Hong Kong! Remember Tiananmen Square!

Discussion in 'Asia' started by Starjet, Jul 29, 2019.

  1. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You keep telling yourself that. Whatever gets you through the night, right?


    As for Democracy, it’s immoral—it subordinates individual rights to majority rule. Therefore, I never talk for democracy, I argue against it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2019
  2. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    My suggestion is based on Chinese troops being sent to Hong Kong to murder the rebellion for liberty.
     
  3. Pycckia

    Pycckia Well-Known Member

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    But overland is faster, and it is the European market to be exploited:

    For over two millennia, technology and politics have shaped trade across the Eurasian supercontinent. The compass and domesticated camels helped the “silk routes” emerge between 200 and 400 CE, and peaceful interactions between the Han and Hellenic empires allowed overland trade to flourish. A major shift occurred in the late fifteenth century, when the invention of large ocean-going vessels and new navigation methods made maritime trade more competitive. Mercantilism and competition among Europe’s colonial powers helped pull commerce to the coastlines. Since then, commerce between Asia and Europe has traveled primarily by sea.1

    Against this historical backdrop, new railway services between China and Europe have emerged rapidly. Just 10 years ago, regular direct freight services from China to Europe did not exist.2 Today, they connect roughly 35 Chinese cities with 34 European cities.3 Rail services are considerably cheaper than air and faster than sea, as Figure 1 illustrates, and could provide a compelling middle option for more goods in the coming years. Rail’s share of cargo by value is already growing, increasing 144 percent during the first half of 2017, as compared to the same period in 2016.4 A study commissioned by the International Union of Railways estimates that China-Europe rail services could double their share of trade by volume over the next decade.5


    https://www.csis.org/analysis/rise-china-europe-railways
     
  4. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Haven’t blamed US, haven’t advocated US invasion. Simply stated, If Chinese enter Hong Kong, I suggest moral thing to do would be to condemn, embargo, and blockade. However, this will never happen, so, to those who value their lives and wealth, get out. Get out now.
     
  5. Concord

    Concord Well-Known Member

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    Look, my point is simply that the central government finds it necessary to spend money inland for political reasons, while the wealthy and middle classes on the coast try to get their money out of the country. Each economic downturn threatens to break the political system.
     
  6. Pycckia

    Pycckia Well-Known Member

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    And my response is that your idea is utterly fantastic. I wonder how you came up with it. But here on PF a poster never will never say how they arrive at theit ideas, so I don't expect to ever know.
     
  7. s002wjh

    s002wjh Well-Known Member

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    lol so what are you talking about if its not about democracy, cause all the thread I see, you are telling Chinese to raise up and overthrown the government. now your saying you are against it. btw I fully support free election free speech etc, I just don't have a self righteous attitude that try to force it upon others.
     
  8. s002wjh

    s002wjh Well-Known Member

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    part is true, however, it is also a fact after 2014 less mainlander goto HK now, which meant less income for tourist industry. they goto macao or elsewhere now. consider HK and Macao both were colonies, yet Macao now have much higher GDP per cap than HK. many HK investment etc etc got hi-jacked by politics. example subway station, the bridge etc.
     
  9. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Reread. I’m urging them to leave, not fight—yeah they have the right to rebel, but not the means, and the West will not come to their defense.

    Get out now!
     
  10. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

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    You are against free people demonstrating against the chinese communist dictatorship?
     
  11. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Only when they employ

    violence.
    Passive resistance Yes.
    Violent resistance No
    Nor disruption of civil order like when L.A. Black folk
    decide to shut down a freeway.


    Remember: Occupy Wall St.
    How do you suppose "they" got that to evaporate so orderly?

    It isn't all by them! :oldman:

    Whether Ferguson, Missouri or Hong Kong,
    Rioters should face military force if they refuse to disperse.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2019
    reedak likes this.
  12. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Oh, the Robespierre school of political thought. Hmmm. Not very moral, is it? Submit or die? Perhaps a little rethink might help.

    Ayn Rand: "Tyranny is any political system (whether absolute monarchy or fascism or communism) that does not recognize individual rights (which necessarily include property rights). The overthrow of a political system by force is justified only when it is directed against tyranny: it is an act of self-defense against those who rule by force. For example, the American Revolution."

    Yaron Brook Show: What Should Be Done About China?

     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2019
  13. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Ayn Rand be wonderful
    except she never contributed to a modern society.




    I know a student of hers while he was in the
    bush serving in Vietnam
    Today, mega, mega rich yet treats his employees
    so very what Ayn Rand preached against.

    What a conundrum when invoking Ayn Rand.



    Hong Kong is China,
    Get Used To It!


    When a State of Riot exist
    whether Ferguson, Missouri or Hong Kong

    Riot Act. Announce anyone who does not
    disperse in "x" time will be confronted militarily.
    Whether China or :flagus:


    Moi :oldman:
    Anti Riot regardless






    Canada-10.gif
     
  14. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Such is the lot of a radical, explaining the obvious to the willing blind.

    "Liberty, she bled, all over the square in Red China
    All over the square in Red China, Liberty, she bled.
    Now we have another Red Square
    Oh, where is America, where?
    Do you understand what I have said?
    Liberty, she bled, all over the square in Red China."

    Hong Kong Citizens! Get out now!

    And never forget those that tried:

    The Dream
    [​IMG]

    The aftermath
    [​IMG]

    I will never forgive nor forget, nor should any moral mind, if it has even just one thin thread of understanding what took place in Tiananmen Square. You see, Liberty, she bled, all over the square in Red China. Liberty, she bled.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2019
  15. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Heaven Is Not A Democracy

    And Democracy Is Not Heaven!


    So many wrongs in the world.
    Who do we react and who do we ignore.

    And Remember the Taltelolco Massacre. 1968

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tlatelolco_massacre
    Following a summer of increasingly large demonstrations in Mexico City protesting the 1968 Mexico City Olympics, armed forces of Mexico opened fire October 2, 1968 on unarmed civilians, killing an undetermined number, likely in the hundreds. It occurred in the Plaza de las Tres Culturas in the Tlatelolco section of Mexico City. The events are considered part of the Mexican Dirty War, when the government used its forces to suppress political opposition. The massacre occurred 10 days before the opening of the 1968 Summer Olympics in Mexico City.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2019
  16. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    And slaughtered souls aren't salves of truisms to assuage guilty consciouses.
     
  17. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Perhaps if we didn't ignore any of it, ever, none of it would ever happen--Pure evil grows from its first tolerance by those that ought to know better.

    If I had been President, I would have pulled out. In 1968 I was a 17-year-old necking with my girl in my car, trusting the world to the adults. Bad decision. But I plead the innocence of youth.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2019
  18. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

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    Independent reports are that the Hong Kong protests have been peaceful
     
  19. s002wjh

    s002wjh Well-Known Member

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    i know people who went through tiannmen square, i myself was there, though i was very young back then. the 1st pic is real the 2nd is fake. the reason there is a tiananmen square back then was most chinese think west was this eden place, but now as more chinese travel around the world, seeing EU/US etc, they dont think that way anymore. what they want is stability and economy. each years there are over millions chinese students study in US/EU, dont you think they have seen tianamen documentary etc, ever wonder why there aren't democracy protest in china now. many people who went through tiananmen square regret it, admit they were naive back then. mainly because ppl didn't know better, the lack of information make them think west is heaven on earth, but as china open up and they know more about west, most chinese just prefer economy benefit over free election. hence the reason CCP so fixated on economy.

    ps tiannmen incident begin due ppl want to get rid of corruption NOT about democracy/liberty. you misinterpret history. They thought if china is democratic country, the corruption will be gone, living standard will be much better etc.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2019
  20. s002wjh

    s002wjh Well-Known Member

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    yea check all the previous post and video i linked. at beginning it was peaceful, now not so much.
     
  21. Steady Pie

    Steady Pie Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    China backs down
    Public opinion in HK becomes positive toward this
    World war

    The 3 ways this can end.
     
  22. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

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    Without knowing the details I wont confirm or deny who is responsible for the violence

    Most of the protestors have been peaceful up to now and thats a credit to the people of Hong Kong
     
  23. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No fourth, China sends in troops to murder the rebels and their revolution?
     
  24. s002wjh

    s002wjh Well-Known Member

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    then just go back few page and check the video, news link i post it. there are pictures and videos. on how HK rush into government central building, block all exist, sack the internal building etc. imagine if anti-american rush into DC capital and do the same things. i support HK peaceful protest, free election, etc. but at some point it become violent and disruptive.
     
  25. s002wjh

    s002wjh Well-Known Member

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    very unlikely. if they do that it could get out of hands. likely they will just wait. in 2014, they wait for 6-9 months till protest run out of steam. the longer the protest goes, the more disruptive to HK economy/stability, more company move to shanhai/singapore/ or other place. the only way HK can have its free election is when chinese mainlander decide they want free election, that wont happen unless chinese economy go down the toilet.
     

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