Why doesn't socialism work?

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Le Chef, Feb 25, 2020.

  1. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2015
    Messages:
    36,498
    Likes Received:
    14,437
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Again, you have been misinformed, the
    In fact, the Chair of the DNC has admitted that the DP rigs its nomination process.
    The Democratic Party is very anti-Democratic. But I bet you know that. ;-)

    “Before I called Bernie Sanders, I lit a candle in my living room and put on some gospel music. I wanted to center myself for what I knew would be an emotional phone call.

    I had promised Bernie when I took the helm of the Democratic National Committee after the convention that I would get to the bottom of whether Hillary Clinton’s team had ***rigged*** the nomination process, as a cache of emails stolen by Russian hackers and posted online had suggested. I’d had my suspicions…”
    POLITICO, Inside Hillary Clinton’s Secret Takeover of the DNC, When I was asked to run the Democratic Party after the Russians hacked our emails, I stumbled onto a shocking truth about the Clinton campaign., By DONNA BRAZILE November 02, 2017. (*** mine)
    https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/11/02/clinton-brazile-hacks-2016-215774
     
  2. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2015
    Messages:
    36,498
    Likes Received:
    14,437
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You are partially correct about Fox News. It is the only MSM network that does offer some positive coverage, but many of its programs and pundits are very critical of Trump.

    "Fair and Balanced". :)
     
  3. hellofromwarsaw

    hellofromwarsaw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2014
    Messages:
    3,265
    Likes Received:
    393
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Not a Republican...
     
  4. hellofromwarsaw

    hellofromwarsaw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2014
    Messages:
    3,265
    Likes Received:
    393
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Fox noise is a disgraceful propaganda outlet especially in primetime. And they appear to run the ridiculous orange clown. Without Rupert Murdoch media the world would be a better place. Ditto for Rush Limbaugh and all the other radio demagogues.... The more you listen to Fox and Rush, the less you know.
     
  5. hellofromwarsaw

    hellofromwarsaw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2014
    Messages:
    3,265
    Likes Received:
    393
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Blah blah blah. Yes yes the Democrats had super delegates blah blah blah. And they would have voted for Bernie if he had won the primaries. He did not. Hillary helped to the DNC with money blah blah blah. The DNC is not a conspiracy, it is a fairly powerless organization. Cut the crap. 60% of political coverage was about emails in 2016. All garbage powerless staffers at the DNC babbling about nothing.... Sorry, conspiracy nut jobs....
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2020
  6. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2010
    Messages:
    109,481
    Likes Received:
    19,642
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    It is not a matter of simply who is President, is that really the dept of your ability to analysis history? With Republicans in charge we have FULL employment

    Really? Prove the federal tax burden shifted more to the middle class.

    It's a result of the growing global economy and rising standards of living. But do explain why you think the income gains of the least successful should keep pace with the income gains of the most successful.

    Of course profits do not go to workers, workers are an expense profits come AFTER employees are paid. If an employee wants a share of the profits then invest in the company and also share in the losses.

    It was a result of proposition 13 and a voter rebellion against the huge tax increases the state and local governments were passing.

    And your point being what that you want to satisfy your envy of successful people by taxing away the money they earn?

    Can you show me a repected economic book that says socialism is defined as "people want it"?
     
    Ddyad likes this.
  7. hellofromwarsaw

    hellofromwarsaw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2014
    Messages:
    3,265
    Likes Received:
    393
    Trophy Points:
    83
    What do you think collective production means or regulated by the community? They also mean that socialism is democratic. So obviously not communism or Nazism like Rupert Murdoch wants you to think....
     
  8. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2010
    Messages:
    109,481
    Likes Received:
    19,642
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Socialism democratic.................ROFLMAO. Tell that to Venezuela, Cuba, NK. The only socialist in a socialist country are the poor people who have to suffer under it, NOT the Government leaders and employees.
     
    Ddyad likes this.
  9. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2015
    Messages:
    36,498
    Likes Received:
    14,437
    Trophy Points:
    113
    There you go again - resorting to ad hominem personal attacks.
    You should consider a reexamination of your positions and your sources of information.
     
  10. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2010
    Messages:
    109,481
    Likes Received:
    19,642
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    And BTW will you please address what I posted and answer the questions I asked you and provide the proof of your assertions?
     
    Ddyad likes this.
  11. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2015
    Messages:
    36,498
    Likes Received:
    14,437
    Trophy Points:
    113
    >>


    Yet another groundless and so ineffective election cycle smear directed against your political opposition.
    Virtually everyone knows that Fox News, as opposed to the rest of the MSM is "Fair and Balanced". And that probably includes you. ;-)
    OTOH, Rush Limbaugh does not even pretend to be fair or balances. Rush is just proven "right 99+% of the time".

    That's why I usually cite LW or MSM sources to enhance your forum pleasure. You should thank me. :)
     
  12. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2015
    Messages:
    36,498
    Likes Received:
    14,437
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Nazism = National Socialism.
    The NSDAP gained power through the democratic process to the lasting shame of the German people including the many "socialist" members of the KPD and SPD who voted for the NSDAP when the chips were down in 1932/33.
     
  13. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2012
    Messages:
    37,936
    Likes Received:
    7,949
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It's rarely the president that controls domestic policy rather it is congress which holds the purse strings and therefore usually controls domestic policy this is largely why presidents usually look to foreign policy to establish a legacy.
     
  14. ImNotOliver

    ImNotOliver Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2014
    Messages:
    11,721
    Likes Received:
    3,990
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The government, and the country, is run by the executive branch. Pretty much every government worker you encounter, is ultimately under the control of the executive branch. When you get arrested and sent to jail, the police, the prosecutor, and jailer are all under the authority of the executive branch. They use the rules or laws set out by the legislative branch and the judicial branch decides who prevails.
    If the the tax rate of the wealthy is reduced substantially as it was under Reagan, Bush, and Trump, the wealthy pay a smaller portion of the total tax bill. And since everything has to average out to 100%, if one groups portion goes down, another goes up. It isn't that the middle class pays more, it is that they get less. Government always has to pay for critical services which means as the tax revenue from the wealthy shrinks, other things, like school funding and road repair tend to get underfunded. The middle class depends more on public schools and good roads than do the wealthy. The wealthy pay less in taxes, the schools get worse, and the infrastructure deteriorates. Notice the connection.
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2020
  15. hellofromwarsaw

    hellofromwarsaw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2014
    Messages:
    3,265
    Likes Received:
    393
    Trophy Points:
    83
    You are talking about communism with Cuba China and North Korea not socialism. Venezuela is still a democracy but up against total mainly GOP covert action and sanctions.
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2020
  16. hellofromwarsaw

    hellofromwarsaw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2014
    Messages:
    3,265
    Likes Received:
    393
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Actually Hindenburg appointed Hitler Chancellor after the Nazis won 37%. Nazis are not socialist it is pure propaganda what you seem to love.... Socialists never voted for Hitler anywhere in Germany. They hated each other and socialists were the first to go to the camps...
     
  17. hellofromwarsaw

    hellofromwarsaw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2014
    Messages:
    3,265
    Likes Received:
    393
    Trophy Points:
    83
    We've had crappy GOP domestic policy since Reagan. Reconciliation means Republicans only need 51 votes in the senate pass cuts in taxes for the rich and cuts and services for everyone else. But Democrats need 60 votes for reform. Quite the scam.
     
  18. hellofromwarsaw

    hellofromwarsaw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2014
    Messages:
    3,265
    Likes Received:
    393
    Trophy Points:
    83
    There is not a single TV channel that agrees with Fox noise anywhere in the world. And the only newspapers that agree with Fox noise and Trump now are owned by Rupert Murdoch. And you think that is real news. Poor America.
     
  19. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2015
    Messages:
    36,498
    Likes Received:
    14,437
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The NSDAP was by far the largest party in Germany and was permitted to form a government. That is how parliamentary democracy works. The Nazis rose to power through the democratic process.

    Some on the left deny how attracted many left radicals were to Fascism and Nazism during the 1930s, but the historical record is very clear.

    "Between his assumption of power in 1933 and the Soviet-Nazi Pact of 1939, Germany and the Soviet Union were, or pretended to be, on the worst of possible terms. They assailed each other with abusive material stressing the ideological incompatibility of Communism and National Socialism, while studiously ignoring the obvious similarities between the two systems...." Ronald Hingley, "Joseph Stalin" p. 292.

    Most socialists were not as committed to racialism as the Nazis.
    Other than that what are the differences that you find especially significant?
     
  20. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2010
    Messages:
    109,481
    Likes Received:
    19,642
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I'm talking their socialistic economies and yea those elections in Venezuela are sure democratic.................geeeezzzz you defend the government and economy of Venezuela which used to be one of the most properous latin countries and in the world when it WAS capitalistic and people did have political rights and there were fair elections?

    A country with some of the largest oil reserves in the world

    No Gasoline in Venezuela
    Refineries are kaput and imports are too costly. The economy risks a standstill.

    Yet Venezuelans now face a new existential threat: a fuel shortage. As the crisis unfolds it is squeezing the supply of transportation, which in turn is making it increasingly difficult to produce and distribute food and potable water, and to manage waste disposal.


    Many more Venezuelans may die in the next few months from the spread of other diseases, untreated chronic illnesses, injuries or malnutrition caused by extreme gasoline shortages.


    Venezuela’s capacity to produce oil and petrochemicals began its long decline not long after Hugo Chávez purged the state-owned oil company PdVSA of about half its skilled workforce in 2002-03. In the years that followed he replaced those employees with political loyalists and added more as he expanded the company’s mission to include social causes. One important milestone was a 2012 explosion at the Amuay Refinery on the Paraguaná peninsula. The regime blamed the disaster on sabotage but a report commissioned by the opposition pointed to a propane leak caused by poor maintenance.

    The Paraguaná Refinery Complex—which also includes the Cardón Refinery—and other refineries around the country once produced more than 510,000 barrels a day of gasoline and diesel. That was enough to meet domestic demand and to sell abroad. Amuay was partly repaired after the big fire, but the supply of high-octane gasoline declined 50%. Today neither Amuay nor any other Venezuelan refinery is operating....

    ...The Maduro regime is broke—not counting drug-trafficking profits—but it continues to ship diesel to Cuba and maintains a tradition of retailing gasoline for pennies. Now a nation accustomed to cheap, plentiful fuel is paralyzed. People who own cars can’t fill up. Propane isn’t delivered in most places anymore, leaving Venezuelans without cooking fuel. Ambulances can’t answer calls. Farmers can’t run machinery or get crops to market.

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/no-gasoline-in-venezuela-11586111864

    Yea government control of industry, socialist polices as oppose to freedom and liberty and capitalism and the free market is just what we need. How's that toilet paper supply in Venezuela doing? You want to live there or here?
     
    Ddyad likes this.
  21. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2010
    Messages:
    109,481
    Likes Received:
    19,642
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Yet they are the most and accurate news sources out there. You and the rest of the world just doesn't like the fact they engage in simple dismissals of views you do not agree with.
     
    Ddyad likes this.
  22. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2015
    Messages:
    36,498
    Likes Received:
    14,437
    Trophy Points:
    113
    More unsupported nonsense.
     
  23. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2010
    Messages:
    109,481
    Likes Received:
    19,642
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    We've had crappy policy during those periods when the Democrats had majority control of government policy. What time frames are you considering crapping policy especially more crappy than 2007-2015?
     
  24. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2010
    Messages:
    109,481
    Likes Received:
    19,642
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Presidents are not Kings, they do not rule not are in charge of Congress. The run but Congress has to pass legislative policy, do you know what is legislative policy? And no if the police come and arrest me they are NOT in control of the President of the United States is not in charge of them or has anything to do with them what utter nonsense.

    Prove your statement that after the Reagan and Bush43 tax rate cuts the highest earners paid a smaller share of government tax revenue. Is is your assertion, back it up. And stop conflating local and state tax policy with federal tax policy. I don't care what your state does that's up to you and your state. If you think your state should tax more then go for it. At this level we can only be concerned with FEDERAL policies and the FEDERAL government.

    Prove tax revenue from the highest earns has shrunk. And the wealthy depend on an educated populist as anyone else perhaps more so. Tell me do you think the wealthy, the most successful, the rich, the highest earners really want everyone else to be poor, what do they get out of that, what advantage is it to them?
     
    garyd likes this.
  25. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2017
    Messages:
    19,894
    Likes Received:
    5,294
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    They let the crooks run loose.

    91205961-FA23-498E-A3A2-EADBF9D528FE.gif
    When are you talking about?
    Fannie and Freddie weren't the cause of the problem.
     

Share This Page