The Guardian view on a Brexit

I'm American

I think the UK has a rough road ahead no doubt. But that is to be expected. I defiantly think they are up to the task, they will be fine. They have proven time and time again thru out history they rebound from troubles. Some dark days ahead but they will not fail, and I think they will be better off on the other side.

 

The EU is now the sick man of the world.

 

I'm British and I'm from London.
My passport says I'm a British Citizen, it's a British Passport, and under place of birth it says 'London'.

If I ever get another citizenship and passport; that passport will say United Kingdom under my place of birth; by my passport since it's my native/domestic one from where I was born just puts 'London' under place of Birth.

I'm British before I'm English (in my head/heart); so the fact that my passport calls me a 'British Citizen born in London' is fine by me.

 

Just to take the wind out of you. Germany can take loans at the present and would get payed for it, the UK can not do it.
If Germany wanted today to finance the whole EU budget, it could raise that money and would make a profit on it, negative interest rate does that trick.
Opposite to the UK bad and nasty Germany, which dictates everything in the EU, has run a surplus in all of its national communities and organizations in the billions ( 43 billions in 2019 ), while the UK produces one deficit after a other.
I forgot over the last 10 years, the surplus.
Oh by the way, same for unemployment, health, social and so on, billions in profit.
The UK is struggling with its deficits, constant, spending like a drunk and cutting the social parts, its people have payed for, with taxes.
Does NHS ring a bell ?
The UK is already sick, living on that credit card, always has been.

Must be an Anglo thing.

 

It must be a Franco or Germanic thing to refer to UK as Anglos ignoring the blacks and Asian British people. I know it's a hard concept for you to grasp, but UK's a patch work heritage country nowadays while Francos and Germanics still are the gene pool in those countries (those rights of minority denying dodgy political past countries).
Italy even call UK Island Monkeys, so no one can accuse Europe of not being backwards people not living in mud fields betting on where bovine defecate to pass the time in their horrid existence.


There is nothing about Europe that says the EU is advanced; I've been to mainland Europe; it's a mud field for the most part, a backwards superstitious xenophobic mud field - and that's the truth.

 

Fair enough and I fully understand what your are saying

Texas is a bit different than a lot of other states. We are borderline arrogant about our state

I'm a proud American but I think of myself as a Texan equally. You'll see as many Texas flags flying as American flags around here.

 

If the UK breaks up, I'd be the one calling for London independence; my London is your Texas, it seems; IDK, but I'm very proud and happy to be from London.

 

Oh I understand. London is the "World City" city to me. I mean if I had to pick one. Such a incredible history.

Not only London, the country itself. Throw aside the colonialism attacks for a minute and you have to admire what the British Empire was and what it spanned. Nothing else like it in world history. Lots of dark parts of course to that history, but so much light as well. I'm a fan of the British Isles, always have been. I'll be honest I would live in Ireland before England I think, Galway if I had my way. But I am rooting hard for the UK to show the world that BREXIT was the right move.

Oh and I'm a part time Hammers fan as well, blowing bubbles from along way away.

"Now these her princes are come home again,
Come the three corners of the world in arms,
And we shall shock them. Nought shall make us rue,
If England to itself do rest but true"

 

Yes, Yes, we all know you are from London, its ok.

 

You see, that's what they do not get.
I am a proud European ( EU) and I am a rather proud German. You can be both and have your culture and heritage preserved and preserve it, by all means. I am even a step ahead, I am a rather proud Coloradoan, German and European.
I fly 3 flags, US, Colorado and than the German, that's the code and than I have one for the EU on its own, code.
Hihihihihi
The Eu makes a lot of sense, even at its current state, which is troubled. We tried everything and ended up in horrible wars, in the last 250 years, from Napoleon, to the German/French to the World Wars and the little **** things in between.
That is what the leaders of the 6 founding Nations get, we are the same people, no matter what your passport says. Like Americans, we are Europeans, what is wrong about that.
That idea has brought peace, prosperity and friendship as we have never seen before in Europe.
What is wrong with that ?
As a 16 year old I was into my face and beaten up, as a exchange student in France, because I was a German. Two of the guys who beat me up, including the guy who spit into my face are now my friends. What is wrong with that ?
My father was Rittmeister, German Cav, and his battalion destroyed at the end of the war a UK cav battalion, wiped it out. It was a very old and traditional UK battalion. Got resurrected after the war. The same battalion was stationed were I come from. During the fall exercises they used my fathers farm, headquarters and so on. The Old Man gave them 1. class treatment, they knew who he was, the guy whos troops destroyed them, a long time ago, but still.
I was 16 years old and had qualified for the European Military Heptalon, which was held in Scotland, were this battalion was from.
It had 2 contenders of its own, they adopted me, so I could compete. I trained 4 weeks with them, lived with them, trained with them and went through al the military drills with them, everyday.
That's when I became a European/EU.
If I, the son of the commander, who wiped this battalion out, became a honorable member, a pet, or what ever of that battalion and than defeat, my friend and competitors and they would haul me around on their shoulders, me the German, whos father had given them the greatest defeat, in their history..
That was many years before the UK joined the EU.
We are Europeans and we have to make the EU work and pulling out of it is national and European failure and in the UK case I would call it a national failure, but the EU has to do better to sell its cause, by all menas.

 

I can see the differences, Europe is a closer knit community than the Americas. That can bring good things and bad with it. There is not really a "America Unity" as far as the US, Canada and Mexico for example. Europe seems to have that. We also do not have the history of conflict with each other that Europe has so that is a huge factor.

It's difficult mixing nationalities into a single entity (like the EU) without losing your national identity. Tough balance.

 

Talking of Spain...and Catalonia? Should the Catalans be allowed their independence from Spain?

 

Well that's dumb and unholy; you're pretty much identifying with a mutated trade deal.

Why? Because it's Europe? That makes no sense.

France's answer to Adolf Hitler

• Economics
• Soverignty
• Language
• Europe haven't earned what the United States have

It lacks democracy, did you know 24 people in Europe aren't elected by the public and are immune from being arrested; and these 24 people dictate what 500, 000, 000 people in the EU do. - Also it's offensive to say the least whenever the EU views itself in the same regard as America considering America's history and the EU's are different; for one thing, countries in the EU are made up of your former

• Nazi
• Facist
• Communist
• War torn loser

And America isn't, America has 1 language and America earned the right, the EU haven't.
If the EU wanted to be like America, then ask the EU to vote for things that dictate their lives; such as who the President is, and the Lisbon Treaty.

No you don't have to make it work! You have to understand what a failing project is and walk away before it implodes.
Countries in the EU will never stop being small and poor, no matter how you dress them up; this is your fate for the most part in Europe, you have to learn to accept that.

You make me laugh, considering you still think the EU is the world and that life depends on it.

 

We're starting to see the EU deal with the reality of losing the UK.
Without the UK, the EU's illusion of wealth is subsiding for the more realistic picture of what the EU is; a bunch of small and poor countries.

 

....and all propped up by the German tax payer....

 

OK. I have bolded the interesting bit.
You have 320 miles, and over 200 crossing places. How do you make that a physically hard border?
Barbed wire and machine gun nests?

 

It is the usual hard fight and negotiation about the budget and it is a 6 year budget they are talking about.

I expect them to fight hard over every tenth of a percentage point, that's their job.

The illusion is the UK wealth, because it is based on EU membership. The UK industry is already feeling it. Brexit has cost the UK industry over 120 billion Pounds in investment and is expected to be 200 billion Pounds by the end of the year. UK GDP has taken a serious hit, because of Brexit. You are not feeling it right now, because of excellent employment figures.
Just wait.

 

Yes it is a tough balance. I would change the wording from national identity to regional identity as we already have it in every European country. They are actual a micro cosmos of the EU and the spice of every European country.
Take Canada, Quebec is completely different from BC, at times they fight like dogs and cats, but they are Canadians, its the spice of the country, as I call it.

 

A porously hard border... like it used to be....

If it wasn't for the Border what would we do
We'd only have one parliament instead of having two
We couldn't play with pounds and punts
And roadblocks would be few
We couldn't live at all without the Border

I am a simple farmer, the truth I'll tell to you
I own a bit of land that would graze a beast or two
But how my life has changed since my field was cut in two
By a little dotted line that's called the Border

My uncle's in the customs, he makes a punt or two
He doesn't like the work but it keeps him off the brew
His underwear's in ribbons but his uniform is new
Sure he couldn't live at all without the Border

And I myself am unemployed but the smuggling sees me through
For the Border is a way of life as I'll explain to you
For I draw the dole in Newry, and in Dundalk I draw it too
Sure I couldn't live at all without the Border

....it’s an old folk song....

 

Then so be it; I for one couldn't care less what they do in the EU.

The only thing I want the EU to do is to keep expecting UK to follow the political declaration with Boris Johnson's majority.
I can't believe the EU would be so stupid enough to grant Brexit under the pretense of the political declaration. If the UK wouldn't have signed it, would we still be in the EU? f' that noise.
Boris Johnson was right to sign whatever they put in front of him to get the UK out, now the UK's out; UK promises to diverge and if the EU doesn't drop their stance of UK following EU rules and honoring the political declaration, then this will push the UK to walk away from these negotiations in June just so we all can get ready to deal with each other under WTO come 2021; let me make this clear; UK (and no one in the world) has the intention to leave the EU to be ruled by the EU, and the idea that anyone would is stupid, even Micheal Barnier ought to know better than to think a country would leave the EU to be ruled by the EU.


The EU have two choices;

1. Treat the UK like Canada (give us a deal).
2. Treat the UK like Singapore (don't give us a deal).

Not one of those two choices the EU have involve treating the UK like it's in the EU; that kind of treatment will push the UK to walk away in June if the EU doesn't stop ASAP; that's why I'm counting on the EU being the EU so the UK can walk away in June (early) without a deal.

 

Nuuugh...not quite...mebbe....there is never a black and white in politics. And there is never a straight answer from a politician - what Johnson et al say will, I bet, be a lot different from what they conclude. Despite the bluster I think Johnson is a pragmatist and will sell a pragmatic narrative to the punters as the process proceeds. We’ll see...

 

The UK is not 'out' because of the position of Northern Ireland.

 

UK's been out since 23:00 31st of January 2020 (UK time) and who cares what the EU does to protect the EU on the UK side of the bloc?

If the EU pays for protecting the other side of the EU with Turkey; then the EU will pay to protect the EU on the island of Ireland. It's up to the EU to erect a border because we all know the UK won't be doing it, and why should we? It's a matter for the EU to protect the EU, not for the UK. The UK's already said it doesn't want a border, so if a border is needed, it'll be the Irish or the EU putting one up, comprende?

 

It's kind of dangerous to assume Brexit hasn't happened or that the UK will follow EU rules.
That kind of talk will push UK away and instead of treating UK like Canada, EU can treat UK like Singapore.
It's up to the EU, who would they rather have on their doorstep, a country like Canada or a country like Singapore?

 

@gnoib