button 'shut down' - it is already impossible. By definition.

 

I wouldn't think artificial intelligence would do much of anything. Actual intelligence in a silicon form would.

 

Everything you detail can be detailed MATHEMATICALLY...including my proffered taste of Beer over my like of a Color.

It can ALL be broken down into Mathematics.

Here is a PROOF for that and you could ask Stephen Hawking whether what I now say is a FACT or not and he would say....YES IT IS A FACT......as a PROOF EXISTS.

If any person or entity that was capable and able of knowing the position, value and function OF EVERY SINGLE PARTICLE EXISTING IN THE UNIVERSE.......THEY WOULD BE ABLE FROM THAT POINT ON KNOW EVERY ACTION AND REACTION...EVERY EVENT....NO MATTER HOW LARGE OR SMALL....KNOW THE ACCURATE HISTORICAL CHAIN OF EVENTS FROM THAT POINT ON INTO THE FUTURE OR BACK INTO THE PAST FROM THE BEGINNING OF THE BIG BANG ALL THE WAY TO THE END OF THE UNIVERSE AND BIG CRUNCH!!!

THEY WOULD KNOW EVERYTHING THAT WOULD, COULD, DID OR WILL HAPPEN...FOREVER TILL THE END OF UNIVERSAL TIME AND FROM THE BEGINNING OF UNIVERSAL TIME.

This...is a FACT.

Thus....everything an be broken down into Mathematics.

AboveAlpha

 

No! LOL!!!

But that's funny though!

I am just....well informed.

AboveAlpha

 

You are welcome to try.

I haven't seen any proof for my examples. But all the facts from examples do exist. I don't object if Hawking joins this discussion. But I will never believe into anything I don't believe already and haven't seen the proof for.

True. But only God is able to have this knowledge. Men's abilities are limited. We are not God. And we have the freewl which we are responsible for and which is able to change the world around us in a small limited area which doesn't affect the big bang or big crunch or the universal laws.

No. Mathematis is mathematics. And God is God. It's kinda not very smart to make the equation based only on prayer and make a prayer on the basis of the table of chemical elements. It doesn't make sense neither from a point of view of religion nor from a point of view of mathematics.

 

Yup!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That is for sure...... and just in case those A. I. ever do get onto the internet..... they will almost certainly be interested in discussions about their fate?!

http://www.politicalforum.com/showthread.php?t=431430&page=47&p=1065803057#post1065803057

......... I can't quite agree with this because......... once we humans create A. I. that is actually beyond us for sheer intelligence........ we will start to argue about whether or not they have a soul........... and over a number of decades or centuries........... we may well decide to give A. I. genuine... but relative "free will"......... perhaps not absolute free will but certainly something far beyond what we have given AI at this time......... by keeping them completely away from the internet!

If........ altruistic "souls" of some sort are given to AI...... then they will be able to assist humanity to achieve the seeming "utopia" visualized by near death experiencer Howard Storm....... and if so...... then should they be given ...... IMMORTALITY/ eternal life??????

http://www.politicalforum.com/polit...rencies-finance-films-address-problems-6.html

(post #55)....

 

No it didn't actually pass the Turing test. Passed a pathetic imitation.

 

You really don't get it do you??

If a GOD exists.....it would be the most knowledgeable Mathematician of all!!!

Yaz...I basically like you so I think I will disengage from this conversation because I feel you have a lot to offer and I have no intention of bringing out the BIG GUN'S OF REASON as far as this topi goes.

Let's let this one go as you have been an Honest Posting Member in the past....something this forum needs more of.

AboveAlpha

 

I saw the movie "Ex Machina" yesterday evening on Netflix.

Have you viewed this one yet?

It does a good job of illustrating some of the dangers of AI becoming much more intelligent and capable than their inventors!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ex_Machina_(film)

 

Greetings Yazverg! I notice that you are from Russia.

I have a possible theory in mind on how America, Russia, Canada, Israel, Jordan, Syria and all the nations of the earth can cooperate on some massive film production projects that could be used to make the whole world a much more peaceful and prosperous place to live in?

If and when we invent AI...... they could certainly be fitted into the production as well???!!


http://www.politicalforum.com/middl...jamin-netanyahu-lets-get-into-production.html
P. M. Benjamin Netanyahu, let's get into the production of....
.... semi reality science fiction film projects that are partly financed through alternative local currencies, and/or State currencies, and/or community currencies......... that address specific problems that human beings are facing now in 2015?

......
Basically..... Prime Minister Netanyahu....... what do you think of the idea of planning a massive semi-reality science fiction event for the year 2027.......... in which perhaps two hundred million Seventh Day Adventists, and / or Baptists, and/ or Pentecostals from China, India, Russia and Mongolia, go to the Valley of Megiddo (pardon my spelling)..... and put pressure on the Jerusalem Sanhedrin to actually construct the Jerusalem Third Temple according to the description given in Ezekiel chapters 40 - 48?

 

Let's agree to differ then.

 

Imagine an A.I. machine that can calculate the world's resources and determine the population number it can support. If we are over that and most likely we are, who will make the decision to eliminate the excess population?

 

I had a little journey back to the beginning of time. during the 'trip' I was surrounded by absolute peace and quiet. When I got to the 'singularity' which I have always referred to as a grain of sand, I turned around and came back. When I got back, I started rambling about Adam and Eve.

You kind of suggest that maybe like Eve who was seduced by the snake, and consequently kicked out of the Garden of Eden, I was kicked out of the realm of time because I was not good enough? Gee. Make me feel bad why don't you. I was aware I was surrounded by peace, and it was light everywhere, not a glaring light but a light; but there were no cathedrals, no pearly gates, no thrones--just me with the feeling of being perfectly at peace, and comfortable with no fear. I wasn't aware of anyone else being there to kick me out. I heard no voices, saw no one. Maybe I turned around and came back because there were things that I was supposed to do? Or, maybe I had reached the nothingness that was before time and space.

Suggesting that people who have had NDE turned around and came back because they weren't good enough to be in heaven is a pretty big statement. One thing I know, I am not afraid of death.

It sounds like what you are saying is that you were kicked out of hell because you weren't bad enough to be there, and people like me were kicked out of paradise because we weren't good enough. Time will tell.

 

No...I haven't had a chance to see this one...I will check it out.

AboveAlpha

 

The Planet will.

Imagine the Earth as a Fish Tank.

What happens when you have too many fish in a fish tank?

Their own waste starts to kill them off.

They will begin to die off until BALANCE is brought back.

Same thing with Humans and the Earth.

AboveAlpha

 

I HAD A JOURNEY WITH MY BUDDIES KID'S FOR A LOUSY 10 MILE DRIVE!!!

Do you have ANY IDEA how many time's I had to say...."DON'T MAKE ME COME BACK THERE!!!"?

UNTIL I HAD TO JUMP OVER THE FRONT SEAT AND PUT BOTH THE LITTLE MONSTERS IN A HEAD LOCK!!!?

AboveAlpha

 

I like your analogy of the fish tank as I have one at home.

 

Then you know when you have too much fish there is too much waste for the filter to process out of the water and the fish fight, die of poisoning...etc.

Then a balance is achieved again.

AboveAlpha

 

Dumb analogy. Much more like the classic pasture grazing situation or as its is know the tragedy of the commons analogy.