What happened to the souls of those who died on September 11, 2001?

I read much of this several years ago and I personally........ do happen to believe in the basic accuracy of what three time near death experiencer Dr. P. M. H. Atwater reports seeing happening to the souls of those who died on September 11.

I personally do not think that this contradicts the Christian or Jewish Bible teachings on what happens to us after we die!

I honestly believe that Muslims could well come to a much more peaceful understanding of how they should understand the Koran due to this account!

Please notice... the author has made this available to all of us for FREE!

http://pmhatwater.hypermart.net/Shop/Shop/products_files/239dee909b5126ada063437a2fac9db0-22.html

 

Most Christians like myself are aware that the Apostle Paul leaves the door wide open to the possibility of some sort of "out of the body experience" but...... the idea of our planning even before our birth to be involved in certain events......... can be a concept that is profoundly offensive to many of us!


https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/2co/12/1/s_1090001

What Dr. Atwater reports about some sort of plan being in place............ previous to the deaths of those 3000 Americans..... does seem to fit with a question posed by the disciples of Rabbi Yeshua - Jesus to their teacher!

John 9:2

Is it possible for somebody to sin......... BEFORE THEY ARE EVEN BORN?????????

 

If you believe scripture that all men are born sinners and also believe that life begins at conception and not birth, I do not see how you could not believe that children are sinners before they were even born.

 

when they died, many saw the light, the light of rebirth, it attracts you like a moth to a flame

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Yes....... and I have to admit that I am glad that I got into some research in parapsychology that makes it challenging for me to easily fit in in an Orthodox Christian church!

I am hopeful that the Dr. Ian Stevenson and Helen Wambach Ph. D. research will soon be taken more seriously....... ......and that Christianity will become somewhat less adversarial toward the eastern religions so that we can use parapsychology to address racial tensions????!

I suspect that Orthodox Christianity has defined "The Soul" in far too narrow a manner..................we Christians could soon see that the Dr. Ian Stevenson and Helen Wambach Ph. D. research is actually replicable, verifiable anecdotal evidence that seems to indicate some sort of "soul" that survives death......... which I would think would also be an indicator of the Resurrection of the Dead which is perhaps the number one doctrine taught in the Christian scriptures............

Besides......... this information could be extremely useful in helping us to look at some of our worst conflicts in a different way?!

http://www.politicalforum.com/race-...head-past-life-regression-under-hypnosis.html
What is that white guy doin in my head? (Past life regression under hypnosis).

I read both of Helen Wambach Ph. D.'s books back in the '90's and I am convinced that they have the potential to transform race relations.

Well over sixty percent of Dr. Wambach's volunteers were women.... but almost exactly fifty percent of past lives viewed/ perceived.....were of men!

White people see themselves as Black and Japanese and Chinese and Aboriginal in past lives. Roughly ninety percent of past lives viewed would be described as "poor" which is almost certainly not what would happen if people were simply remembering scenes from movies that they viewed as a child or teenager.

http://www.carolmoore.net/articles/helenwambach.html

 

By rebirth do you mainly mean something along the line of reincarnation?

Or do you think that one part of each soul could go into a heaven.... while another part of our soul.... might become part of a newborn?

One of the phenomena that caused me to rethink how my old church thought that reincarnation and Christianity could not fit together..... was that of child prodigies!

http://www.near-death.com/reincarnation/research/ian-stevenson.html
Dr. Ian Stevenson's Reincarnation Research

 

On that I probably agree with you except I suspect humans have more generally defined it in a very humanist way. As for past lives, I see no utility in knowing anything about them even if they do exist. Just seems like they would be used as scapegoats for present life failings and challenges.

 

reincarnation.... you either re-enter the cycle of life and death or you escape it and reach enlightenment

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Some hypnotherapists report that by hypnotizing a person with an addiction to food........ back in time several centuries to a lifetime where they may have starved to death........ they seem to be able to assist their patient to have a massive improvement in how they think and feel and use food.

 

A this time I am thinking that one part of our soul..... .actually continues on in a paradise with family and friends and deceased pets but....... another part of our "over soul" is able to come back again and give gifts to the people involved in ushering in a new and better age.

I have good reason to believe that the soul of Miss Anne Frank is in a genuine paradise - heaven but....... another part of Miss Frank is back here again and has played a role in Ms. Barbro Karlen being a widely published Swedish literary prodigy by twelve years of age.


http://www.iisis.net/index.php?page=semkiw-anne-frank-barbro-karlen-reincarnation-past-life

 

At this time I don't see evidence of any kind that there is such a thing as a soul.

There certainly is no scientific evidence that a soul exists or that a soul would be required as part of any human function.

 

Okay but addressing issues in their present life past seems to be more practical. The problem with the theory is simple math. There are more people alive today than there were for a huge chunk of human history combined. If we all have past lives, then apparently many of us would be splintered from the same soul, for lack of a better word. That would suggest that each generation is a watered down version of humans from the prior generation. Surely Baby Boomers think they are superior to anyone born after them, but I doubt they would confess that they are inferior to cave people.

 

Well perhaps since the current crop of religeous fruit loops believe that life begins at conception perhaps it is all the unborn being reincarnated.
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They would still be reborn from someone else and still a watered down human comparatively speaking.

 

There is this concept of the Original Sin.

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Oh yea of little faith - you just pizzed off God.

 

Being able to produce out of the body experiences under relatively controlled conditions is more than a little bit interesting.

http://www.near-death.com/experiences/triggers/gravity.html

The Trigger of Extreme Gravity: Dr. James Winnery's NDE Research


By Kevin Williams

 

Yes..... near death experiencer Aurora Ray Salome ..... stated that there are 14 Elohim....... 7 male and 7 female........ she stated that all human souls can be traced back to one of these 14 original souls.

She associated them with the 7 spirits of G-d!

Her assertion sure puts a whole new spin on....."Gen 1:26
¶
And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

.So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them....."

 

Yes, when the brain is oxygen deprived it loses some to all of its ability to function and thus people perceive strange effects of that. When people "die" (or come close to it) it's not uncommon for them to be oxygen deprived.

Extreme acceleration prevents normal blood flow, so that's one way of depriving the brain of oxygen.

Centrifuges use centripetal force to simulate accelerations that pilots and others experience. Saying that is gravity is nonsense. The issue for pilots has to do with centripetal forces that are far in excess of earth's gravity, resulting from the airplane turning.

Again, in flight we use the force of gravity on earth's surface as a measure of other forces. So, we say a pilot experienced, say, 5g - meaning 5 times the force of gravity.

But, that does NOT mean the force the pilot experienced had anything to do with gravity - it didn't. Think about it. Gravity is an attribute of mass. A pilot flying around the sky does NOT change the mass of anything.


Back to the point: suggesting that anything he did has to do with the afterlife is nonsense. It has to do with what happens to the brain when it is deprived of oxygen.

 

That is a phenomenal reply but.......... isn't it kind of amazing that Helen Wambach Ph. D. began a study back in 1965 in which she regressed 1088 volunteers about 4000 years while they were hypnotized.

Ninety percent of her volunteers could be hypnotized and perceive impressions of what appeared to be "past lives". Over sixty percent of volunteers were women.

Dr. Wambach asked these people very simple questions such as......… look at your feet..... describe your feet....... to get an idea of what racial and ethnic group they perceived themselves as being during that lifetime.

She asked them to visualize themselves at a meal...… what are they eating..... what are they eating with?

She took them to the day of their death.........… in that past life.......... she asked them questions to get at the probable cause of death....... and she asked them to describe what happened as they died..... and sure enough....... they found their consciousness floating outside their bodies........ they reviewed that lifetime with a "being of light who loved them"..... they met deceased relatives and friends........... Isn't it amazing that all 1088 of her volunteers so well described the typical near death experience........ nearly TWO DECADES before Dr. Raymond Moody and Oprah made the term a part of American and world culture????!

Actually..... it is amazing how many ways in which something like a near death experience can be replicated............. and they always have many similar major elements.

Notice especially #23. Hypnosis.

http://www.near-death.com/experiences/triggers.html

Triggers of Near-Death Experiences

 

I don't see any reason for humans NOT to experience oxygen deprivation or other death processes in ways that are similar.

And, some find hypnosis shows cool.

Have you watched Penn and Teller? They put on a good show, too.

 

The question is:

I imagine if there is such a thing as a "soul", the same thing happened that happened to all souls of those who lived and then died at any time in the history of biological entities. If there isn't such a thing as a "soul", then the question is based on a non sequitur.

 

Very logical indeed!

Helen Wambach Ph. D. began a fascinating study back in 1965. Her goal was to disprove the idea of reincarnation.

She hypnotized 1088 volunteers four thousand years and asked them very simple questions when they perceived a "past life."

She asked to look at their feet...... describe their feet........(she was getting at which racial or ethnic group they might be from and.... if they were barefoot then this indicated they were perhaps somewhat poor......)

She asked them to visualize themselves at a meal..... what are they eating??? What are they eating with??? (If they were eating rotten food with their hands this would of course have different implications than if the servants delivered them a meal that they ate with something like silverware?!

She asked them to go to the day of their death..... what caused their death...... what did they see as the died.... and it was amazing how........ twenty years before Dr. Raymond Moody and Oprah tuned the phrase...."Near Death Experience" into a part of American culture...... these volunteers saw the typical NDE with their consciousness floating outside their bodies.....meet deceased relatives, friends and pets..... and review their lives with a being of light....... who seemed to love them unconditionally??????!!!!

 

True, but a scientist has presented a good case that perhaps hypnosis can access a part of our mind or consciousness that can act like a time machine.

http://www.grandunifiedtheory.org.il/Book7/Hypnosis_time _travel_machine.htm
Hypnosis time travel machine.

 

I can't find any interest in this guy's work.

There is plenty of interest in unifying theories, so the absence of interest in this one makes me think it should be totally ignored.

 

If I remember correctly he has had over a million visitors to his website.

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What Dr. P. M. H. Atwater reports does not exactly contradict Jewish beliefs on the afterlife.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzFUXKk2B4I&ebc=ANyPxKqHDErhKBhgYpJGSSWiNw-N9joC6337mkFO3ylzg6HqslIDy0ZQ6RVgdgXYm2Cy2UWI4FcczlTf4y7kElMpbb_RUYEqxA
Rabbi Friedman - The Soul and the Afterlife: Where Do We Go From Here?