Minimum Wage

If one looks up the quality of skills our current college grads have, it's not encouraging. Reading and comprehension has dropped around 30% over the last 20 years.
60% of managers claim that graduates taking jobs in their organizations do not have the critical thinking and problem solving skill that are needed.
56% say attention to detail is inadequate. 46% say communication skills are inadequate. 44% point to lack of leadership skills, 36% lack teamwork and interpersonal skills.
We have far too much focus on ideology and politics, teaching people what to thing, that how to think- and that will lead to major consequences and failures.

I used to have a PhD working for me, highly educated and opinionated. He was a warehouse man and janitor. Lot of knowledge, no understanding or motivation. His patents wasted a small fortune supporting a university that fail to produce a functioning person.

 

Keeping it simple makes it easier to grasp.

If the minimum wage rises, ALL trades are subject to it, so ALL product reflect it in their price.
if the minimum goes from $10 to $15- the middle class worker who was making $15 feels he has been demoted; he now demands $20, and that is rational. The man that was making $20, wants $28, and so on. So the adjustment telegraphs through the wage scale from bottom to top, affecting the cost of all products being produced by wage-earning people. That pretty well covers the entire spectrum. It is not limited to those at the entry scale, nor to bread. From toys to televisions to houses and cars- it will alter the costs, and that will alter the prices, which will go full circle and alter the cost of living.

On the other hand, when productivity is increased- lets say you make 10 widgets an hour, but a new, efficient technique allows the same person to make 20- doubling the wage does not impact the product cost, because the labor cost per part has not changed at all. Value is tied to productivity and efficiency- not what people think they need.

 

Problems you are pointing to are not solved by turning college into a trade school for engineering. And, that's been one of the more strongly stated right wing demands.

What I hear is a constant assault on anything related to communication and interpersonal skills, for example. God forbid someone should take a course in history, civics, English, etc.

And, your "teach people what to think" is something I have not seen in University.

Interestingly enough, your anecdote is a confirmation of your claim that people just aren't learning logical argument these days. Single datapoint. No cite. No sufficient data on the situation. Unsupported claims. Etc.

 

I understand wage compression. It's been going on for a long time. It's FAR more common cause is the effort employers put into capping the salary of all wage earners.

So, now we have a situation where wages haven't kept up with the cost of living for more than a couple decades. Given inflation, those working low wage jobs have actually lost buying power.

So, we have a case where we see a continuing trend of rapidly diverging income paths - the rich getting richer and the rest stagnating.

Now, you come along with your arguments for perpetuating that problem.

However, I DO so love it when you propose that the problem is that some guy barely above minimum wage is making DEMANDS that the corporation can't help but accommodate - thus imperiling the poor corporation caught in the grips of this worker.

Sorry. No sale.

 

I think a minimum wage gives businesses an excuse to underpay employees. It does the opposite of what it is intended to do. We need to get rid of it.

 

That isn't consistent with the evidence. See, for example, the consequences of Britain eliminating its minimum wage protection in the 80s. End result? Higher working poverty and a structurally flawed economy, with too much labour demand focused on low wage labour with few upskilling opportunity.

 

Raising the minimum wage is inflationary. Prices will catch up and exceed what the minimum wage will buy and things will revert right back to where we are now except that prices will be higher. I don't know about what the British did or what effect it had but I suspect your source was political. Minimum wage accomplishes nothing at all in my experience.

 

You are projecting your ,malevolent thoughts onto others . We have different values . I like public education, I like public roads, and parks,I like being able to see a dr...and call cops and firefighters if I need them ...so socialistic. Perhaps you you should give up those things after all, their socialist.
As I said we have different values, you sympathize with the victims of white discrimination victims like the neo nazis,you know, some really fine people . I sympathize with the person who works two jobs and needs help
You justify your bigotry by assuming the poor don’t take responsibility and control.....they do.....but obviously it makes you feel superior.

 

More projection to justify contempt for the poor

 

That isn't true either. Lemos (2008, A Survey of the Effects of the Minimum Wage on Price, Journal of Economic Surveys, Vol 22 Issue 1, pp 187-212), for example, finds that price effects are small and that "policy makers can use the minimum wage to increase the wages of the poor".

 

In a sense you’re right. We’re not going to get rid of social programs, and the minimum wage will be raised at some point. Things will work out, and it’s unlikely that we go backwards.

 

You aren't thinking this through.

Employers buy hours of work just like they buy other stuff they need - they figure out how little they can offer and still get the utility they need.

There is no way that a minimum wage would cause employers to offer less than they otherwise would.

 

No, only an incredibly tiny percent of employee compensation goes to the wages of minimum wage workers.

You can't argue that a change in that tiny percent of total compensation is going to make some sort of noticeable increase in cost of living.

 

We don't have a free market.

What about using unemployment compensation to solve simple poverty. Unemployment compensation for simply being unemployed in our at-will employment State would ensure capital circulates at some minimum Standard.

 

are you new here? Capitalists are being subsidized to keep wages low through social services, which cost around fourteen dollars an hour, by comparison.

 

You simply don't understand the concepts, due to your bias.

Solving for simple poverty through a form of full employment of resources is what we are discussing; money is merely a medium of exchange.

Demand and supply are still laws.

 

Structural unemployment happens; profit or failure are the options.

 

That's a logical fallacy, of course.

Let's try to stick to real arguments.

 

We're talking about wages that allow a person to pay their own way - without being supported by tax dollars, etc.

That can't be characterized as "generous".

 

Here's an idea.

Find someone working at McDonald's earning $9.00/hr and you give him $6.00/hr out of your pocket.

How does that sound? Too generous I'll bet...

 

You should try to come up with a response that makes some sort of logical sense.

Really! I'm not joking. We do need real solutions.

 

What happens if a company prices itself above the market consumers are willing to pay? They disappear.
What happens if the people who work for a given wage demand more than they are worth? The jobs disappear.

It's not a matter of money in a bottomless well and employers being stingy. I've been an employer for 50 years- and I would much rather have a $20 man than two $10 ones, it a far better way to do things. The problem is being able to find people willing and able to earn the higher wage, and that is an absolute necessity. IF you arbitrarily overpay the low income earners- you bankrupt your company and it, along with the jobs, disappears.

There have always been exceptionally valuable people, and usually they become wealthy. Most have created an industry which has a multitude of others rich too- the top people who helped it succeed and the investors that risked their money to finance it. The ones who plug along and are sure that the company is managed by crooks are hardly "on the team"; they are there to get the hell out the door as soon as possible. Most of these exceptional companies are old and the result of really sound and visionary management over decades, who have helped a large number of people become wealthy. I don't know the numbers, but BRK (buffet) alone has produced thousands of them. If you put up $10K with him in 1970, you would be worth 5 million today- without adding a dime. Any employee can buy in too; many companies promote that in order to help motivation. But the people- just like you who are convinced all who excel have cheated are never wise enough to invest in their own job. They are too busy being victims, the adversaries of success, and blaming others.

I can't, I don't know how, I was cheated, it was unfair, blah blah. Goes on forever- endless excuses for not taking the responsibility for yourself. Be WORTH more, and employers will fight to get you. They need that, they are desperate for it. Opportunity and good jobs are all over the place- but the field of applicants is littered with people eager to get paid, but not too interested in earning it. People are worth what they make themselves worth. The booming economy we have right now makes the good ones worth more- but those who want to just get by are worth less.

It's there for those who will- it's not there for those who won't.

 

By "reasonable" I guess you mean other people sacrifice and you don't....

 

You're wandering WAY off topic. I really don't care if you feel you were cheated, or whatever.

Yes. Businesses have to figure out problems like how to make a profit while selling goods or services and paying their employees.

There are also arguments in favor of wage earners being able to buy groceries and not live on the street.

You're really not going to "win" some argument by pitching only one side of that issue.

And, that's especially true in this age of monumentally divergent income paths. We need to be finding solutions to that problem, not defending it as if it was some sort of necessity that suddenly appeared.

 

And what is the real argument for a minimum wage?
Is it the same as a minimum price or profit for those who sell goods? Or would that be price fixing, because it applies differently to business?
Would it be allowing business to prevent customers from buying from anyone else, or working for anyone else like unions do? Or would that be extortion, because it applies differently to business?

What exactly is the valid argument for minimum wage other than it brings politicians popularity, and makes socialists happy?