Is BATF Forming A National Firearm Owners Database?

I believe you are 100% correct and now that many FFL's are using customer facing PC's allowing buyers to electronically fill out the 4473, with a system that is is claimed to only assist the buyer to fill out the 4473, a system not connected to somewhere else which then print out a hard copy to be singed and stored.

Where's the guarantee that system is not also uploading the 4473 somewhere outside of the FFL's premise?

Hey I like broccoli and when it's banned they will have to pry it out of my cold dead hands.

Or maybe I will just bury my broccoli off my property and dig it up later.

Not a bright idea, first of all it requires a person to trespass, get caught doing that with a load of guns and it is armed trespassing, which in most states is a felony, so bye, bye guns and off to the pokie for the trespasser, or the person gets noticed, maybe the police are called or maybe the observer waits until the planter leaves and digs up the booty, again good bye guns.

It's a simple but non-realistic dumb idea, more so when one posts what they will do on-line.

 

At one time I would agree, but times are changing and if law enforcement comes knocking on ones door with a copy of the relevant 4473's and there is no paper trail of where they went after the purchase, that in many liberal courts wold be enough PC to get a search warrant.

And that's a bad way to start ones day at three in the morning.

 

Hate to say it, but when we see all those "nice" people shot by the police who have multiple, MULTIPLE felonies on their records and STILL skulking the streets, maybe being a "felon" carries less onus than being "law abiding", at least in how you're treated by the "justice system".

 

And without a report which most people would file the loss becomes suspicious, furthermore what can you use the guns for which you claim not to have?

 

If they can demonstrate probable cause, sure. This gives you time.

 

You all won’t get your hypocritical bloodlust, as this Supreme Court is the most pro gun court in history. The second ol Joe signs a ban, it will be challenged to the court and all AWB will fall.

The cops didn’t mess with the armed gunners at the Capitol or the ranch. They won’t be able to do home to home searches without it getting out. Once that happens, individuals will turn to groups will turn to hostile neighborhoods to hostile towns to hostile states for door knocking team. Between groups and false info given to rigged bait houses to take out entire property stealing teams, I am not worried about your all’s fantasy of having state sanctioned murder over your desire to disarm the public to be at the mercy of the state.

Maybe if you all showed up armed with gas masks to make the tear gas useless, you’d find the cops wouldn’t beat the crap out of your protesters so much. Oh, and forget the insurrection act, not handing over guns doesn’t count under that.

Womp Womp Womp

and... what guns? I own no guns.

Womp Womp again

 

I live in red Missouri. Not only has our state already decided it will ignore a federal ban the same way blue states ignore federal laws they don’t like, but our local sheriff won’t enforce it either. Our redneck county has redneck cops that own and shoot the same guns and hunt with the people they protect.

A ban that can’t or won’t be enforced is useless. Just like blue states ignore federal drug and immigration laws. Goose/Gander

Now, how do you like DEM apples?

 

Sounds like you have been hanging out with David Koresh.

 

And you sound like you have been hanging out with Hitler; wanting to murder citizens for their guns they legally spent their hard earned money on so they will be at the mercy of a better armed state.

Good luck with that and please, bring it on.

 

Incorrect, I never said I went along with such anti Constitutional actions, but I fully understand and do not underestimate what the government is capable of doing to it's citizens.

As for bringing it on, I wouldn't want to be one of your neighbors when that happens, LEO's tend to hit everything other than their targets, eventually they will kill you, but in the meantime they might thoroughly ventilate my home in the process.

 

What gets tracked gets improved. Gun owners would be motivated to behave more responsibly if it was easier to trace crime guns back to them. Read my signature.

 

When I grew up in Belfast in the 60’s and 70’s, all guns, even ammo for ‘my kind’ was illegal and meant prison time for simple possession. For some of us, there was that choice, have guns for self protection against a high risk of a life/death threat or risk prison, with choice being caught with a weapon and doing time vs the other option, defending your life, in going to prison you’d at least would be alive... for many of us, the choice was obvious. And in August ‘69, proved necessary against the state and it’s
privileged class. The only thing that mitigated the damage and potential for death were the guns secreted despite the threat of prison.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1969_Northern_Ireland_riots
Think that can’t happen here... hmmm, recent new would hint otherwise. The lines are being drawn,
https://www.gunsamerica.com/digest/...brandon-tatum-patriots-ready-to-take-up-arms/

Through those years of the 60’s-70’s, I had gun and ammo caches in several locations, but never in my home. In fact, when I left Ireland in the early 70’s, I had left a cache, that included a Sten MkII, a couple rifles and three hand guns with hundreds of rounds of ammo and cleaning kit, all packed in cosmoline in a water proofed container. It was still untouched and intact when I last checked in 2016. Though I don’t live there anymore, I travel there and I have friends and family yet living there and should the need yet arise as could be possible given how BREXIT is handled, then...

 

Your signature is a fraudulent comment and not true what so ever..

 

Sadly I think it will happen here, the difference is you grew up tempered hard, a lot of Americans are too soft to take care of themselves, nor less push back.

Yes there are people here who are able to push back, but most of those I find online are keyboard warriors, when it comes to their door they will soil their pants and assume a fetal position.

The ones who can actually push back never get online and post what they can do.

Likewise the ones who proudly show off their firearm collection are in the same group, all they are doing is making themselves into targets for both the government and those who push back.

 

Duplicate

 

yes, A different time and place, and lessons many fail to heed. Often when the SHTF , there will be those that didn’t see it coming, but in 20/20, will say the warning signs were there. These are the same ones that ignored the warning signs, and believed in the better nature of man, a posture that allows predators to incrementally take advantage of the willful naivety of their victims. It’s a pattern so often repeated in history that it boggles the mind how many fall to the same thing, but then who writes the history? When I came to the US I was stunned to find my knowledge of US history was far advanced of the majority of those I encountered that lived here. A question I found myself asking when I found someone whose knowledge of history was in the nil zone, was and still is, “when was the War of 1812 fought?” The answers will stun... try it. More often than not, the answer will she’d light on more than a comprehension of history, but sheds light on why so many here are oblivious.
When I encounter those of the left repeating the bumper sticker mantras of the left’s dogma, I often make reference to the French Revolution and ask if they feel as safe as Robespierre did. That question always get a blank look.
You’d think those that have seen firsthand what I have seen and experienced, and many here originating from counties of repression, would valuable sources for understanding, but they are almost always ignored, as children often ignore the advice of their parents, which sets them up to make the same mistakes. But... it’s all roses and wine, eh?

 

I have been shot at twice and had a knife pulled on me once and what you say is accurate for a majority of the population.

The first tie I was something like 16 we had responded to a call at a drug store on East Broward Blvd, we went just past the store, the officer did a u-turn and with the car not turning sharp parked it with the right front wheel on the sidewalk, as we got out another call came over the radio advising the call was a armed robbery, the officer yelled at me to stay behind the door, I never heard him, as I got close tot he front door this guy came out with a bag in one hand an a gun in the other, I saw him, he saw me and he shot at me.

I just stood there dumbfounded, somewhere in my mind it didn't compute to react, it was a new event with no programming as how to react, suddenly from behind me was a series of gun shots, then some more from a couple of plain clothes standing in the road.

They ran to the guy but he was dead and I was still standing there trying to figure just what the heck happened, had I just been a person walking down the sidewalk and those officers not been there, I would be the dead one.

Of course looking back things become clearer, we ran code3 to the call, that in of it self gets the adrenaline flowing and while I didn't know it my senses where being affected and not on a good way, my mind was cutting out a lot of external inputs, which included my hearing.

Over history many have succeeded, but that is because they came up against an untrained criminal and there have been many crimes stopped just by a a defensive gun being present, for that reason I train and I carry, but I am not going face to face with an active shooter, that's suicidal, I'm going to get out of there behind cover or better a barricade and if given the opportunity to ambush the shooter, I might just take the chance.

Anything else is Hollywood drama, more so if that shooter has a rifle and the good guy a handgun.

 

Money buys a lot of defense, as in the kind of money most people don’t have. I imagine if someone was determined and had the money, they could build a SWAT proof bunker. A home in the middle of nowhere that is an empty shell over a deep underground bunker. That kind of cash would give access to title 2 stuff, so illegal land mine trap around the areas SWAT would come, the empty shell house rigged to explode for first entry try, along with other nasty surprises. Forcing the choice to surround and let the person grow old and die in their bunker or getting the President to sign off on a drone to drop a bunker busting bomb.

If ever win a mega millions, I will buy farmland and build an underground bunker/home that can not be raided like a normal everyday home.

 

All I can say is one word. Why?

 

Just because. I have no criminal record, I just like the idea of living in a place that SWAT would have to ask for military assistance to get into. I would absolutely build a place like that, if I won a huge lottery and had $100 million left over after investments to blow. Not because I need it (there will be no forced gun grab, Biden’s plan wants registration under NFA, which this court will never allow), but because it would be a peace of mind to know a middle of the night surprise raid would be impossible on me without using a drone to drop a bomb.