If killing your baby was acceptable, would more women do it?

Neither does a person who is asleep. Or a hospital patient who is in a coma.

What about a someone who has passed out from drinking too much alcohol? Should their rights be denied too? It will take at least 24 hours before they have the capability to claim their rights.

What does "ability" mean exactly? Just wait 3 years and the fetus will be able to speak up for himself.


Looks like pro-aborts will try to come up with any excuse possible to kill their babies and become un-pregnant again (at least until the next time they get themselves knocked up)

 

There is a dramatic difference between someone who has claimed rights by the default applied to every living person and a fetus which has never done so. Once the child is a separate and viable entity it is automatically endowed with the rights in question based on societal agreement.

- - - Updated - - -

There is a dramatic difference between someone who has claimed rights by the default applied to every living person and a fetus which has never done so. Once the child is a separate and viable entity it is automatically endowed with the rights in question based on societal agreement.

 

Then can it be said if society agrees not to endow you with rights, you don't have them? I think we are treading on dangerous territory. The Nazis, by societal agreement, implemented forms of control that horrify everyone.

 

You are advocating for society to agree to deprive women of rights. Is that dangerous territory? (YES) Society has agreed to do that in the past, and found enforcing it impossible.

 

No I am not. Please quote me saying that society can deprive anyone of rights. I'm actually implying the opposite. Read for content. Don't add to my posts what isn't there.

 

I was under the impression we were discussing realities rather than hypotheticals...and by resorting to Nazi analogy the discussion becomes tainted as well. Or rights are indeed a part of the societal contract created by a consensus which pretty much became the United States of America. Each society does so in one way or another. Women do not hold the same rights in Saudi Arabia that they do here...as society dictates for them. Here we have developed new rights for women over time as we have for other members of this society.
These changes in rights are generally brought about through active and popular protest eventually swaying the society to adapt as needed. Until such time as these rights are claimed or in some way cried out for they do not exist within said society. As the fetus is incapable of even understanding the concept, let alone demanding these rights it does not have them, yet upon separation from the mother, it does indeed gain rights within society as it becomes an individual person we have deemed protected.

 

If killing Republicans were acceptable, would educated people do it? No - only in reactionary circles could such drivel be put forward as okay by anyone. Once a republican is born and becomes a (however inadequate) human being, it has rights, like everyone else, but not the right to enslave women and turn them into brood mares, obviously.

 

No this shows that I won't cave in...does not matter who they are. I call it as I see it...especially about the Word. No one especially women who have had abortions should believe that their sin is unforgivable...because that is not true. The problem with your side....you just agree with everything anyone claims. Your side is in conflict with each other you just won't call each other out. LIB might say a lot that is good....but what he is saying about scripture is just wrong IMO.

 

You don't agree with LibHATER...uh, that's conflict...duh.

If abortion is a sin and you committed it and you believe in forgiveness...why don't you forgive yourself???

 

LOLO.....the woman is the one who spreads her legs....no one forces her to do that. (excluding rape) So she takes the risk....it is her body right? If anyone enslaves themselves its the woman. No one would have a child unless the didn't willingly consent to sex.

 

You obviously have selective reading skills...because I have only because God has. You can't get this....because your a pagan and don't know scripture. Its like double jeopardy. You can't be tried for the same thing twice. God forgave me when I repented. The sin is GONE....FORGOTTEN. I only use my sin to witness to others about Gods love and of course the truth about what abortion can do....and more importantly what God can do.

 

BRILLIANT observation! So it's sex that makes babies! Who'd a thunk!


Now, could you explain what that has to do with a woman deciding to have an abortion?

I'll answer for you: Nothing.

 

Oh yes...of course in how many states is prostitution legal grannie?

And society doesn't infringe on peoples bodily rights? LOL

 

It has everything to do with abortion. Every woman who has one had to spread her legs at least twice.

 

Is it FORGOTTEN or not.?..make up your mind!!

You may be forgiven but that sure didn't make you happy......think I'll stay a "pagan" LOL....

 

So does a woman who owns her body....have the right to a late term abortion....on demand for any reason, any time?

 

The ugly truth emerges once again....You want to use pregnancy/childbirth to punish women for choosing sex. You want to create a fear of pregnancy to keep women from choosing sex. It's not really the value of the fetus that drives you, it's the fear that women have the freedom to choose to have sex with whomever they choose whenever they choose without the fear of pregnancy.

 

You are right Anders. And if what they said was true....that unborns can't speak out.....that theory should also apply to newborns...they can't speak up. In fact a one year old can't either. In fact neither one would live without intervention by someone feeding and taking care of them.

 

Currently, I believe one. Isn't that a law that applies equally to men and women?

Society is justified in infringing upon people's bodily rights in matters that affect society in a detrimental manner, i.e. causing disorder in society. You have never shown in any way that abortion is detrimental to society.

 

According to our laws (which often define our rights in detail), no she does not. R v W is a wonderful example of my point.

 

Pregnancy should be a blessing...children are. Rape is a violent act....but the child conceived is still a child whose life is a blessing. You stand with the position that is hideously ugly. You condone the slaughter...you like it...because it gives women power. And power is the aphrodisiac for you people. The power to kill a helpless unborn child in the womb...that is what you condone, that is what you like....that is what makes you what you are....a pro-abort...defending the killing of unborn children. The only laws you want legal give permission to kill.
There should be no fear of pregnancy. You are the one who says its basically vile...and dangerous. You think its basically an abnormal physical process that women should be spared from doing. What boggles my mind is the fact you might be a grandmother. LOL The fact that you of all people would have consented to such a dangerous...and vile process of life, pregnancy. You must have been devestated for nine months, right?

I am all for sex...it feels wonderful...its great. But with anything that feels good comes risks. Why do people drink alcohol? Why do they eat food? Why do they smoke? Why do they shop? BECAUSE IT FEELS GOOD. But if you drink too much and get behind the wheel of a car...you could kill someone. If you eat to much you could get sick or fat. And that isn't healthy. If you smoke....tastes good, smells good....but its addicting...and unhealthy. If you shop uncontrollably...you could create debt you can't possibly pay off. But boy shopping feels good doesn't it. And sex....sure feels good...but it can create a situation that is not ideal if someone can't be responsible for the action.

This is what you don't get.

 

I am not talking about the present laws. Do you think they are wrong? Should women because they own the right to their bodies...be allowed late term abortions for any reason...any time.

 

I see, you wish to turn debate into opinion comparison.....very well.

I am a male, and do not feel qualified to judge a situation I am physically incapable of experiencing or comprehending due to my gender. Just as I would prefer a woman not decide who gets a vasectomy, as it does not concern her beyond the personal effects.
Personally, I would not allow an abortion of my child at any point unless needed to prevent damage to my wife.

 

Then if society says abortion should be illegal you would be ok with that?

Abortion affects society...

Do you think if all women banned together and said...ok...for ten years we are going to kill all unborns that are male.......that would be ok? Would that affect society?
Do you think if all women banned together and said....ok...for ten years we are going to kill all unborns who have the gay gene....would that be ok?


A society that allows abortion has a certain mindset. The topic of abortion just doesn't seem to go away. AFter 40 years legal....it is without a doubt probably the biggest issue still being debated today. Why is this? If everyone were pro-choice...like you say is true...then why the debate? What is legal in society affects the moral conscious of the nation. How a society looks at life affects everything about it. What is supposed to be a private issue...isn't really private...especially when there are people who are trying to force others to perform them. A nurse working for a hospital that does abortion...what happens if she refuses based on her sense of morality? A pharmacist...dispensing abortion pills...being forced to do so by our government...if it goes against his conscience....Abortion affects people...taxpayer monies tied into grants going to abortion clinics. This is not just a private matter....especially if your the father of the child being aborted...if you want that child.

Our laws legislate morality. What is so bad about child porn? Why are their laws against it? Why were their sodomy laws? Prostitution laws? Why shouldnt a woman be allowed to make money if she sleeps around? How is this bad for society?

Our laws define who we are and they speak to our morality.

- - - Updated - - -

You are avoiding the question. if what you say is true...then leave the abortion threads.

So your saying all abortion is wrong unless it saves the womans life?

 

Ive read most of the last two pages and have a question.

One post you posted church was abortion is a sin that will never be forgotten BUT, You were forgiven because thats how powerful god is....ok....sure..

So would everyone who have had an abortion just have to turn to christ and the all father (God, Odin, Whomever) and ask for forgiveness and be forgiven such as the son and all father has forgiven you (Remember Jesus Christ is the son not god)

Also. If a Women does own herself (As I asked prior that you would not answer) Why wouldnt she have the choice to choose? Why would you want to have that choice taken? You who had the choice to have the abortion and took it many moons ago want to take that right from someone? You who chose to have the abortion for whatever reason YOU found that was a good one want to take peoples choice?

Now a question and this might be wronge because i am trying to remember from when I would read the bible.

Was there not in the scripter (for those who preach but dont know, The bible) Say what laws man makes shall also be gods laws. (Like I said could be wronge) but something like this, Will search after I post this.

So if abortion is legal and god accepts our laws, should religious people Trully have anything against it since it is backed by god?

Found this You might be in trouble mouse.