Monuments To The Confederacy

Tell us all about Jim Crow. Explain how one event causes the other event?

 

This amazes me. I have been to a good number of the national parks where they are there due to the civil war and never read nor heard your claim until you just made it. I wonder if many are like you are in that respect?

I see no way for a magnificent statue of Robert E Lee could intimidate anybody, no matter the race. I need that explained.

 

Well, I am certain this is the case. That private money was used on private land so on that note you need not worry.

Actually during the Revolution, the winners were the minority of citizens on this land. Some assume there was angry residents everywhere and wanting to get rid of the British. But that is not true.

 

My family lost a ggg-grandfather at Chickamauga, along with 3 of his brothers and a couple of cousins at various other battles.

In 2006, we had a ceremony where headstones were placed in a family cemetery honoring 4 of these men. Their bodies are not there, but are scattered around the South. Family from several States attended.

My Southern roots run deep.

 

Mom and my birth father were born and raised in Oklahoma. Their ancestors came from states like North and South Carolina. Grandma was born and raised in Arkansas. I guess I also have roots in the South. All I know is I am not prejudiced against the south for trying to retain the form of government fought so hard for by General Washington, who also happened to own a lot of slaves.

 

My family has been in Mississippi for about 200 years. I'm married to a Connecticut Yankee (go figure).

 

George Washington was a federalist. He wouldn't have supported a confederation. He believed in a strong central government, and he supported secession only in cases where the federal government has been proven to have taken tyrannical measures to undermine a state's legal rights. He himself stated that had Britain not openly worked against the rights of colonists under British law, he wouldn't have supported the revolution.



2;

 

We will explore if you pass the first test of your first statement.

"
The only Federalist President was John Adams since although George Washington was broadly sympathetic to theFederalist program, he remained officially non-partisan during his entire presidency. ... The Jay Treaty passed and theFederalists won most of the major legislative battles in the 1790s.
Federalist Party - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federalist_Party"


A strong central goverment has many many meanings. Such as strong vs outsiders. But did he want the Feds to manage all states, that I do not accept.

I see the Federal Government of right now, and it matters not the party in charge, as worse than the Brits ever were to those colonists.

 

This takes me back to 1962, my only time in Mississippi. I was the group leader of 140 men in the Army on our way to Ft. Benning, GA and the train passed across Mississippi. A very very warm day during that trip. Georgia was so humid I could not understand any humans being there. I was more recently in CT and found the state quite pretty. We have that kind of scenery in CA as well. CA has pretty much the same scenery found all over this country in this one state. All one has to know is where to locate it.

 

Washington WAS a federalists. Anyone who holds federalist ideals is a federalist. Belonging to the party doesn't matter. Federalism existed before the formation of the federalist party.

 

Well you portray yourself as the ultimate expert. All i did was show you history from Wikipedia. Maybe you need to correct Wikipedia.

 

That is a true statement

 

^^^^^^I'm just gonna let that sit there in all its idiotic glory ^^^^^^

 

Seeing how anyone can change a wikipedia entry, it's not acceptable as a expert source.

 

That's true, if you want to see Tijuana Mexico, go to Los Angeles.

I don't think any state has any thing comparable to Yosemite and if you want to visit Mars, visit Death Valley during the summer.

 

Here is a Northerner shaking the hand of a Southerner. Why must Democrats fight today in anger?

 

LOL ... I also know LA but admit not nearly as well as I know the SF Bay area. Tijuana Mexico better not be like the rest of Mexico is all I can say. It is a pit of human misery. Fortunately for me, i evade that part of Los Angeles.

Yosemite in my view tops all other parks. I have been to Yellowstone and the Grand Canyon but none holds me like does Yosemite. I see why you think of Death Valley as like Mars. A good thing to see when in Death Valley is Scotty's Castle. It is amazing how it is so hot outside yet the building called Scotty's Castle is fairly cool inside.

 

I can't think of a time where tax money has been used that way other than in Washington where national things like the Vietnam War Memorial is. In terms of the monuments this thread is directed to, various groups have gotten together and raised money for them. Granted my knowledge of this is limited, but I can say that in my part of the country that is the only way it will happen.

 

My guess is that is from the Grand Reunion in Gettysburg in 1913.

 

Found this during a search today.

"
After President Dwight D. Eisenhower revealed on national television that one of the four “great Americans” whose pictures hung in his office was none other than Robert E. Lee, a thoroughly perplexed New York dentist reminded him that Lee had devoted “his best efforts to the destruction of the United States government” and confessed that since he could not see “how any American can include Robert E. Lee as a person to be emulated, why the President of the United States of America should do so is certainly beyond me.” Eisenhower replied personally and without hesitation, explaining that Lee was, “in my estimation, one of the supremely gifted men produced by our Nation. . . . selfless almost to a fault . . . noble as a leader and as a man, and unsullied as I read the pages of our history. From deep conviction I simply say this: a nation of men of Lee’s caliber would be unconquerable in spirit and soul. Indeed, to the degree that present-day American youth will strive to emulate his rare qualities . . . we, in our own time of danger in a divided world, will be strengthened and our love of freedom sustained.”

Eisenhower was not the first president of the United States to express such reverence for Lee, nor would he be the last. Needless to say, the story of how anyone becomes a heroic role model to a nation that he has made war upon is likely to be a bit complicated, but in this case it is well worth telling simply for what it says about the extraordinary elasticity of historical symbols when they can be bent to the aims of a cohesive, purposeful set of interests in the present."

 

Obama lost such a good opportunity to heal the country finally and instead took the low road and pitted us against each other. Such a waste of a presidency.

Steve

 

Oh geez there are people from other parts of the country I sometimes think are going to have a heart attack when they see a mixed race couple down here, I think they must think the KKK is right around the corner ready to lynch. And to think some of the worst racism I saw was in Chicago where I lived for 3 years working on the South Side, the worst areas of the city.

 

I know what you are saying. I was treated well in the South other than one time as a soldier at Ft. Benning. See, I got a pass to go to Darlington Speedway to see stock cars race. A kind man picked me up hitching a ride and we stopped for breakfast at Macon Georgia. We were starting to eat our food when across the room bellows some old man, "Whar you from ya damned Yankee?" Well, the other man was from the South so he meant me. I hollered back that i am from California if it is any of your damned business. He shut his face.

So much of my roots are from the South that I hardly hear a bad word from a true person of the South.

 

I felt like he constructed prison fences between all of us.

 

No one with any historical knowledge claims the south during jim crow was anything but hostile to its black population. If they weren't advocating slavery then they were certainly reminding blacks their place. There is no credible way to argue that erecting a statue of a Confederate soldier is any less an affront to blacks as erecting a statue of nazi soldier would be to Jews. Regardless of why the war was fought the Confederacy was born and existed under the premise that ownership of blacks was the white man's right. It was the preserving of this right that prompted them leaving the union.

Happiness isnt my objective, understanding is.

And yet the south didnt believe him. It was the south who gave Lincoln and Republican abolitionists as the reason for secession.

Who is they? And why don't you stick to arguing my own arguments instead of your inventions. I don't think Lincoln invaded over slavery. I know the south seceded over slavery they said so themselves. Lincoln's attitude towards blacks evolved over time. He might of thought blacks were inferior to whites and, at least at the beginning of the war believe that blacks and whites couldnt co-exist together but he was apposed to slavery and it's expansion. He might not of been a strict abolitionist but none of that absolves the south or sympathizes the Confederacy.

No Democrats alive today owned slaves. And no one denies the Democrats ruled southern politics during the Confederacy and Jim Crow.

I have no sympathy for them. How many slaves died in the south up to that point? Why should I care or mourn the deaths of slave holders any more than I mourn the deaths of nazis?

Now magnify that feeling over hundreds of years of torture, oppression, slavery and Jim crow and you might have an inkling of the black existence.