Florida now has America's lowest COVID rate. Does Ron DeSantis deserve credit?

https://brownstone.org/articles/22-...-vaccine-efficacy-for-the-general-population/

 

By now even you should know that both vaccinated and unvaccinated can carry the virus, so your article is irrelevant. Heck, you could have both natural immunity and vaccine and still carry the virus, because neither create a virus proof bubble around your body. The vaccine keeps people from getting seriously sick and/or dying from it, but if you dont see any benefit in you or others surviving then so be it.

 

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/hea...highest-rate-of-covid-19-infections-1.4707344


Waterford city has one of the Ireland’s highest rates of vaccination against Covid-19, but one of its electoral areas has emerged as the place with the highest rate of Covid-19 infection in the State.


The city’s south electoral area has a 14-day incidence rate of 1,486 cases per 100,000 of the population, three times the national average which stands at 493 infections per 100,000 people.


The adjacent electoral area of Tramore-Waterford City West has a 14-day rate of 1,121 per 100,000, according to the latest weekly figures published by the Health Service Executive’s Health Protection Surveillance Centre.


Waterford has the highest rate of vaccination in the country with 99.7 per cent of adults over the age of 18 (as registered in the last census) fully vaccinated. The county has gone from having one of the lowest rates of Covid-19 infection in Ireland to one of the highest.

 

Let’s try this. Can you provide any current evidence natural immunity lasts “about six months”? You make this claim a lot but the only source you can cite is some doctor you haven’t supplied any information about.

 

From the same town for the same data in your link
"Although 70 per cent of those in intensive care are not fully vaccinated, t..."
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/hea...rk-for-first-time-since-early-march-1.4697068

Hence if 99.7% are fully vaccinated (that figure of yours is wrong too), it's actually 92% which is the figure I will use, then that means that the unvaccinated and one dose are 27 times more likely to be in intensive care than the fully vaccinated

 

Why would not allowing any containment measures be some sort of merit? Sure, everywhere in the world Delta has surged for a couple of months, then has faded; did you all expect Florida to be any different??? Why would it be? The reasons for that are biological, not political, given that it happened around the world in all kinds of environment, all kinds of administrations, and all kinds of political systems. The virus couldn't care less if the governor is R or D.

What matters is to contain it as best as possible until it fades, so that it kills and maims fewer people. So, if you allow it to roam free and it infects a bunch of people then kills a bunch of people (and damages the organs of a bunch of survivors), eventually it will go away, but the dead people won't be alive anymore, and the ones with permanent organ damage won't ever recover. Everywhere where the stupid idea of going for herd immunity and no containment measures was exercised, the end result was a bigger death toll and a bigger pool of people with organ damage. Is herd immunity possible for this virus? Probably not, given its ability to reinfect and to break through vaccination. But even if some degree of it does happen, the price to pay for allowing the virus to roam free is always very steep.

DeSantis is a full-blown moron and he remains a moron despite the virus having had its full cycle in Florida. If the moron known as DeSantis weren't an evil jerk who values more his political ambitions than the lives (and the vital organs) of his constituents, the damage in Florida would have been less.

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It's interesting how conservatives have crucified New York because of its initial surge (by the way, at a time when we had no clue about how to treat the virus, had no vaccines, had no antivirals, had not figured out that dexamethasone helps, had not figured out that early ventilation was a mistake; so no wonder the very first state to be hit - due to its high number of tourists who seeded the virus there - had a high death rate at first) and have dismissed the data when New York had good numbers after the onslaught was over, but now, in Florida, they claim the opposite idea. Hypocrisy at its best.

For conservatives, it works like this: all blue states are evil and whatever negative happens there is the fault of the Democrats, and whatever positive happens there is to be dismissed as fake news or some sort of coincidence. All red states are heavenly paradises and whatever negative happens there is never the fault of the Republicans or it's fake news, and whatever positive happens there is the Republicans' merit. Amazingly simplistic black-and-white thinking.

I'd say that liberals are guilty of the same, the other way around.

Partisans from each party are sort of brainwashed sheep that are ready to believe in anything their handlers throw at them as the latest talking points.

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So who is right? Usually, centrists/moderates like me who are capable of analyses that are not just black-and-white, and are significantly less influenced by partisan pundits. People like me value fact and real science more than political talking points, junk science, and conspiracy theories, and abhor both parties (yes, just like I'm criticizing the moron known as DeSantis, I've extensively criticized the moron known as Andrew Cuomo too). People like me dislike both the left wing extremists and the right wing extremists, and dislike the hypocrisy that both sides practice.

So, do you want some rational analyses? Listen to people like me.

Am I being arrogant? No, centrists'/moderates' ability to think in gray terms rather than black-and-white is factual, and one of the very reasons for the person so equipped, to adopt a centrist political identity.

 

Infection becomes irrelevant if you have been vaccinated, or have natural immunity, because you won't even notice it. I thought everyone knew that.

 

Must be why hospitalized vaccinated cases are ticking upward.

 

I just showed you that in Waterford unvaccinated and one dose are 27 times more likely to be in intensive care than the fully vaccinated

No doubt you will run away from this like you have done all the time to repeat your claims in other threads

 

No. Vaccination only decreases your risk of long term effects like myocarditis, other organ damage and brain/neurological damage by 50% in breakthrough infections. There is also risk of damage in reinfections as well.

Why do you think all those hospitalized vaccinated and reinfected Covid patients are hospitalized?

There is risk associated with every infection. The risk is greatly reduced with breakthrough and reinfections in most people. But people still get ill, go to the hospital and die. Lots of people.

 

Died from other causes??????

You surely don’t understand the ICD-10 Codes for Covid19......quite simple if you have a brain.

For a better understanding; Last year, the 4th leading cause of death in the U.S was “UNINTENTIONAL INJURIES”........over 150,000 deaths.

Thus, the underlying cause of said over 150,000 deaths, “Unintentional Injuries”, however, ALL DIED from one and/or several complications.

Headline; Collin Powell dies from Covid19 Complications.

NOTE; Collin Powell’s Underlying cause of death; Covid19.

DEFINITION of “Underlying cause of death”

1. The disease or injury that initiated the train of events leading directly to death.

2. The circumstances of the accident or violence that produced the fatal injury.

————

Soooooooooooo simple, however, misunderstood by the below average intelligent people.

 

I’m back!

Are you cheering Florida’s 2,770 per 1M Pop?

If so, you are a sicko......

The Canucks had mandates/lockdowns, and their number of Covid19 deaths per 1M pop; 765......a differential of near 2,000 deaths per 1M pop.

Source; Worldometer

 

In addition to the above;

TRUMP; “Keeping U.S. Covid19 deaths to 100,000 would be a “very good job”

Thus, according to Trump’s analogy, DeSantis certainly hasn’t done a very good job.

The math:

Very good job; U.S.......100,000 deaths/331M = 302 deaths per 1M pop

Florida’s number of Covid19 deaths per 1M Pop; 2,770

Geeeeeeze, it is so easy to ridicule the below average intelligent posters in this forum.

Once again, I’m back!

 

Why would I cheer 0.0028 of Floridians dying?
I do not cheer:
0.0034 Mississippians dying of COVID, or
0.0032 Alabamians, or
0.0032 New Jersian's, or
0.0031 Louisianians, or
0.0029 New Yorkers, or
0.0028 Massachusettsians, or
0.0027 Georgians, or
0.0027 Rhode Islanders, or
0.0027 South Carolinians, or
0.0023 of Americans dying of COVID

Fake News, I am the very picture of robust health.

Average daily deaths under Biden with 80% of the American Adult population either at least partially immunized or enjoying natural immunity, is more than two and half times the rate it was under Trump when NO ONE was immunized.

10/1/21 1,829 average daily dead (7 day average of daily deaths)
10/1/20 - 704 average daily dead (7 day average of daily deaths) under the Orange Miracle.

 

Why don't you give the rate of deaths from Covid for each state over Biden's term?

 

Canada; 28,966 deaths/38.2 million pop = .00076

Florida; .0028

.00076 x 3.8 = .0028

Near 4 times more Covid19 deaths????

Also, the below average intelligent posters/tiny brains in this forum are still ignoring the fact that Florida health does not count non-residential Covid19 deaths, thus, your State’s comparison is misleading.

Google; Florida Health Covid19 Weekly report.....Residential deaths only, however, Florida Health reports both residential and non-residential cases

 

According to Worldometer, Zorro’s favourite Covid19 Data Site;

Total Covid19 Deaths as of Jan 19, 2021; 425,592

Total Covid19 Deaths as of yesterday; 766,157

However, claiming Biden did better is both unfair and politically retarted considering the fact the above average intelligent people know that the vaccines have saved hundreds of thousands of lives. In other words, don’t play Zorro’s political games.

 

I agree but by giving the stats for all states from Jan 20th would indicate the performance of Florida relative to other states

 

A 50% reduction is not negligible. In Medicine, that is a "number needed to treat" (a concept that looks into how many people need to receive a treatment for 1 of them to benefit) of 2 which is extremely favorable. Lots of other medications and treatments in Medicine that are routinely indicated and for which nobody doubts that they are indicated and a great idea, have a "number needed to treat" much, much higher than that.

One needs to also realize that this is a 50% risk reduction of death or organ damage for the ones with breakthrough infections, on top of a risk reduction of 80% already or 4 in 5, because the vaccinated are 5 times less likely to catch the virus to start with (100% risk divided by 5 is 20%, thus 80% reduction). So in reality, it's not "only decreases your risk" by 50%. It's a 50% risk reduction on top of an 80% risk reduction. This means that if you further reduce that remaining 20% risk by 50%, the overall reduction is 90%, which is consistent with several studies of vaccine efficacy in reducing hospitalizations and death. Now you get to a "number needed to treat" of 10 divided by 9, that is, you need to treat 10 to benefit 9, or a NNT of 1.1. Almost no treatments in medicine have a "number needed to treat" as low as this.

By comparison, do you know what the NNT is for one of the most accepted treatments ever developed in medicine, statins designed to lower cholesterol (Lipitor, Zocor, etc.), which are medications that most people of a certain age are taking? Brace for it. The NNT with statins to prevent a heart attack is 60, and to prevent stroke is 268. That is, for these two conditions, the NNT for such an accepted treatment is 54.5 times less favorable than the Covid-19 vaccines for heart attacks, and 243.6 times less favorable for strokes. Impressive, huh? And statins are not devoid of risks either (rhabdomyolysis, liver toxicity).

Still, you don't see hordes of "anti-statins" like you see anti-vaxxers. The doctor writes a prescription for Lipitor for someone, and the person gladly takes it daily.

Finally, something that a lot of people don't seem to realize, is that the population of vaccinated people who get seriously ill and die, is a pre-selected population. It's the people who have failed the vaccination, which in most cases results from their immune system being weak to start with. So, the old and infirm are the ones that tend to fail the vaccination, so they are already a pre-selected population, introducing a sample bias.

Also, as we know from multiple studies, humoral immunity from the mRNA vaccines fades in about 6 months. It can be restored with boosters but not many people have had boosters yet. So, we started vaccination in this country, by the most fragile people. Remember? Other than healthcare workers, we started by vaccinating by age group - the oldest first - and status of living in a long-term facility (nursing homes).

So, the most fragile patients were the ones who got the vaccine first, in December 2020/January 2021, that is, 9 to 10 months ago, way past the useful live of vaccine humoral efficacy. No wonder that now they're getting sick and going to hospitals or dying. If we got to boost them more rapidly, this wouldn't be happening.

So, the vaccines are actually better than the numbers are seeming to indicate, at this time. Looking at it this way, don't you agree?

 

Bottom line; Our freedom to choose killed hundreds of thousands of lives.

I’m a center-right Christian conservative, however, historically/in wartime, freedom to choose AND public safety have contrasted each other. In other words, I’m a common sense center-right conservative.

In wartime??????

Trump; “We are at war against an invisible enemy”

 

That is correct, and is reflect on this, perfectly:



The tragic part is that in making a free choice, a lot of people got misinformed by evil anti-vaxxers and conspiracy theories. Maybe they'd have made a better, free, informed choice if they hadn't been brainwashed with falsehoods.

 

Of course. I never said 50% reduction was negligible. I’m warning people NOT to rely on vaccinations given months ago to protect them from all risks from Covid. I’m trying to get people to realize you can’t just get a couple jabs and assume you’ll be fine today or forever. Other actions still matter.

Same goes for those relying on natural immunity alone. You still face risks from reinfection.

 

Actually, due to different methodologies, we can’t compare Florida’s Health Covid19 Numbers to other States, for example; Florida Health does not report non-residential Covid Coded Deaths.

For your info, Worldometer reports both Florida’s residential/non-residential cases, however, only residential deaths.

AND ironically, the Case Fatality Rate of Florida’s unreported number of non-residential Covid deaths is significantly lower than their residential CFR??????

Who’s considered non-residential in Florida?

Mainly;

Some snowbirds
Short term vacationers/visitors
100,000 + migrant workers
and 700,000 + illegals

Do you understand my question marks?

 

Large country. Small population. Would also like to know if their obesity rate is at all what ours is.

 

I think even if the lower reported Florida figures were used, the stats will still show how badly Florida has done since Jan 20th. When I have time I will produce the death rates figures